Yanks Abroad 2024/25 thread

Discussion in 'USA Men: News & Analysis' started by OWN(yewu)ED, Aug 2, 2024.

  1. gomichigan24

    gomichigan24 Member+

    Jul 15, 2002
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Sullivan is a completely different level from all those guys. And in a different stage of his career when he goes over (which will probably be with Girona since he can’t go to England until he’s 18).
     
  2. gomichigan24

    gomichigan24 Member+

    Jul 15, 2002
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I feel like it was Turkey where things really turned around (under Nuri Sahin who is now the coach of Dortmund).
     
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  3. Paul Berry

    Paul Berry Member+

    Notts County and NYCFC
    United States
    Apr 18, 2015
    Nr Kingston NY
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    He didn't score in his last 9 then walked out on them. I think his return in Turkey was more impressive.

    But I think the instability hurt his NT career.
     
  4. Paul Berry

    Paul Berry Member+

    Notts County and NYCFC
    United States
    Apr 18, 2015
    Nr Kingston NY
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    He's 15. We don't know how good he's going to be. We hope he continues to develop and delivers on his potential (and avoids injury).

    Personally I worry if City is the right club, as like Chelsea, they have a throw stuff against the wall to see what sticks approach to their academy.
     
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  5. thedukeofsoccer

    thedukeofsoccer Member+

    Jul 11, 2004
    Wussconsin
    Club:
    AFC Ajax
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Albert has a leg up on Cavan in that he could validate himself by simply breaking thru at BVB between now & the WC. Cavan has to kill it in MLS, then still may receive skepticism. It probably has to happen this season too, not the subsequent one, to break thru in Jan camp '26.

    I really doubt both players would be on the roster even if legit. They occupy similar positions and probably wouldn't be trusted as more than super subs/wild cards off the bench. This is what Pulisic was for like 10 caps as a 17 yr old, before ultimately breaking thru as starter. Doubt the gaffer wants 2 of these on a WC roster.

    Speaking of BVB & young starlet a-mids, Campbell is another kid who could be occupying those positions. He'd be a more reliable shot than both you'd figure. But he's settled into reality there for the time being. His chance may be in winter camp, which he shouldn't spend here, rather there. They're open to transferring Malen. Campbell's showing promise, but he needs to seize the opportunity next time its given. Otherwise maybe he takes a loan & tries to level up.
     
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  6. OWN(yewu)ED

    OWN(yewu)ED Member+

    Club: Venezia F.C.
    May 26, 2006
    chico, CA
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    People keep on linking Cade Cowell to PSV as Lozano replacement. They’ve been linked to Cade for some time now. Hopefully that dance is completed soon
     
  7. Paul Berry

    Paul Berry Member+

    Notts County and NYCFC
    United States
    Apr 18, 2015
    Nr Kingston NY
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    How may first team appearances will Cavan make in 2025? How many starts? I think he'll spend another season primarily in Next Pro. I don't think the Union or City will want to push him too hard.
     
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  8. grandinquisitor28

    Feb 11, 2002
    Nevada
    He's definitely not Carleton. Though I agree he could bust like anyone else, I'd just errr towards Steve Snow and Renken type negative outcomes because that looks like the negative possibility. A Carleton level flame out is almost certainly not happening (I'd put that at less than 1%).
     
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  9. grandinquisitor28

    Feb 11, 2002
    Nevada
    The weird thing about Wright is that he and Vasquez have damn near identical breakouts, and Sargent is similar too: all 3 broke out as strikers at age 24, it may just be a striker thing in terms of development (and in Wright's case, landing w/the perfect coach).
     
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  10. bballshawn

    bballshawn Member+

    Feb 5, 2014
    Delaware
    Club:
    Philadelphia Union
    There’s no reason for Cavan to be playing MLS next pro next year. If Lamine Yamal can break through to Barcelona at 15 Cavan can surely do the same at Philly next year.
     
