WWC USA vs Australia Pre/pbp/Post 6/8/2015 Winnipeg

Discussion in 'USA Women: News and Analysis' started by Calci0, Jun 2, 2015.

  1. IKickAndIm50

    IKickAndIm50 Member

    Apr 13, 2009
    Club:
    Chicago Fire
    Throughout the match she was getting beat and not contributing much. Yes her assist makes everyone assume she did great but it's not the case. Just like the fact Wambach missed twice makes people assume she failed. But she did other useful things.
     
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  2. Cliveworshipper

    Cliveworshipper Member+

    Dec 3, 2006
    Leroux was one of the players who turned the game around with her hustle. She was making tackles and connecting on her passes.

    This wasn't one of Abby's best nights. If you look on the forums here, you'll see I have been a supporter of hers over the years. But last night, not so much. She had very little impact on the game offensively or defensively.
     
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  3. Calci0

    Calci0 Member

    Jun 22, 2013
    NC
    Club:
    Juventus FC
    My mistake, I didn't know you were just commenting on the coaching aspect of Ellis.
     
  4. sitruc

    sitruc Member+

    Jul 25, 2006
    Virginia
    Interesting site. That's more like MLSSoccer.com than USsoccer.com. Commentary and editorials on league sites trying to put out their own news/stories has become a norm, but I'm not sure how I feel about it from a federation. However, there is a closer bond between the federation and league there though.
     
  5. kernel_thai

    kernel_thai Member+

    Oct 24, 2012
    Club:
    Seattle Sounders
    As u've mentioned before...Im consistent.
     
  6. steelers07

    steelers07 Member

    Apr 8, 2014
    Club:
    Real Madrid
    So after giving this game a second viewing without all the nerves and anxiety, here are my final thoughts:

    1) Carli Lloyd spent most of the first half playing for two people (several times during the game you could actually see her pointing out where Holiday should be in terms of midfield spacing or who she should be covering). She was pretty much mopping up after Holiday who...honestly should be on the bench based on her form this year. However, Ellis doesn't want a true DM so we're stuck with Holiday playing out of position and the team paying for it.

    2) For all of Hope Solo's drama off the pitch where would we have been without her in those first 20-30 minutes? I probably give her more leeway than most but on days like that, I'm grateful that she's the starting GK.

    3) Listen, Megan Rapinoe was probably our best outfield player but her play overall was inconsistent which is the norm with her. Some of her crosses were not good and she passed up opportunities to slip someone through when she decided to shoot instead. Someone needs to ask Laura Harvey what she says to Rapinoe that makes her play less selfish on the Seattle Reign so she can apply it to the NT. On the other hand, there was barely any movement from the two strikers so her taking shots was symptomatic to that (which I think she mentioned in her presser). Which leads me to my next point:

    4) Abby Wambach was in the team for her aerial ability, let's be honest, and she failed on that account. So, if she's failing to do the one thing she's on the pitch for, maybe it's time she stops starting (that time should've started awhile ago).

    5) Leroux should've been taking on her defender from the first time she touched the ball, I'm still trying to figure out why she hadn't tested her defender when she was 1v1 until the second half. The Heath substitution helped control possession more but her weaknesses were on display again, dribble successfully a few times then lose the ball in key positions. Luckily for her, the rest of her team were in position to stop any breakaways. Press is NOT a winger but we'll have to watch her play as one because...honestly I have no idea why this is still a thing. She's shown what she can do when you play her centrally.

    6) Out of the four defenders, only Sauerbrunn left that game with her reputation still in tact. Krieger kept playing too narrow and wasn't watching Kerr (or DeVanna on her goal) at all for most of the first half, Johnston showed her nerves today especially on that second half gaff and Klingenberg is an accident waiting to happen especially if she starts against Nigeria because she's always out of position and doesn't have the speed to recover. Then again, Ellis' insistence on having her FBs push up that much is not helping any of our FBs.

    A lot of these thoughts were things those who follow the NT closely have been saying for close to a year now. My heart wants a US WC trophy but my head says we'll go out in the knock out rounds because of Jill Ellis and her tactics.
     
  7. kernel_thai

    kernel_thai Member+

    Oct 24, 2012
    Club:
    Seattle Sounders
    I agree with a lot of that. It will be interesting a) if Johnston starts against Sweden because Ellis was talking about needing Rampone's speed against Sweden because of the way they attack behind the FBs and b) will that have a negative effect on Johnston if she returns to a starting role against Nigeria? I also wonder how many changes Ellis makes based on what she saw against Australia. Does Heath deserve a start based on her fine play? Personally, I like Heath coming off the bench. Does Press get a start up top? Hard to believe ull see much of Wambach after 90 minutes. Will Ellis back her FBs off a bit? While I get Klingenberg is a big asset going forward on the left, I'm not sure it's worth hindering Krieger's defensive work for what she gives u going down field on the right. I was also impressed with Lloyd's restraint. While Ellis has essentially taken one of her best scoring threats out of the offense, Im fairly sure leaving Holiday alone in the back is a bigger problem.
     
