Why is the semifinal only one game?

Discussion in 'MLS: General' started by mlsfan31, Nov 11, 2003.

  1. mlsfan31

    mlsfan31 Member

    Nov 1, 1999
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Why not make it two games? It would make the post season a bit longer. I would enjoy two extra high charged MLS playoff games.

    We watch six months of slow games and when the real MLS entertament stars its too short.
     
  2. Matteo

    Matteo New Member

    Jul 21, 1999
    i think it's one game because they wanted the higher seed to have an actual home-field advantage.

    a 2 game home and home doesn't really give a true home field advantage. otherwise what would there be to play for in the regular season?
     
  3. cleazer

    cleazer Member+

    May 6, 2003
    Toledo, OH
    Club:
    Columbus Crew
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Besides the home-field advantage mentioned above, MLS also wanted to drastically cut the number of playoff games. In years past, we have seen terrible attendance for many playoff matches. MLS was hoping that by cutting the number of playoff matches, it would create more excitement for the remaining matches. This plan seems to have worked, as the 8 matches played so far have seen a much higher attendance average than playoff matches of the recent past. MLS saved a lot of money by switching to their new playoff format this year, and I hope they keep it the same for next year.
     
  4. brianzappa

    brianzappa Member

    Oct 21, 2003
    In a big country
    In addition to the above reasons, the semi-final is actualy each respective Conference Final.
     
  5. MasterShake29

    MasterShake29 Member+

    Oct 28, 2001
    Jersey City, NJ
    Club:
    New York Red Bulls
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Because if you have to have playoffs, they should make the regular season as meaningful as possible. Easiest way to do that is a single game at the higher seed. I would have preferred the first round to do the same, but you take what you can get.
     
  6. FanSquared

    FanSquared New Member

    Nov 11, 2003
    Semifinal

    Tough call. Aggregate score is used all over the world. Should be here too.
     
  7. Revs007

    Revs007 Member

    Nov 11, 2000
    Boston
    Re: Semifinal

    And it was used for the first round.
     
  8. shuvy87

    shuvy87 Moderator
    Staff Member

    Oct 17, 2003
    USA
    Club:
    Liverpool FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Japan
    Re: Re: Semifinal

    In Europe except for the final, Home-and-home aggregate series is used. I don't really count the conference final as "final."
     
  9. MasterShake29

    MasterShake29 Member+

    Oct 28, 2001
    Jersey City, NJ
    Club:
    New York Red Bulls
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Re: Semifinal

    True, aggregate goals is used in the Champions League knockout rounds, UEFA Cup, and Copa Libertadores (among others). But those are continental competitions where teams enter as "equals".

    The correct analogy for MLS is either the national leagues or national cups. Many (although not all) leagues use a single table with no playoffs. National cup formats vary, although I'd guess the majority of the major ones are single-elimination (like England). But those aren't always seeded either.

    In any event, absent world agreement, we should do what is the best approach. And I think, until a single table format can be used (16-18 teams), single elimination is best because it rewards the regular season the most while not dragging out the playoffs forever.
     
  10. ElJefe

    ElJefe Moderator
    Staff Member

    Feb 16, 1999
    Colorful Colorado
    Club:
    FC Dallas
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Re: Semifinal

    There are plenty of competitions where aggregate score is not used.

    I know, they're dinky little competitions like the FA Cup and the World Cup, but hey, let's get the facts straight.
     
  11. mlsfan31

    mlsfan31 Member

    Nov 1, 1999
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I understand MLS saving money and top teams getting home field but it would be nice to have the post season or playoffs be a few more games.

    Hope they can fix it to keep it all with a longer post season.
     
  12. superdave

    superdave Member+

    Jul 14, 1999
    VB, VA
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    They would have used NFL-style knockouts, but the guys that run the league believe (actually, I think it's just Lamar) that hosting a playoff game helps build the fanbase.
     
  13. Wizardscharter

    Wizardscharter New Member

    Jul 25, 2001
    Blue Springs, MO
    Re: Re: Semifinal

    Yes, let us do that.

    Those competitions you mentioned are either blind draw to eliminate advantage by design or shouldn't have any built in advantage to them because of inherent neutrality.

    Completely unlike those listed above, the MLS Playoffs absolutely should reward the teams that have earned the distinction over 30 games.

