World Cup 2022 and the Battle between Confederations

Discussion in 'FIFA and Tournaments' started by Iranian Monitor, Nov 30, 2021.

  1. mfw13

    mfw13 Member+

    Jul 19, 2003
    Seattle
    Club:
    Newcastle United FC
    France rested all their important starters....Tunisia would not have beaten (or likely even tied) France's "A" team.
     
  2. mfw13

    mfw13 Member+

    Jul 19, 2003
    Seattle
    Club:
    Newcastle United FC
    In terms of advancing out of the group stage, so far we've got:

    UEFA: 4/13 - Wales & Denmark eliminated
    CONMEBOL: 1/4 - Ecuador eliminated
    Africa: 1/5 - Tunisia eliminated
    Asia: 1/6 - Qatar, Iran, & Saudi Arabia eliminated
    CONACAF: 1/4 - Canada & Mexico eliminated
     
  3. r0adrunner

    r0adrunner Member+

    Jun 4, 2011
    London, UK
    Club:
    AS Roma
    Nat'l Team:
    Italy
    Yes, very suprising.

    However if Germany overtakes Costa Rica and Japan on MD3 UEFA will almost certainly have 9 teams qualified for the KO stage.
     
  4. Anti Santos

    Anti Santos Member

    Sporting
    Portugal
    Jun 29, 2021
    UEFA: Netherlands, England, Poland, France, Portugal. 5 at the moment. My prediction is more 3, only if tomorrow Spain and Germany do the ridiculous and both are knocked out .
     
  5. r0adrunner

    r0adrunner Member+

    Jun 4, 2011
    London, UK
    Club:
    AS Roma
    Nat'l Team:
    Italy
    So your 3 more are presumably Croatia, Spain and one of Switzerland or Serbia?
     
  6. Anti Santos

    Anti Santos Member

    Sporting
    Portugal
    Jun 29, 2021
    My only doubt is between Croatia or Belgium and between Spain or Germany, just expecting a surprise tomorrow from Japan, don't know if by them beating Spain or a draw while Costa Rica draw vs Germany, but something will happen tomorrow.
     
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  7. dna77054

    dna77054 Member+

    Jun 28, 2003
    houston
    Concacaf 3 wins, 0 losses against AFC in Asia. Who would have thought Australia would be the standard bearer for Asia?

    Only 1 Concacaf-CAF game (Canada-Morocco) tomorrow.
     
  8. vancity eagle

    vancity eagle Member+

    Apr 6, 2006
    One of my main questions before this WC was this ?

    Would the implementation of the UEFA Nations League make the UEFA teams even more competitive. Especially the 2nd tier UEFA teams.

    I honestly thought that it might but I think based on the evidence so far, it's a resounding NO.
     
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  9. HomietheClown

    HomietheClown Member+

    Dusselheim FC 1971
    Sep 4, 2010
    Club:
    --other--
    Small sample size though but it seems like Nations League is hurting more than helping.

    In friendlies past you could experiment with new lineups and not have to worry about pressure. That is when good managers got see diamonds in the rough come out of nowhere and change things like mad scientists.

    Now teams are just relying on the same old same old players and same old tactics. Playing not to lose. There's no imagination or innovation.
     
  10. vancity eagle

    vancity eagle Member+

    Apr 6, 2006
    But a lot of experimenting was done in Nations League.
     
  11. HomietheClown

    HomietheClown Member+

    Dusselheim FC 1971
    Sep 4, 2010
    Club:
    --other--
    We must have seen different matches.
     
  12. glennaldo_sf

    glennaldo_sf Member+

    Houston Dynamo
    United States
    Nov 25, 2004
    Doha, Qatar
    Club:
    FL Fart Vang Hedmark
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Well this is pretty awesome, still have the groups to play their final games but we have every confederation advancing....
     
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  13. HomietheClown

    HomietheClown Member+

    Dusselheim FC 1971
    Sep 4, 2010
    Club:
    --other--
    Oceania is crying as they read this. ;)
     
  14. Anti Santos

    Anti Santos Member

    Sporting
    Portugal
    Jun 29, 2021
    I don't agree much with that point tbh. If we look into what is happening and what happened on the Nations League what you have is this.

    Wales knocked out. League A - finished last in the group behind Poland, second place for Belgium and first for Netherlands. only the last was eliminated, 2 already in the last 16 and one still has a chance if they beat Croatia.

    Denmark knocked out. League A - finished behind Croatia and ahead of France, ok they were bellow their level but France already qualified and I guess Croatia only needs a point.

    I can talk about the group of Portugal. Spain first (11 points) Portugal second (10 points) and Switzerland third (9 points). Portugal already qualified and Spain and Switzerland with good chances of reaching the last 16, if Switzerland is knocked out by Servia it will be by a Nation who was on League B.

    2014 WC out of 12 UEFA teams only 6 advanced to the last 16, everyone was mocking European teams because it looked a Copa America, in the end it finished with 2 European teams on the top 3.

    No, I am going to tell you, the Nations League has been a great idea, even for smaller nations like Georgia or Luxembourg in the Continent, England and Germany without taking it seriously use the competition to make tests.

    Make no mistake, 8 or 9 teams in the last 16 is not a disgrace, and beside that, do you think where the top players of the other confederations are playing? They play in UEFA top leagues against top european players.

    Football is globalized, people should embrace the World Cup for what it is, if a African team or the USA reach the last 4 so be it, if Argentina or Brazil win instead a European Nation so be it, doesn't mean everything is wrong, it means football is globalized.

    By the way I am against the model of Euros with 16 teams and World Cups with 48 teams, think Africa deserved more spots but don't see improvement for the World Cup with 48 teams.
     