  8. REALfootballRulez

    May 25, 2007
    Club:
    Saint Louis Athletica
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Thanks but that's not from the game vs. Australia.
     
  9. REALfootballRulez

    May 25, 2007
    Club:
    Saint Louis Athletica
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I met Lori after an Athletica/FC Gold Pride game in 2010. She took the time to talk to me after the game and was very nice. So she is kind of my favorite player I guess. That's all.
     
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  10. kernel_thai

    kernel_thai Member+

    Oct 24, 2012
    Club:
    Seattle Sounders
    So I was listening to Ann Odong of TheWomensGame on the Mixxed Zone podcast and the Australian websites comments came up. She had a lot of interesting things to say.
    http://t.co/6safhSKs7s
    One point she made that Ive been a proponent of is the problem with the US system debuting players at such a late age. Christen Press is playing in her first WC at 26. So is Meghan Klingenberg. If Crystal Dunn makes the 2019 WC she will also make her first appearance at 26. Een Becky Sauerbrunn, now 30, who I could make a case for being the best US player, was an unused spare part at the previous WC and only got to play because of the Buehler red card. For every Johnston and Brian who r using this WC as a building block for future WC there r too many players who could be doing the same.
     
  11. lunatica

    lunatica Member+

    Nov 20, 2013
    My favorite quote from this podcast was that firing Sermanni can hurt USWNT for two, three cycles to come (or something like that).
     
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  12. Cliveworshipper

    Cliveworshipper Member+

    Dec 3, 2006
    I agree with most of what you say but this one doesn't ring true. Rapinoe is a player who tries audacious stuff and not all of it works. In her 10 year career in college and beyond she has consistently shown herself to be a player who loves pressure and comes though. I'm not sure which possibilities she passed up to slip players trough in order to shoot, but the box shows she took four shots. Two were on frame and scored. One was a very long range sky ball when there was nobody making a run and the keeper was off her line. I can't recall the other. Considering the other score was on a through ball to Leroux who set up press, she was involved in every score.

    I pray the rest of the team is that inconsistent. The box says the team took 9 shots, 5 of which were on frame. since three scored, the entire rest of the team took two shots on frame. I suspect they were the weak headers from Wambach.
    Consistency like that is unwanted, IMO.

    As to what Laura Harvey tells her, I'd say very little. She doesn't have to. Harvey puts together a team that knows how to pass the ball and control possession. The team Ellis had on the pitch for most of the game was clueless in that regard. What I saw was long hoofing down the field by Johnston, Press mostly not playing in support of the defence, Kling playing out of position, no coordination of the essential tasks of a central midfield, and Brunn desperately trying to cover up the gaffs of the rest of the defence.
     
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  13. South American

    Aug 3, 2008
    Ohai one of the best wingers in America sits home while one of the best forwards in America is forced to play wing! while 35 year olds sit on the bench and may never see the field this entire tournament.
     
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  14. steelers07

    steelers07 Member

    Apr 8, 2014
    Club:
    Real Madrid
    I did mention that her shooting was probably down to not a lot of movement by the front 2 especially in the first half. I do wish she'd hold on to the ball a little longer instead of shooting, just to see what her options are. Same thing could be applied to Carli Lloyd.

    I do agree that some of this selfishness is down to Ellis' tactics which I've already mentioned are puzzling to say the least.
     
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  15. steelers07

    steelers07 Member

    Apr 8, 2014
    Club:
    Real Madrid
    a) Johnston SHOULD start. Anyone who watched Rampone this season for Sky Blue will tell you that her speed had started to desert her, if it hasn't already. I doubt her confidence will be low if she's reassured correctly, Johnston I mean.
    b) My biggest issue with Heath is that she tries too much. Once or twice is enough for her because if she tries it more often than that, she loses possession.
    c) I hope Press starts up top, or even Rodriguez. Nigeria showed that speed will kill Sweden's backline.
    d) I never joined the Klingenberg bandwagon purely because of her positioning. I'm not sure Chalupny at LB is any better. If I was in charge I'd give O'Hara a chance to show if her 2013 form before her injury wasn't just a fluke.
    e) And yes, Holiday alone at the back is something we need to avoid at all costs.
     
