2017 MLS Week 24 Referee Discussion

Discussion in 'MLS Referee Forum' started by bhooks, Aug 15, 2017.

  1. bhooks

    bhooks Member

    Apr 14, 2015
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    08/16/2017

    Montreal Impact v Chicago Fire
    Stade Saputo (7:30PM ET)
    REF: NIMA SAGHAFI
    AR1: Joe Fletcher
    AR2: Logan Brown
    4TH: Robert Sibiga
    VAR: Silviu Petrescu

    08/18/2017

    Portland Timbers v New York Red Bulls
    Providence Park (7:30PM ET)
    REF: ALLEN CHAPMAN
    AR1: Cameron Blanchard
    AR2: Apolinar Mariscal
    4TH: Daniel Radford
    VAR: Ismail Elfath

    08/19/2017

    Montreal Impact v Real Salt Lake
    State Saputo (7:30PM ET)
    REF: CHRIS PENSO
    AR1: Kathryn Nesbitt
    AR2: Oscar Mitchell-Carvalho
    4TH: Sorin Stoica
    VAR: Hilario Grajeda

    Orlando City v Columbus Crew
    Orlando City Stadium (7:30PM ET)
    REF: JUAN GUZMAN JR
    AR1: Brian Dunn
    AR2: Jeff Muschik
    4TH: Caleb Mendez
    VAR: Matthew Franz

    Chicago Fire v Toronto FC
    Toyota Park (8:00PM ET)
    REF: JAIR MARRUFO
    AR1: Jose Da Silva
    AR2: Danny Thornberry
    4TH: Jose Carlos Rivero
    VAR: Ramy Touchan

    Sporting Kansas City v FC Dallas
    Children’s Mercy Park (8:30PM ET)
    REF: ARMANDO VILLARREAL
    AR1: Peter Manikowski
    AR2: Andrew Bigelow
    4TH: Mark Kadlecik
    VAR: Robert Sibiga

    Colorado Rapids v D.C. United
    Dick’s Sporting Goods Park (9:00PM ET)
    REF: ALEX CHILOWICZ
    AR1: Frank Anderson
    AR2: Jason White
    4TH: Baldomero Toledo
    VAR: Jon Freemon

    Vancouver Whitecaps v Houston Dynamo
    BC Place (10:00PM ET)
    REF: DREW FISCHER
    AR1: Michael Kampmeinert
    AR2: Canada CSA
    4TH: Daniel Radford
    VAR: Allen Chapman

    San Jose Earthquakes v Philadelphia Union
    Avaya Stadium (10:30PM ET)
    REF: TED UNKEL
    AR1: Mike Rottersman
    AR2: Jeffrey Hosking
    4TH: Younes Marrakchi
    VAR: Kevin Stott

    08/20/2017

    New York City v New England Revolution
    Yankee Stadium (6:00PM ET)
    REF: MARK GEIGER
    AR1: Matthew Nelson
    AR2: Claudiu Badea
    4TH: Jorge Gonzalez
    VAR: Dave Gantar

    Seattle Sounders v Minnesota United
    CenturyLink Field (9:30PM ET)
    REF: ISMAIL ELFATH
    AR1: Ian Anderson
    AR2: Eric Boria
    4TH: Daniel Radford
    VAR: Drew Fischer

    http://proreferees.com/2017/08/15/mls-assignments-week-24/
     
  2. bothways

    bothways Member

    Jun 27, 2009
    as the elton john song goes, daniel is travelling tonight on a plane!
    he has 3 4ths, back to back to back
     
    MassachusettsRef repped this.
  3. MassachusettsRef

    MassachusettsRef Moderator
    Staff Member

    Apr 30, 2001
    Washington, DC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    The unnamed CSA AR in Vancouver likely means it's a trial slot for someone new. Canadian officials who are part of PRO have USGO log-ins, so their names get pulled easily when the weekly assignments gets published. Non-PRO CSA officials show up like the one listed here.

