You're mixing up modem definitions and designations with historical entities my friend. The people of Central Asia at that time , identified as Iranian, and called their land Iran, but that should not to be confused with modem-day Iran or Iranians. Again, just look at official documents from that era, like the coins. Or go to Samarkhand or Bokhara and look at the inscriptions on the historical sites.
We dont speak eloquent/classical Arabic for almost 1000 years. Classical Arabic started to perish in the Mamalek Empire (second Abbassied Empire) and thanks to the Ottoman Empire Arabs started to use forgien words so the classical Arabic died a long time ago. They only teach it us in schools but we dont use it at all. Again we dont speak classical Arabic for almost 1000 years and according to the official dictionary that makes us Ajamis.
i agree that current territories of Central Asia were under Iranian rule for a long time and population of course were assimilated with Persians, but talking about Khorezm empire i can't agree with your point that it was a part of Iran, Khorezm was at that time independent and conquered territories of modern Iran even its population speak Persian, for example, most of our people currently speak Russian, but we don't become Russians
According to dictionary Nig.ger or Negro means black but later it turned to racial slur or the word gook for Koreans or Japs for Japanese or even Paki for Pakistanis. There are many examples we can argue over this for pages. We know what that means when Arabs call Iranians with that word. Arabs use different words when they want to provoke Iranians. Ajami, Mawali, Zandigh, Majousi.... are few of them.
How can you call sports losers of the world to Koreans?? We are one of the biggest winner in the last 40 years of Olympics, winter and summer you name it, we are major power continental or worldwide in major sports also, specially in soccer in baseball. Iran needs to catch top 10 in medal list one time in your lifetime first to say that. You should stop crying overprotecting Iran from every country and every evidence and concentrate to beat Iraq next stage. If they pass through, will probably eliminate you again. BECAUSE THEY HAVE BEEN DOING IT RECENTLY. EXCEPT WCQ. If they do that also, then, you Iranians should call DADDY IRAQ.
I told you myself they were Turkic. However, they drew their legitimacy from "Iran" and claimed to be descended from Iranian kings. Does that make them Iranian by modern definition? No. Were they ethnic Iranians? No. Did they call their empire "Iran"? Yes. Did they call themselves "Shahs" and their subjects Iranians? Yes. Were they Persianized and spoke Persian? Yes. You have to understand that being the ruler of Iran, was a matter of prestige back then. Hence any dynasty that rose anywhere in Central Asia, or West Asia, wanted to invade all of Central Asia and West Asia and proclaim themselves the new Shahanshah of Iran. This is similar to China and the various dynasties there. At some points in history , there were 3-4 kingdoms and empires at the same time who all claimed to be the legitimate rulers of Iran-shahr and called themselves Shahs and their territory Iran.
No but WHAT IF they had the resources we have? WHAT IF their economy wasn't so dog sh!t? WHAT IF not every country in the world was against them? WHAT IF not every referee was against them in every sport? WHAT IF corruption didn't run through the veins of everyone in that country? what if what if what if
First of all thats an Iranian source for an Arabic word which has its own Arabic meaning in the Arabic dictionary. But secondly even if we consider your source I dont see it as a hatred word. Its logically somehow its true. Can you speak Arabic 100% without mumbling ? Then you are Ajami. Wait i know you will feel offended but wait. Let me tell you about my mumbling in english heck I even sometimes talk Gebbrish. So shall I feel offended when someone points it out that my english is rusty ? Should I feel its a racial thing ? Hell no because its a fact that Im not fluent in English and I struggle alot. Lets take it vice versa what do you call a person who doesnt speak Persian properly ? Yea You can call me that and I wont give a damn. Seriously I dont care about it. Thats my friend if we consider your source is more accurate than the Arabic dictionary. Which I believe its not. I think Ajami its a person who doesnt speak classical Arabic and im gonna stick to it. But to show respect I wont call anyone Ajami. Never did, and will never call someone that because to my believe i am Ajami too.