  16. South American

    Aug 3, 2008
    No Ellis fan here, but how much input does any of the other coaches have sitting on that bench. Surely her #1 or #2 assistants have some say about some of the dysfunction going on?
     
  17. steelers07

    steelers07 Member

    Apr 8, 2014
    Club:
    Real Madrid
    @South American it depends on the structure. Some coaches will listen to their assistants, some won't. Who knows how Ellis' is running her ship.
     
  18. kolabear

    kolabear Member+

    Nov 10, 2006
    los angeles
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Interesting Kate Markgraf article on ESPNW. Among her points -

    Good discussion here. Please carry on.
     
  19. Smallchief

    Smallchief Member+

    Oct 27, 2012
    Club:
    --other--
    I have a little difficulty with the criticism of Rapinoe. It looked to me like she touched the ball about twice as much as anybody else. The whole U.S. offense seemed geared to getting the ball to her on the left flank. Yeah, she made a few bad passes and crosses -- but two goals and a major role in a third make up for a multitude of sins.

    I also recall her making at least one important take-away on defense deep in U.S. territory (from DeVanna I think).
     
  20. kolabear

    kolabear Member+

    Nov 10, 2006
    los angeles
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Multiple TV viewership records set by the game according to SportsMediaWatch. The 3.3 million audience was triple the opening round USA match in 2011. It was the all-time highest rated group match for the US women. Also, highest rated soccer match ever for FoxSports1

     
  21. Cliveworshipper

    Cliveworshipper Member+

    Dec 3, 2006

    It might be interesting to note which direction soccer and NASCAR are heading on FS1

    It seems NASCAR rating figures have dropped for most races from last year.

    http://www.jayski.com/news/pages/story/_/page/NASCAR-Televison-Ratings-2015
     
  22. kernel_thai

    kernel_thai Member+

    Oct 24, 2012
    Club:
    Seattle Sounders
    I suspect Ellis assigns her assistants their own specific areas but I dont know it for a fact. About all I can tell about input is does the team play like any of the teams the assistant normally coaches. I wasnt overly familiar with the style at Tyreso but I do know Gustavsson coach the defense for Sundhage. As to Swanson Im surprised he is still on the staff. He favors a passing game with specific roles for each player. Ellis favors a more direct style with the players having free, interchanging roles.
     
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  23. kernel_thai

    kernel_thai Member+

    Oct 24, 2012
    Club:
    Seattle Sounders
    On a slightly different area, I liked Morgans role when she came. She played outside and tried to face up rather than crowding the box. Whether this was to help kill the game or not I dont know but it's a role I prefer for her. She stretches the defense out there because if they dont come out she can run at the defense and be dangerous. If they do come out it opens space for other players to make runs thru.
     
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  24. RalleeMonkey

    RalleeMonkey Member+

    Aug 30, 2004
    here
    I used to be able to follow the Women's team real closely. No time any more. I shouldn't even be posting this.

    There are several comments in the thread that Ellis likes to play with no d-mid. We're playing with a d-mid, maybe the best we've ever had. But ..... she's playing Amid? Lloyd is a lot of awesome things. Playmaker isn't one of them. I once read a quote from Ellis saying that Carli scores so many goals, just think of how many she will score if we get her further up the field. Someone please tell me that having Lloyd play further up the field (and Holiday playing further back) is *not* some misguided attempt increase Carli's already prodigious scoring rate? Surely Ellis knows that playing further up the field Lloyd will not get the shots that she got making late runs to the top of the box, right? That if you take something that is working great (Carli as a d-mid) and mess with it, she is likely to produce fewer goals, not more (as will Holiday, being pushed so far from the box). Tell me there is some other logic to this other than "more goals for Carli."

    On Heath, I've always thought she should be played up high, centrally. She's got a great bag of tricks, but she doesn't have the speed to exploit them. If she burns someone, out wide, in the middle third, that's an advantage, but not a huge advantage. Whereas, if she loses the ball there, well, that's bad. I don't know if we could play w/ a dedicated A-mid (maybe we could of Lloyd was a dedicated D-mid), but I'd be more inclined to play her as such. There, if she burns someone, she can put someone else in on goal, or take a shot. If she loses the ball, there's more cover.

    She did play extremely well against OZ. If we're still with the Lloyd/Holiday cm, then I'd play Heath out wide, play with 2 of Syd/Morgan/Press and sit Abbie. I'm in the "if Abbie isn't converting good header opportunities, she needs to sit." camp.
     
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  25. South American

    Aug 3, 2008
    Its amazing that here we are in the middle of the WC and after two years of preparation there are still full on "justified" discussions on where personnel should play!..
     
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