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  11. gogorath

    gogorath Member+

    None
    United States
    May 12, 2019
    Cavan's athleticism is above Carleton's, and by current accounts, so is his work ethic and professionalism. He's young, so perhaps that can change, and there's always injury, but Carleton is not a good comp. Neither is Adu.

    Prospects really only bust because of injury, mentality or physical tools.

    There's definitely still questions about how good Cavan will be.

    The biggest thing is that he's clearly a central player. I am sure he can play on the wing in many cases, but he's not a winger and I would be surprised if he's going to be optimized there. There are winger playmakers, but I don't think he's going to be a one on one dribbler at the highest levels to play that role.

    So then the question comes whether he will be big enough centrally. Quinn's not small, so I suspect he will, but that is a question.

    After that, we're basically looking at injury or lack of effort in terms of straight bust. Of course, he could only become a good player. Some may consider that a bust, but to me, I think it unlikely his career ends up like Adu or Carleton.

    But, of course, there's a mile between that and the upside that people are thinking.

    Honestly, give me a healthy version of Gio and I will be very happy. Especially since he will overlap with Gio. I know people will be disappointed with that, but get me 11 guys on the pitch that are difference makers the level of (healthy) Gio and we will take a massive step forward.
     
  12. TheHoustonHoyaFan

    Oct 14, 2011
    Houston
    Club:
    FC Schalke 04
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    It should be no surprise that scouts are looking for prospects with very high ceilings and very high floors. Athleticism is measurable and elite athletes have a high floor especially if scouts believe that they score high on mentality and would work hard on improving skills and tactics.

    The McGlynns and Tolkins don't have attributes that say they are high ceiling prospects and their floors at the next level of the pyramid may be quite low. There are 50 players just like them in every single tier2/3 leagues around the world.
     
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  13. gogorath

    gogorath Member+

    None
    United States
    May 12, 2019
    Unless Lamine Yamal is better than Cavan.

    Yamal broke through with Barca after his 16th birthday; he debuted at 15, but played 8 minutes. Cavan's already basically done that.

    Cavan won't turn 16 until September 28th of next year; if he follows Yamal's timeline, then he'd either seize a spot during playoff time or the start of the 2026 season.

    At this age, physical maturity is a very real barrier to playing time (and should be). And it's more of a big deal for a central player than a wing. Obviously, breaking through and being a star at Barcelona is harder than just starting in MLS, but that year and physical development at really big.

    He could absolutely break through. But I actually think how much he grows is going to be as relevant as his skills.
     
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  14. Paul Berry

    Paul Berry Member+

    Notts County and NYCFC
    United States
    Apr 18, 2015
    Nr Kingston NY
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    There's a big difference. Barca have total control over Yamal. City are protecting their future investment. I wouldn't be surprised if there's something contractual between City and Philly limiting his appearances.
     
  15. ifsteve

    ifsteve Member+

    Manchester United
    United States
    Jul 7, 2013
    MS and ID
    Club:
    Real Salt Lake
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Especially when you consider the other sports drawing fans ticket dollars. No place in the world has the number of top level sports vying for fans attention like the US does. Not even close.
     
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  16. Paul Berry

    Paul Berry Member+

    Notts County and NYCFC
    United States
    Apr 18, 2015
    Nr Kingston NY
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    'Stralia maybe. Relative to head of population.

    AFL 38,344
    NRL 20,605
    Club rugby union 16,080 (no national domestic league)
    A-League 10,008

    Then you have international cricket that can attract over 80,000, international rugby league and union that can each attract over 60,000 and the State of Origin rugby league games that play to packed houses.
     
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  17. xbhaskarx

    xbhaskarx Member+

    San Jose Earthquakes
    United States
    Feb 13, 2010
    NorCal
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Is part of the anti-American bias USMNT players experience in Europe former USMNTers turned pundits telling them to go back to MLS?
    1866219873749303332 is not a valid tweet id
     
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  18. jaykoz3

    jaykoz3 Member+

    Dec 25, 2010
    Conshohocken, PA
    Club:
    Philadelphia Union
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    The Big Bash League draws fairly well too, though that's only a month long. The NBL has a decent following too.
     