Encyclopedia Iranica is an academic source, a Columbia university project and is not an "Iranian source". It's written mostly by Western academics who specialize in Iranian studies. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Encyclopædia_Iranica
The fate of the countries changes decade to decade. Korea was not always prosperous and it will not remain as such. China, Japan, Thailand and so on can come and go in this manner. Prosperity and power remove all those IF. Iran have surpass Korea in economy with a half decent government because we have the capital and human resources to pull that. Back in 70s Koreans were working in our country as technicians/servants/simple workers now you are bossing south east Asians. The world economy changes and Iran, Iraq and Syria are few countries in Asia who can actually surpass Far East Tiger economies. That happened during Shah era (Iran 60s and 70s), Iraq during Saddam (70s-80s). You have papa US saving you after 1950s war so you have nothing to worry about. Iran, Iraq and Syria have been through constant war, sanctions and instabilities as major setbacks. Still Iran can compete very well in various sports in top level. Past 10 years Basketball AC Iran (3 gold and 1 bronze) S.Korea (3 bronze) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FIBA_Asia_Championship Volleyball AC Iran (2 gold 2 silver) S.Korea (1 silver 3 bronze) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Asian_Volleyball_Championship#Summary Handball AC Iran(1 bronze 3 4th place) S.Korea (3 gold 1 silver) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Asian_Men's_Handball_Championship Football AC Iran (0) - S.Korea (1 silver 1 bronze) WC appearance Iran (2) S.Korea (3) Wrestling AC Iran free style (7 championship) S.Korea free style (0) Iran Greco-Roman (6 championship) S.Korea Greco-Roman (2 championship) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Asian_Wrestling_Championships Taekwondo (Korean National Sport) Men Iran (3 championship) Korea (2 championship) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Asian_Taekwondo_Championships Karate Iran (1 championship) S.Korea (0) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Asian_Karate_Championships Weightlifting https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Asian_Weightlifting_Championships . . . .
if Central Asian governors call themselves 'shah' of Iran, it's quite similar to European States' kings in Medieval ages when they were called king of Holy Roman Empire to associate their kingdom with Roman Empire, but at that time Roman empire itself didn't exist, so except denomination of governor's title there is no any relation to Iran, as Iran itself then was under the rule of them
Yes, and no. You're right about the titles and why they chose it, similar to the Roman Empire, but still wrong about how the people and rulers self-identified and why. It was more than just a title. While they were not Iranian by race, they pretty much adopted all things Iranian from language to culture. At the end of the day, modern definitions of nation and nationality were irrelevant at that time. As you pointed out, Zoroaster was an Iranian prophet, yet he was probably born in what is today the former Soviet republics. Or Mani was another Iranian prophet who was born in what is today Iraq.
Lol that comment about Korean cheating must have really hit hard for you to turn into a 14 year old troll so quick [emoji23]
That ship sailed a long time ago. We now have covered every topic from Korean sports ethics, to modern interpretations of classical Arabic to the national identity of Medieval Central Asian empires. Only on BigSoccer.
lol. this is why i like this community. there is always trash talk for the littlest thing.. like u23 tournament which is not even regular/senior team. and it is always about the same countries against each other, but somehow it does not get old. then it turns into a discussion about other things like history and politics and language and race. then tex comes and half the thread gets deleted or locked with a few cards handed out and a few socks banned... only for the cycle to start again the very next match that happens. but even though its trash talk it shows that there is a strong community in here because we always gather around and talk. in a strange sense it is healthy, if you look beyond the silly trash talk.
mate, looks like you lost the plot. having a rivalry thread would be worse, because rivalry forum rules would stay only football discussions, but we all know that wont happen. this forum already turns into a rivalry forum naturally. if we had a rivalry forum it would be full of racism and posting of dead bodies (as was the case when we had a rivalry forum about 10 years ago).