YNT-eligible MLS players: 2020 In-season thread

One thing that gets ignored is the physical aspect of development. It doesn't do any good to put effort into developing a player if he breaks down physically.

 

Does anyone want to start buying some Keita stock? With the other center back out injured(Vito) he has done really well in the beginning of this re-start. Seems much more confident on the ball and in his passing. Last night he has a nice little dribble move that he would have never attempted last season. He just crossed 1,000 MLS minutes and turned 20 back in April.

I would also say that playing next to Jonathan Mensah is a great place for him to develop. Mensah has played in World Cups, African Cup of Nations, and even won the u20 WC.

http://www.americansoccernow.com/ar...nd-opportunity-with-an-improved-columbus-team

 

Exactly @dougtee. This is what is starting to get most frustrating. At this point, I have no faith that if one of our absolute best 15, 16 or 17 year olds signs in MLS that it'll result in the Davies or Adams career path. I have almost complete faith that it'll result in rotting. The results say it will.

With all due respect to some players we talk about in this forum, some of them just aren't hugely talented with the potential to be real impact players for our NT, and in Europe. I will root for them, but I cannot lie, and say I think they have higher potential than they have just because they are more in the spotlight than guys who rot. It's not that Cole Bassett couldn't have a better soccer career than Julian Araujo. He clearly could, but if he does, it's almost certainly a bad thing for our NT.

I'm beginning to get tired of the disproportionate of top talents that we see signing in MLS who end up rotting. I like the overall trend of MLS giving more minutes to young players and I think the overall system is getting better, but who was the last top talent we had that signed in MLS, played a lot quickly, played extremely well, and then moved onto Europe? It's probably Tyler Adams, who is long gone from MLS.

MLS needs to do better. They have a responsibility to these top talents. They should feel privileged that they are able to sign kids that could sign with top teams in Europe. It's making me tilt heavily against seeing our top talents sign in MLS that they don't seem to feel this responsibility.

What does my opinion mean? Not much, but I will do my part. I get contacted via this website by parents of YNT players and YNT caliber players about what I think is the best pathway for their son because I'm often told that I'm very knowledgeable about our YNT players and the system, something I appreciate. I'm now completely in the camp that if its not 2-3 different clubs that the best pathway for their child is Europe, and I will make sure I give that opinion when asked for it. It will make no dent at MLS HQ, but I will do my part in advocating for the best pathway for our best young talents, and the more people that do so, it will swing against MLS, if they do not institute changes.

 

I agree with what you are saying, especially with the concept that the top talents who sign in MLS are not being played, Efra, Araujo and more, possibly because MLS believes they aren't physically ready, which in my opinion is utter nonsense, they seemed to be more focused on the physique of sixteen year olds rather than technical ability. As for Nyeman, I still would be patient, however, he is a late born 2003 and still just sixteen years old, if he doesn't start getting quality minutes by next year I would be seriously worried however. I do somewhat agree with the notion that young wingers get playing time earlier than in other positions, it happens all over Europe, look at Ansu Fati vs a guy like Ilaix Moriba at Barcelona. A lot of people on this website speak highly of Nyeman, and from what little I've seen he is very athletic and technical, but what separates him from from other solid upcoming prospects. ie why is he better than the scally, busio, cowell/ other youngsters making MLS squads.

 

I hear what you're saying, and I agree that three games isn't much. I just have no faith that Nyeman won't be the next player to rot. If I'm wrong, I'll have no problem admitting so.

 

Gotta be honest, the more I watch of Busio, the more I just don’t get it.

He’s an advanced striker of the ball for his age, and he’s a relatively tidy distributor on simple passes, but other than that I’m not sure what these big teams see in his game that makes them interested.

He’s not a great dribbler, he doesn’t produce much end product, he’s a decent/not great athlete, and he’s not exactly tenacious defensively.

 

What stops them from going to Europe? Do they have any serious offers? Why can't Alvarez play in Mexico?