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  15. Anti Santos

    Anti Santos Member

    Sporting
    Portugal
    Jun 29, 2021
    No it isn't hurting at all, in 2014 you had 6 UEFA teams out of 12 playing in the last 16 and 2 finished in the top 3. There was no Nations League and everyone in South America was mocking European teams and it made no difference to the 2018 WC.

    If football is globalized it means teams from different Confederations can beat each other. Or you think Denmark lost to Australia because they played in the Nations League? Makes no sense what you are saying.
     
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  16. glennaldo_sf

    glennaldo_sf Member+

    Houston Dynamo
    United States
    Nov 25, 2004
    Doha, Qatar
    Club:
    FL Fart Vang Hedmark
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    eh.. Australia can count as both? :D

    Honestly, after the opening fixtures if you'd told me that an Asian team would advance but that team would be Australia I'd have said get your head checked but there you have it.

    Regionally, kind of a shame that the Arab / Middle Eastern teams are dropping like flies at the moment... Qatar, Iran, Tunisia, Saudi all out. Morocco is the last hope basically. They should make it though
     
  17. mfw13

    mfw13 Member+

    Jul 19, 2003
    Seattle
    Club:
    Newcastle United FC
    I think the Nations League helps lower level UEFA teams but hurts the top-level teams by making it almost impossible for them to schedule friendlies against teams from other confederations.

    I'm sure there were a few European World Cup qualifiers who wished that they could have used the September window to schedule friendlies instead of playing Nations League matches.
     
  18. Jon Stakes

    Jon Stakes Member+

    Egypt
    Nov 18, 2022
    A win is a win. Context matters somewhat, but it is still a win.
     
  19. vancity eagle

    vancity eagle Member+

    Apr 6, 2006
    I see what you are saying but not simply measuring things by how many UEFA teams advance. That can be misleading, especially when you have a poor team like Poland advancing.

    Have the 2nd tier UEFA Nations improved because they have a more competitive NL ?

    I would say the view test is NO.

    Poland look just as bad as they've always been but lucked out with a cake group.

    Serbia was hyped but couldn't beat a Cameroon side that has one of the worst WC records.

    Denmark lost to the worst Aussie side in decades despite having a great Euro record

    The Swiss just look to be the same pragmatic side they've always been.

    Wales are perhaps the worst team in this entire tournament. (At least Qatar gives it a go)

    Holland look way overhyped despite their advance.

    Belgium have been a massive disappointment.

    Again I'm talking about level of play rather than points or number of teams advancing.

    It hasn't been good overall from UEFA other than a few top sides.
     
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  20. Anti Santos

    Anti Santos Member

    Sporting
    Portugal
    Jun 29, 2021
    But Poland would play like this with Nations League or without it. The purpose of the Nations League wasn't to make medium European NT's to play like a Guardiola team.

    The purpose was to replace pointless friendlies and to increase the number of matches between top European NT's and not so top to generate more of this games outside the Euro Qualifiers where for example Portugal playing against Serbia or Ireland were our more difficult tests.

    Do you think playing 2 times against Spain, Switzerland, even Czech Republic after dreadfull qualifiers Portugal had didn't helped Fernando Santos to understand what he needed to improve for the WC?

    They are competitive tests, but the word is that. Tests for Euros and World Cups. Is it really new that teams with defensive approaches like Poland reach the last 16?

    Or you never see defensive teams on the AFCON? Egypt under Queiroz made my eyes cry. It's football, it's globalized, and European teams will lose against other Confederations, it was already happening, and it's positive for Football that other Confederations are stronger, it's not bad.

    Just relax and watch the last 16, if England and Netherlands are knocked out on Saturday we will have a serious discussion here the next days... :laugh:
     
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  21. almango

    almango Member+

    Sydney FC
    Australia
    Nov 29, 2004
    Bulli, Australia
    Club:
    Sydney FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Australia
    I've stated a few times on these forums that I thought this was our weakest squad since the 1980's. Now that they have performed better at a world cup than any of our previous teams I might have to make a reassessment. Maybe they are the epitome of the old saying "a champion team beats a team of champions". Maybe Argentina do to us what France did, but even if that happens this team has carved their own place in Australian football history.
     
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  22. guri

    guri Member+

    Apr 10, 2002
    Oceania 100% in the next round. Beat that anybody!
     
  23. Anti Santos

    Anti Santos Member

    Sporting
    Portugal
    Jun 29, 2021
    And what about giving credit to the coaching staff and Australian players instead blaming the UEFA Nations League?

    If I had to go by this logic then Peru who finished fifth in the most Competitive Qualifiers in the planet (CONMEBOL) they should have smashed Australia who finished behind Saudi Arabia and Japan in Asia.

    We are trying to find reasons for everything, reality it's not the first time a so called "Dark Horse" from Europe completely flops (Portugal 2002) or a UEFA team who plays crap football no one likes and they reach the last 16.

    Sorry, it wasn't directed to you personally, it's just a indirect continuation of my argument with @vancity eagle . Following days will be fun if Netherlands and England get knocked out around here. :ROFLMAO:
     
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  24. Nani_17

    Nani_17 Member+

    Nov 3, 2011
    Club:
    Real Madrid
    It's cool to always point out the games to match what you'd like to believe, but you do understand that this can all be measured. So if UEFA hasn't been having a good tournament yet is averaging 2.69, (2nd right now to CONMEBOL) are you agreeing all the other confederations are worse?

    Also its likely Spain and Germany win tomorrow.
     
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  25. Anti Santos

    Anti Santos Member

    Sporting
    Portugal
    Jun 29, 2021
    It was worse in 2014 and everytime UEFA teams play outside Europe or in the Southern Hemisphere it is marked as the big decline of UEFA teams.

    But somehow majority of the times they are the majority in the last 4. How is the Nations League to blame for Denmark playing crap against Australia is beyond me.
     
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