  19. gogorath

    gogorath Member+

    None
    United States
    May 12, 2019
    The other impressive thing -- not that it is good -- is that US ticket prices are generally much, much higher than the rest of the world, even when you just compare to similarly economically developed countries.

    The people who do have season tickets are very committed.
     
  20. bballshawn

    bballshawn Member+

    Feb 5, 2014
    Delaware
    Club:
    Philadelphia Union
    You make good points and I agree most of his ceiling is going to come down to physical development and I believe how he adapts to the speed of play each level.
    The one thing I am tired of in the MLS landscape is the wait until next year mentality when it comes to youth. I understand that the league has parity and that most teams seem in have a chance to win it all every year. So playing your “most ready” team sound logical. But I have noticed that young players get kept behind mid players years too long. Sometimes it’s almost as if they are waiting for them to lose their upside to start playing,

    For example Julian Hall should have had way more minutes this year despite NY Red Bulls making the final.

    But I am in the more extreme side when it comes to youth development.
     
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  21. Paul Berry

    Paul Berry Member+

    Notts County and NYCFC
    United States
    Apr 18, 2015
    Nr Kingston NY
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    It's amazing what the world's most sophisticated sport has been reduced to.

    - Cricket snob

    Of course we probably wouldn't be able to have 3, 4 and 5 day cricket without the revenue the shorter forms generate but I really hate BigBash, The Hundreds and T20.
     
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  22. Paul Berry

    Paul Berry Member+

    Notts County and NYCFC
    United States
    Apr 18, 2015
    Nr Kingston NY
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I don't think it's just a MLS thing. Coaches under pressure tend to rely on more experienced players. See Gio and Forest.
     
  23. gogorath

    gogorath Member+

    None
    United States
    May 12, 2019
    I think the current balance in the league is not terrible. It's team by team and player by player, of course, but I don't think a fully developmental league survives in the US. At the same time, I don't think a US league gets that far without being able to effectively develop American talent. Trying to import all your talent is a mistake that ends poorly -- Americans may only be 35% of minutes but it is super costly to import all that talent ... and at that pay scale, the talent really isn't all that good.

    I would like to see more young Americans for sure, but I don't know how much is chicken and egg. I think there's a place for a certain level of developmental minutes, but it is also important for players to earn their time, to be able to contribute.

    I think people overestimate how many teenagers get time at a league the level of MLS, let alone how many 16 year olds. It's not many at all.

    The issue here is that the depth of US soccer is low. So while the Eerstedivisie isn't very good, it's still better than USLC or MLSNP. The drop off is large and everyone knows there's a gap, but it is a hard one to fill without the domestic player base ... which is what you are trying to build.
     
  24. Paul Berry

    Paul Berry Member+

    Notts County and NYCFC
    United States
    Apr 18, 2015
    Nr Kingston NY
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Ends poorly for whom? How?

    Everyone involved with MLS appears to be making money. Domestic players tend to make more than imports (except HGPs on their first contract). The league is growing, revenue is soaring, the pipeline to Europe for the best young players is developing.

    Well if people stopped playing stupidface sports like basketball, football, hockey and baseball we'd have not depth but at the moment only about 15% of boys play soccer and we don't really have the infrastructure for that to rapidly expand.

    More American "stars" in Europe and a successful run at a World Cup might help to inspire kids and it's good to see stars of other sports get involved in MLS but it's going to be a long and frustrating process.

    MLS had a domestic/foreign balance similar to a lot of leagues and I don't think there's a higher percentage of 16 or 17 year-olds playing first team football anywhere but I'll try and find stats.

    Liga MX has a high % of domestic players and look what's happened to their NT.
     
  25. OWN(yewu)ED

    OWN(yewu)ED Member+

    Club: Venezia F.C.
    May 26, 2006
    chico, CA
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Rumors Man City verdict dropping soon……
     

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