 

Nothing stops them from going to Europe. A lot of them sign in MLS because they’re super young and have 2-3 years before they turn 18 and don’t want to be on pause for that time like KHF was. Realistically if they held out till they turned 18 then these 4 would all be in Europe as offers would have flooded in.

 

I now see from the last page that my post wasn’t very controversial. Agree with what many have said.

 

Yea I’m with you there. He lacks some of the qualities that Pomykal has.

The way Busio will become a top talent is if he becomes a go-to to shoot and have the vision/precision to create chances. He lacks the physical tools of speed, and strength compared to other prospects so he needs to find a way to compensate.

 

Where are all the offers for Alvarez, Araujo and Carleton now? Nyeman is well known and not that young anymore, at some point he looked like world class prospect. Where are buy and loan back offers? Alvarez, Carleton and Nyeman all have athletic limitations. Is it possible that scouts seen dozens of extremely talented kids with similar limitations?

 

Could it also be that who the top prospects are at 16 tends to be different than who the top prospects are at 18 or 20?

 

A Freakin MEN. Been killing me for years to see kids sign in MLS then die on the vine. The problem that I see in my sphere is MLS teams think they are as good or better at developing players so they try to convince kids to sign in USL or a cheap long term HG contract that all but kills any euro aspirations.

Actually heard of a high level academy coach telling an MLS kid they felt what they did in their MLS academy was as good or better than what Barcelona was doing. That is the kind of arrogance that needs to be overcome still.

 

That is the main hold up. If you are in an MLS academy at 16 and tearing it up, they will try to sign you to a USL or MLS deal. If you say no, I want to go to Europe, you are persona non grata and dismissed. I get it, the MLS teams feel they dont' want to train them and let them go, but they need to accept that is simply what is best for the very top level talent.

Case in point Johnathan Gomez. I have a feeling if FCD would have let him stick around until he was 18 without putting pressure on him to sign and let him go at 18, he would be in Frisco instead of Louisville right now.

These clubs need to change the way they do things if our best players are to benefit. It will take a forward thinking owner and not one who simply wants what's best for his team, but the broader National Team and overall US player development in general. Can't blame the owners for wanting to simply keep their players and get something from them, but right now, its not set up that way. Once they can sell players at 15 or 16 ( and fifa rule 19 goes away) , or get real TC money, perhaps things change.

 

To be fair. European clubs would treat the players potentially even worse if they knew the player was leaving compared to MLS clubs. It’s understandable if you don’t want to develop a player who’s going to jump ship as soon as they can

 

Development is not linear. Top prospects will fade. George Bello, Gilbert Fuentes, and Gianluca Busio were all top players heading into that cycle...2.5 years later and I don’t rate any of them. The 2000’s have seen most of that excellent u17 World Cup squad get leaped. Unless a player absolutely blows the doors off then take caution (something I fail to remind myself constantly).

 

Europe is far more vicious than MLS in this regard. We’ve seen what they’ve done with Emerson Hyndman and Sebastian Soto when they refused contracts.

 

Bello seems really good in a 2-way game where the decisions are more obvious and his speed to join the attack or recover are assets.

But when it's a tight space match - bunkering or playing against one - where there's subtly in movement and technicality; he falters.

It reminds you of his former lb competition Brek Shea, only w/out Brek's size, periodic dynamism on the ball, and w/ a hair less speed.

 

I agree that a lot if, not most of the people approach this forum from that perspective. I do believe, that the conflict doesn't arise from that as much as the differing opinions that people have on what MLS' role should be. Some take the stance that MLS should only consider the player's and the USMNT's interests and some take the complete opposite stance and believe MLS is a business and they should only worry about their bottom line. Of course there is also a middle ground as well and I believe most fall into that space.

Regardless, there is quite a bit of overlap for many....if a player is developed and is on the way to helping USMNT, MLS can benefit as well.

 

Out of curiosity, who are the 2-3 clubs that you include in this list? I assume FCD, Philly, anyone else?

