That's a fair point. Not a single side in the CL proper is actually crap though. If you're from a crap league in Europe it's nigh impossible to qualify for the CL proper. In sharp contrast with world cup qualifying I might add.
I'm not suggesting that. I'm suggesting that the world cup is a big time sporting event just like the olympics, i.e. a big percentage of world cup watchers aren't even that interested in football, but just like the excitement of a big event, made all the better if their own country's in it. The Dutch watched mostly Korea in 2002 btw. So go figure.
So how does that tie in with it being more about nationalism than football, when you clearly admit people get into it even if their own country isn't taking part?
You're right, nationalism was not the right word to use. I was just thinking of the millions of Dutch idiots who dress up in orange for the world cup without even having a clue of what the offside rule is. I have the feeling that a lot of world cup watchers don't know. I mean at normal football games I'm one of few women, but at the world cup there's loads of them. You can't convince me they're all actually interested in football! Again I reckon the bigness of the event alone attracts viewers.
Sharp contrast? If we assume that "crap" means any team worse than the weakest UEFA team to qualify, then there are only 4-5 crap teams in the World Cup. Both competitions certainly have one thing in common: there are only about 10 teams capable of winning the whole thing.
It's not necessarily an inconsistency, at least in my opinion. I think that nationalism could potentially be explanatory when it comes to fans continuing to follow the games, even after their national team had been eliminated. For example, they may start rooting for the team that eliminated them (they would be able to claim - "we lost to the World Cup champions/finalists", thus improving the credentials of their own national team). Moreover, they may switch their support to another national team as a form of "extended nationalism" - e.g. Serbian fans are likely to cheer for Russia and vice versa, as there are cultural affinities between these two countries, they have tended to adopt common positions on geopolitical issues etc. In short, I concur with the nationalist explanation; the World Cup is likely to offer all-absorbing excitement (the boundaries between "passionate football fans" and "ordinary folks" become much less rigid, they are united by a common cause). "Franjo Tuđman, the first president of Croatia, kept a strong relationship with the national team during his reign and credited their contribution towards the formation of a sovereign Croatian republic." According to statesmen, World Cup glory could be beneficial to the nation-building experience. Still, the Champions League may offer higher quality football, but in terms of spectacle it's unlikely to come close to the World Cup any time soon (unless the rates of naturalization continue to ncrease, and national teams start to mirror club teams).
I was exaggerating to make a point but I'm sure you got what I meant. Even the Belgian champions, who subsequently made quite an impact in the UEFA cup, didn't get into the CL because the nature of the CL is such that once you're down the rankings, it really is almost impossible to get past all the qualifying rounds. Imagine the Concacaf champion having to get through an extra qualifying round, against the European play offs winner for example. Once they'd fail to get past that, another qualifying round would come, and if they lost that, they'd have to get through yet another next time, etc. Such is the nature of the CL. CL qualifying has a slippery slope character to it whereas world cup qualifying, ironically, also has that but only in Europe, where ranking can have you end up in a group with two top ten nations. But let's not get into that discussion again as Nicephoras does not like it.
Meaning "of the whole world", have to scientifically agree. The only objective criteria the records avail is Club WC, as far as I could elect. As for Scatology, can't consider it offering a proper data for the matter...
If people can discuss it without resorting to childish name calling, I wouldn't care. Stay civil and threads won't have to be closed.
A few reasons why the WC is wwwaaaayyyy better - national team coaches tend to be much better than club coaches, especially if considered in regards to all the teams in either competition. -There's more time to prepare for particular games and so WC matches feature teams that are focused 100% on that game and have been training for it for a long time ----> without worrying about what's going on in domestic competition etc. - i the WC you get a chance to see players that you may not have heard of before or seen play that are at the top of their game, but on a different continent. Its not just the same players and the same teams battling it out. Its nice to see an Ivory Coast - Argentina match, for instance...... - Styles of play. In europe, as in other continents though perhaps to a greater extent, the vvvaaaaaasssst majority of (successful) teams play a similar style with similar formations. In the WC you get to actually see teams that work in different systems and with different philosophies, and so you can get a 3-5-1-1 thats heavy on the midfield taking on a 4-3-3 ....
Decent advert for the Champions League tonight, eh? It is consistantly more exiting that the World Cup.
I agree on some levels but have you ever considered, at all, that the loyalty of players these days is with the party that pays them shedloads of money to play football, i.e. their club? Given the fact that even footballers think their club is more important than their country these days, where does that leave the world cup when compared to the CL.
Name me one complete unknown who everybody first saw at the World Cup, and went on to have a great career. You can say people have come out of there shells, but nobody has gone from nothing, to a star thanks to a world cup. I don't really care for the Angolan players who I have never heard of and won't really here of again.
Before I address any of you points, can I just get confirmation as to what you mean by wwwaaaaaaaaayyyyyyyy better. Do you mean better as in more pleasing on the eye, more entertaining, so more enjoyable to watch? or: Do you mean better as in a higher standard of football, higher quality of team skill level?
J.S. Park= his amazing play at the 2002 World Cup earned him a contract with PSV..and now is starting with Manchester United.
Park's a nice utility player for ManUtd, but lets not go overboard. If that's the best you can do, its a paltry list. More often than not, players who have tournaments of their lives are more likely to be the next Rustu or El Hadj Diouf.
[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xJT3xwBc2s4&feature=related"]YouTube - FC Barcelona - Brazil 1999 / RONALDO[/ame] Romário, Ronaldo, Rivaldo & Roberto Carlos, Nuff Said!
These two really shouldn't be compared, not even in the same realm. Players, pay differences, prestige, meaning. It's all totally different between the two. One is essentially a trophy only a handfull of locals will recall while the other is a much different story because it's national. London bars wouldn't burn to the ground if Man U wins the CL but I can assure you they might if England won the WC in 2010. Statistical comparisons should show that CL teams have more skilled players, but then they buy players so it would be only logical that they would. My choice would be WC because it's like the difference between fighting a guy for money and fighting a guy because you have a reason that transcends material possession.
I don't think anybody's argued against the World Cup being bigger than the Champions League. That's a given as far as I'm concerned. A couple of posts into the discussion however points were raised about which has the higher quality teams, and imo I really dont see how the WC teams can be classed as better than teams like Barca and Chelsea. Teams that train together everyday, and buy the best possible players for all positions on the pitch.
Football's not Jesus' specialty. Nor yours ... [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xJT3xwBc2s4"]YouTube - FC Barcelona - Brazil 1999 / RONALDO[/ame] Hurts doesn't it? ...