    There should be another AR trial slot coming up in early September. PRO is starting to test some people for promotion but as we talked about last week and we're seeing with Radford's work this weekend, an argument can definitely be made that they're not doing it quickly enough.
     
  4. seattlebeach

    seattlebeach Member

    AFC Richmond
    May 11, 2015
    Not Seattle, Not Beach
    Wondering if this is Daniel Radford's first visit to Seattle since the Sounders-Timbers Open Cup experience.
     
  5. MassachusettsRef

    MassachusettsRef Moderator
    Staff Member

    Apr 30, 2001
    Washington, DC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    It is, at least to referee the Sounders' MLS team. In fact, his 4th on 7/29 in LA was the first time he's seen them at all since that match.
     
  6. jdmahoney

    jdmahoney Member

    Feb 28, 2017
    Plymouth, MN
    Club:
    Chelsea FC
    Chilowicz received his first MLS center this week, Colorado vs. DC. We'll see how he does. He has a very experienced supporting cast to help him out.
     
  7. ManiacalClown

    ManiacalClown Member+

    Jun 27, 2003
    South Jersey
    Club:
    Chicago Fire
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Basically, if someone has been around as a 4th for a long while without a whistle, don't bet on them getting a game. Guys like Vazquez and Chilowicz are clearly the "development group" these days. The exception seemed to be Mariscal last year, and that resulted in PRO choosing to not back up his decisions. Guys like Radford and Jallow clearly don't have a chance, which is a shame, really.
     
  8. ManiacalClown

    ManiacalClown Member+

    Jun 27, 2003
    South Jersey
    Club:
    Chicago Fire
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Nothing against the guys moving up. No one at this level is a bad referee or undeserving of the opportunity. Just pointing out the obvious: PRO never had any intention of promoting that original class of fourth officials.
     
  9. oldmanreferee

    oldmanreferee Member

    Dec 28, 2005
    Mountain View, ca
    agree with you on the original class of 4th.
    They are like the kids in my neighborhood. one of the kids is all time pitcher and one is all time kicker for his bother who has a bad knee.
     
  10. MassachusettsRef

    MassachusettsRef Moderator
    Staff Member

    Apr 30, 2001
    Washington, DC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
  11. GoDawgsGo

    GoDawgsGo Member+

    Nov 11, 2010
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I was wondering the same thing. No idea what they are instructed, but assuming he knew he had misconduct and just didn't know yellow or red I think it's dumb to guess and then look. To me it just 'looks' better to not show a card and then go and decide. If you give the card before going to monitor your options are switch color or keep it the same, and honestly neither looks better than just going no card and going to the monitor first. Seems the least controversial and easiest sell to me.
     
  12. MassachusettsRef

    MassachusettsRef Moderator
    Staff Member

    Apr 30, 2001
    Washington, DC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I agree mechanically it looks better that way. However, the VAR is only supposed to intervene if a clear and obvious error occurs. So technically situations like this create a bit of a paradox unless Guzman records a yellow, tells the VAR he is going yellow, and then gets informed he should take a second look before showing the yellow. Based on everything we see, that actually might be what happened.

    Edit to say the same would apply if Guzman recorded a red, was going red, and the VAR warned him it might only be yellow and he should check. Theoretically, that also would have been kosher. But I very much doubt that's what happened.
     
  13. ManiacalClown

    ManiacalClown Member+

    Jun 27, 2003
    South Jersey
    Club:
    Chicago Fire
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Apparently this was the week of last minute game-winning penalties. Both looked like good calls.
     
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  14. MassachusettsRef

    MassachusettsRef Moderator
    Staff Member

    Apr 30, 2001
    Washington, DC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    San Jose's only felt like a win. But yes, both good calls. Elfath's, done in real-time without VR, was particularly impressive.
     
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  15. ManiacalClown

    ManiacalClown Member+

    Jun 27, 2003
    South Jersey
    Club:
    Chicago Fire
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Haha, all the late goals this week. Got my games confused.
     
  16. MassachusettsRef

    MassachusettsRef Moderator
    Staff Member

    Apr 30, 2001
    Washington, DC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Bradley Smith repped this.

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