 

Like any other league, MLS has to act in their own best interest. There needs to be something in it for them to sign and play youth, i.e.: an eventual juicy transfer fee, long-term initial contract, or eventual extension to stay there. We, as US fans, like to think they have obligation to the national team. They don't, beyond NT success having a knock-on benefit to increasing the amount of talent in the country, for them to use. But it starts w/ domestic club academy success like most other successful NT's.

The problem w/ MLS as a league now is more incompetence in how to, for their own financial and competitive interests; sign, develop, & integrate youths who weren't dead-set on making the jump to Europe as soon as possible. Which would entail killing the hg territory rule. The hg salary cap and full transfer fee exceptions were just the beginning. Slow on the uptake.

 

The results say it will.

Except they don't.

Recent Successes:
Alphonso Davies
Tyler Adams

Recent Failures:
Andrew Carleton, I guess?

People you would call recent failures but are literally still 18 years old or less:
Efra Alvarez
Julian Araujo
Moses Nyeman

You don't get to say the above are clear failures because of a pattern of failure when they are the example of your pattern of failure.

The reality is that there have been very few top prospects, period, and very few that have signed with MLS.

You are right that there are players with different potential.

I don't think it's reality that those that are identified as high potential at 15-16 always end up the best players. The expectation shouldn't be a 100% hit rate or even close.

Not just because all players don't pan out, but because assessing at 15 is also not an exact science.

The consensus on Tyler Adams at 15 ... was there one? Weston McKennie? Neither are a Pulisic-level prospect, but both have potentials well above what was assessed at that age, correct?

[quote[I'm beginning to get tired of the disproportionate of top talents that we see signing in MLS who end up rotting. I like the overall trend of MLS giving more minutes to young players and I think the overall system is getting better, but who was the last top talent we had that signed in MLS, played a lot quickly, played extremely well, and then moved onto Europe? It's probably Tyler Adams, who is long gone from MLS.[/quote]

Is 18 months ago, long gone? How many top prospects have their even BEEN in 18 months?

I realize that we are all talking subject to your view of potential, but in the interim we've seen Brenden Aaronson break out, Reggie Cannon, Paxton Pomykal.

Okay?

Most of the guys you consider I assume you consider high potential DO go to Europe.

But you'd be much more honest if you applied the lens you apply to MLS to European options as well. Over here, it's always the team's fault. Over there, we have similar failure and stagnation rates (often with better prospects) and who's it on?

If you wanted to actual offer good advice, it would be about the individual situation, instead of pretending Europe is some monolith of goodness.

Dortmund? Great call, if you are good enough. If you are Junior Flores, not so much. But great call!

EPL loan army? When has that worked out?

At this point, by your standards, everyone not named Reyna or Pulisic is a failure over there as well. Ledezma is four years old than Nyeman and he hasn't played a first team game!

 

I agree but MLS is not Premiere League, La Liga, Budesliga, etc. I will take heat for this from MLS fans, but MLS should know its place.

If you have reached Top 5 League status, I have no problem with them punting kids that don't want to be there. If you are a 16 year old at Chelsea, are you really going to tell them you don't want a HG deal because your goal in life has been to play for the DC United?

 

My guess is that the lower league teams would cut a player loose also. If for no other reason than the fact that they have fewer resources than the top clubs to be wasting them by training a player for someone else. I know there are solidarity payments but I am sure that transfer fees etc would be more desireable.


Am I wrong? I could be. -

 

Well, I watched Busio and I'm not impressed. Can't see Feyenoord has made interest known to Kansas, as we have in our youth better players available.
The high humidity without a doubt impacted the quality of the match, which was poor, in the sense of speed of the game. That humidity however can't have an impact on the poor passing of both teams and the lackluster ball control.
Busio didnot show high technical abilities when on the ball, was several times easily dispossessed when he was passed the ball and too little involved in the game for a midfielder. I'm also not convinced he has high tactical insight on where to position himself.
He had two good moments, when he delivered the corner in the second minute and around the 50iest minute the pass through the defense of the opponent.