With the death of the Confederations Cup how much does the Gold Cup actually matter?

Discussion in 'USA Men' started by moleman, Jun 6, 2019.

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On a scale of 1-10 how much do you care about the Gold Cup now without the Confederations Cup?

  1. 1 - I don’t care at all and won’t watch any matches

    9 vote(s)
    13.0%
  2. 2

    6 vote(s)
    8.7%
  3. 3

    4 vote(s)
    5.8%
  4. 4

    7 vote(s)
    10.1%
  5. 5

    6 vote(s)
    8.7%
  6. 6

    11 vote(s)
    15.9%
  7. 7

    15 vote(s)
    21.7%
  8. 8

    6 vote(s)
    8.7%
  9. 9

    4 vote(s)
    5.8%
  10. 10 - I care a lot, and this tournament is equivalent to the World Cup for me

    1 vote(s)
    1.4%
  1. TKyle

    TKyle Moderator
    Staff Member

    Columbus Crew
    United States
    Dec 28, 2014
    Nordecke’s Porch
    Club:
    Columbus Crew
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I wouldn’t be surprised if the Confed Cup comes back in time for 2025.
    Think about these things:

    Qatar is very busy using slave, er, um contracted foreign labor to rush to get all the new stadia ready for Nov 2022. Having them ready by 2021 is doubtful, hence the cancellation. Prepping American, Mexican, and Canadian stadia by summer 2025 will not be a problem.

    FIFA has had to make nice with UEFA and European clubs to move WC 22 from the sweltering heat of the Qatar summer to the heart of European league and Champions/Europa League play in Nov and Dec. That wasn’t gonna happen for the “lowly” Confed Cup.

    $$$. In 2025, the Confed Cup would be in the US (and Canada and Mexico). Attendance for it would likely be outstanding, considering if Mexico is the CONCACAF entrant (sadly I’m being realistic) and would draw well north and south of the border, and the large diaspora of people from other countries around the world that live in the US and show up for their home countries’ matches in the US. And of course there’s the TV revenue. FIFA is not known for turning down opportunities to make some cash.

    I think we’ll see it again.
     
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  2. HomietheClown

    HomietheClown Member+

    Dusselheim FC 1971
    Sep 4, 2010
    Club:
    --other--
    I don't think we will see it again.
    FIFA has already said they are focusing on a larger Club World Cup to be held the summer of when the Confederations Cup would be held.

    They also wanted to focus on a Global Nations League Final which is similar to a Confederations Cup on a neutral site but it seems like those plans have been scrapped..
     
  3. skim172

    skim172 Member+

    Feb 20, 2013
    I think it still matters, because it is still the championship of the region. "Champions of CONCACAF" isn't very impressive, no - but you gotta play the hand you're dealt. In the larger scheme of things, I think Mexico, Costa Rica, USA, and any other CONCACAF team with aspirations to truly play on the global stage needs to start thinking about the future of the competition, now that the Confeds Cup is dead.

    My suggestion is maybe work out an arrangement with CONMEBOL for the Gold Cup winner to get one of the "at-large" berths in Copa America. With the rise of "Nations League" formats, it looks like CONMEBOL is gonna be stuck inviting Asian and Oceania teams for their 2 inviteess. Surely, nabbing at least one team from CONCACAF would make for better viewing figures.

    You'd have to rejigger the schedule a bit to get it to work out. But I think it would be a good motivator for the teams to win the Gold Cup, if it meant qualifying automatically for the following Copa America. And CONMEBOL gets a team like Mexico or Costa Rica or USA, whose fans would actually be interested in the Copa - as opposed to a B side from Asia with a smaller fanbase treating it as a glorified friendly.

    If it worked out, you could even expand it - Copa America goes to 16 teams, with at-large berths for the top three finishers at Gold Cup (would make the 3rd place match actually matter).


    Of course, CONCACAF would never allow it, because they'd get all huffy and say it diminished the Gold Cup's value. They'll steadfastly cling to the pretense that CONCACAF is as equally big and important and competitive as CONMEBOL - and there'd be no way to maintain that if the CONCACAF championship became relegated to a qualifying tourney for Copa America.
     
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  4. Nick79

    Nick79 Member

    May 4, 2015
    Club:
    Olympiakos Piraeus
    It's very important to win this Cup, So what if it's mostly little crappy countries? The USA is a little crappy country in the soccer world, so THIS IS THEIR LEVEL. Anyone who just wants to tune up for the World Cup run all the time is delusional, the Gold Cup is probably the best trophy the USAMNT has ever won, so hell yeah, I want to win it again! There is some competition Mexico IS BETTER THAN USA, Canada, Jamaica, Honduras, Costa Rica are decent. I enjoy the Gold Cup, UNLIKE the World Cup, my team has a REAL chance to win it, so GO ALL OUT and don't act like you're just using it as preseason for the WC. It's the North American Championship, so why not at least claim supremacy somewhere for 2 years.
     
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  5. Nick79

    Nick79 Member

    May 4, 2015
    Club:
    Olympiakos Piraeus
    USA is a NOBODY, always has been, it's funny how people act like the Gold Cup competition is beneath them, IT IS THEM, it's the USA's level, How far has USA ever gone in the WC, probably Mexico, Costa Rica, Honduras, some of those countries have gone just as far. Gold Cup is a big deal, it is USA's LEVEL. IMO they are often beneath Mexico so they aren't even #1 in the group. So don't be delusional and act like anything below the WC is beneath the USA, IT ISN'T.
     
  6. Nick79

    Nick79 Member

    May 4, 2015
    Club:
    Olympiakos Piraeus
    What did it matter? It mattered because the USA won a trophy, any trophy! Do you not comprehend that the USA, might NEVER win the World Cup EVER? You should celebrate any success instead of whining about not winning the WC, USA winning the WC would be like if the Detroit Lions or Cleveland Browns won the Super Bowl.
     
  7. moleman

    moleman Member

    Jan 7, 2017
    The current US team is poor, but to say that they’ve done no better than Honduras or the others is wrong.

    Honduras: Only has qualified for 3 World Cups and has yet to win a game in one.
    Jamaica: Qualified for 1 World Cup (1998) and won 1 game (against Japan) and lost the rest of its games
    Panama: Qualified for 1 World Cup (2018) and went winless.
    Trinidad and Tobago: Qualified for 1 World Cup (2006) and went winless.
    Canada: Lost all of their games in the only World Cup they ever played in (1986).
    El Salvador: Hasn’t qualified for a World Cup since 1982 and has lost all of the games they played in the 2 World Cups they qualified for (1970 and 1982).
    Guatemala: Has never qualified for a World Cup.
    Belize: Has never qualified for a World Cup.
    Nicaragua: Has never qualified for a World Cup.

    This tournament should be below the US and the only excuse for not making the final is going out against one of the other two halfway decent / serviceable teams (Mexico or Costa Rica). It certainly is below the interest of the overwhelming majority of US-based soccer fans and winning it does nothing to prepare the US team for real tests against top competition.

    In its current state, (outside of rebuilding the entire program like we are doing now) it should be used to bloody young, new players to decide who else will participate in World Cup qualifiers and higher-profile friendlies.
     
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  8. moleman

    moleman Member

    Jan 7, 2017
    It should be celebrated if it’s treated the way it should be with new, young, unestablished players coming together to win it with ease. It means that our youth system might be working since we don’t have to rely on our senior team to beat up the minnows of CONCACAF.
     
  9. OfficeSpace

    OfficeSpace Red Card

    United States
    Jun 8, 2019
    Our fans are really ignorant.
     
  10. Nick79

    Nick79 Member

    May 4, 2015
    Club:
    Olympiakos Piraeus
    No, they should GO ALL OUT to win this, I was pissed last night when they changed the whole 11, those of you that act like the USA is or ever was WC contenders, are delusional, I expect that the Gold Cup is the biggest trophy they will ever win in my lifetime. Sure, USA is better than most Gold Cup teams, other than Mexico, but I wouldn't expect to win the knockout stage if they don't play their VERY BEST players, and no, I don't want to lose this Cup to pretend to be practicing for a World Cup win that isn't going to happen anytime in the for seeable future. I just want to win the Gold Cup for the TV entertainment of it, and so the players can get a trophy they'll NEVER get at the World Cup.
     
  11. chad

    chad Member+

    Jun 24, 1999
    Manhattan Beach
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Gold Cup matters for cap-tying purposes. Other than that it’s essentially meaningless.
     
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  12. Nick79

    Nick79 Member

    May 4, 2015
    Club:
    Olympiakos Piraeus
    Why is it meaningless? What else do they have where they are serious contenders? It's the North American Championship. What do you think, that they are serious World Cup contenders with a real chance? Besides the World Cup, what other tournaments or competitions do they play in? Personally, I think it's important to win supremacy on the field SOMEWHERE and not just say, we're better than North American scrub teams, so we'll just rest up for the World Cup. You're talking about a team eliminated from the WC by T&T and acting like the Gold Cup is beneath them? LOL! :)
     
  13. Baysider

    Baysider Member+

    Jul 16, 2004
    Santa Monica
    Club:
    Los Angeles Galaxy
    Why are you pissed? Changing the 11 is about winning the gold cup. It gave the starters a game of rest which gives them a better chance to win the next games.
     
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  14. Nick79

    Nick79 Member

    May 4, 2015
    Club:
    Olympiakos Piraeus
    If that's the case fine, if it's about preparing bench players for a World Cup in 3 years, NO, try to actually win the tourney you're in TODAY. It's not preseason for Qatar, it's this years Super Bowl for this team.
     
  15. chad

    chad Member+

    Jun 24, 1999
    Manhattan Beach
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I find your rhetorical questions extraordinarily persuasive.
     
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  16. moleman

    moleman Member

    Jan 7, 2017
    It’s meaningless because the majority of fans say it is. Look at the poll above (only ~30% so far rate it at a 7 or above). Nobody is going to pat us on the back for beating up non-top 30 teams.

    Of course we should try to win the thing, but if we can’t do it with our young players you have to ask what in the world have we been doing over the last 30 years in terms of youth development? Our best players don’t need to be here because hopefully they’ll be playing for competitive teams in the top leagues around the world where a scrimmage during practice is infinitely more valuable to their development than suiting up to face a team that’s not even ranked in the top 60 teams in the world.
     
  17. Nick79

    Nick79 Member

    May 4, 2015
    Club:
    Olympiakos Piraeus
    Personally I WANT ALL THE BEST PLAYERS THERE, because to me, it's a stand alone sports competition that I am watching for entertainment and not at all about "development for the future". When did sports stop being about winning today's game and being only the "Super Bowl" matters and everything else is "meaningless".
     
  18. owian

    owian Member+

    Liverpool FC, San Diego Loyal
    May 17, 2002
    San Diego
    Club:
    Liverpool FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    To answer the poll I definently think this matters. It's our continental championship. And it's not like we are to good for this. For the record we haven't won the "real" Gold Cup since 2007. Let's start winning it every cycle before we start poopooing it.
     
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  19. 50/50 Ball

    50/50 Ball Member+

    Sep 6, 2006
    USA
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Exactly.

    PSG and Celtic still want to win the league. That's job one. Win the Gold Cup, finish first in WCQ group,finish first in the Hex, win the group etc. We should look to dominate every step of the way. We have not been the number one team in our own confederation for years. The idea that we are too good for the Gold Cup is ridiculous.
     
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  20. sXeWesley

    sXeWesley Member+

    Jun 18, 2007
    Club:
    Portland Timbers
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Whatever you might lack in perspective, you more than make up the difference with enthusiasm.

    Saying the gold cup is a crappy second rate tournament full of nations with journeyman players and not much to get excited over, is entirely separate from saying we are too good for it.
     
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  21. owian

    owian Member+

    Liverpool FC, San Diego Loyal
    May 17, 2002
    San Diego
    Club:
    Liverpool FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    It might be a second rate tournament compared to the W.C., and what isn't, but literally what else do we have to compete for?

    If you can't get excited about the US winning the Gold Cup than what's the point of following the USMNT?
     
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  22. moleman

    moleman Member

    Jan 7, 2017
    The point is to watch and hope they continue to improve / become serious contenders on the international stage.

    Winning the Gold Cup is the expectation not an aspiration for the US, who outside of Mexico are the only other country to have won it multiple times in the last 20 years (Canada got one in 2000). Hard to get excited when it’s the same two horse race every time. Hell, I’m going to the final in person on Sunday with some friends since I live in the area, but I’m under no illusions that this Cup means anything besides bragging rights over Mexico / making a few fringe Mexico and US players happy to have a chance to play at some kind of tournament at the senior international level.

    For me (without the Confederations Cup any longer) dominating World Cup Qualifying is infinitely more important than the Gold Cup.
     
  23. moleman

    moleman Member

    Jan 7, 2017
    If they wanted to make the Gold Cup matter they should host it less (once every four years) and give the winner direct qualification to the next World Cup (aka a free pass on having to go through the Hex / one fewer qualifying spot in the Hex). Suddenly no team would be sending their backups and everyone would be invested in the outcome.
     
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  24. Suyuntuy

    Suyuntuy Member+

    Jul 16, 2007
    Vancouver, Canada
    It's the continental tournament. It should be as important to the member nations as the other continental tournaments are to their member nations.
     
  25. almango

    almango Member+

    Sydney FC
    Australia
    Nov 29, 2004
    Bulli, Australia
    Club:
    Sydney FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Australia
    I'm with you 100%. Winning this tournament means you are Confederation Champions. That's an out come in itself. World Cup is a different tournament. It's actually easier to qualify for the World Cup than it is to win your Confederation Championship (unless you are in OFC). If you ask me if I would rather win my Confederation Championship or qualify for the World Cup, my answer is I want to do both, but qualifying for the world cup is more likely.
     

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