    The Semi should not be one game either. One-offs invite flukes. Having the final as a one-off is fine because by the time the final comes, flukes should be eliminated. It should be a series (which by definition is at least 3 games).

    Hey, wait. First-to-5 is a 3 game series. It simultaneously rewards fans with a home game, supplies a true home field advantage to those that have earned it, mostly eliminates flukes, and provides a proper stage for what playoffs are all about - the drama of contrasting emotions built into the peaks and valleys over multiple games.

    MLS should probably return permanently to that.
     
  14. Nico Limmat

    Nico Limmat Member+

    Oct 24, 1999
    Dubai, UAE
    Club:
    Grasshopper Club Zürich
    Nat'l Team:
    Switzerland
    Agree completely...
    Don't agree. I'm in favor of the MFL playoff system:

    - 2 legs (home & away)
    - If agg. scoring is even, the higher seeded team advances.
     
  15. Fanaddict

    Fanaddict Member+

    Mar 9, 2000
    streamwood IL USA
    Club:
    Chicago Fire
    Nat'l Team:
    United States


    Totally disagree you should have to win the game on the field.I don't like it when a team is tied on goals and advances either on an away goals rule or because it is a higher seed. Win the damn game. I hate home and home series because the first game is not do or die, it is like the first half of a 180 minute game.Home and home series allow teams to play for ties or not to lose by a lot of goals.

    One game knockout giving real home field advantage to the team that earned it over the regular season.Then every game is do or die.
     
  16. Greddy

    Greddy Member

    Jun 24, 2003
    Chicago
    Club:
    FC Barcelona
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I like the FMF system. And one could argue that the team has won on the field, only over a 30 game season that is pretty much meaningless otherwise.
     
  17. mlsfan31

    mlsfan31 Member

    Nov 1, 1999
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Should be two game home and away with OT.
     
  18. Nico Limmat

    Nico Limmat Member+

    Oct 24, 1999
    Dubai, UAE
    Club:
    Grasshopper Club Zürich
    Nat'l Team:
    Switzerland
    We have the Open Cup for that kind of knockout "excitement."

    Let's see...

    - 30 games for one game with home support (that could be nonexistent, as seen with the paltry KC crowd) that might end in a farce.

    or

    - a 180 min. series that has the higher seeded team advancing if aggregate scoring is even (rewarding their effort in the regular season.)


    Maybe it's just me, but the choice is crystal clear.
     
  19. Fanaddict

    Fanaddict Member+

    Mar 9, 2000
    streamwood IL USA
    Club:
    Chicago Fire
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Oh yeah, MLS doesn't need that much excitement.

    Yes the choice is crystal clear, one game knockout or the regular season is meanigless.
     
  20. roarksown1

    roarksown1 Member

    Mar 30, 2001
    Playa del Rey, CA
    Club:
    Hamburger SV
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Tell that to Columbus and Dallas...
     
  21. Nico Limmat

    Nico Limmat Member+

    Oct 24, 1999
    Dubai, UAE
    Club:
    Grasshopper Club Zürich
    Nat'l Team:
    Switzerland
    You honestly think that one, one game with home field advantage is worth 30 games?

    I don't.

    But then again, opinons are like assholes - everybody has one.
     
  22. ElJefe

    ElJefe Moderator
    Staff Member

    Feb 16, 1999
    Colorful Colorado
    Club:
    FC Dallas
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Re: Re: Re: Semifinal

    The historical statistics don't really support your assertion that one-offs "invite flukes." Here's how home teams have done in the playoffs over MLS history:

    1996: 11-6
    1997: 7-5
    1998: 9-5
    1999: 12-3
    Overall in best-of-three era: 39-19

    2000: 12-2-2
    2001: 10-3-3
    2002: 11-3-3
    Overall in first-to-five era: 33-8-8

    But some of those home losses have been by lower-seeded teams, teams that wouldn't get a home game in single elimination. How did the higher-seeded teams do at home?

    1996: 8-2
    1997: 2-4
    1998: 6-1
    1999: 9-0
    Overall in best-of-three era: 25-7

    2000: 6-1-1
    2001: 7-3-2
    2002: 7-1-3
    Overall in first-to-five era: 20-5-6

    So, as you can see throughout MLS' history, the higher-seed has done extremely well at home. Only 1997 stands out as an exception, but that's mostly due to the improbable Western Conference playoffs where #3 Dallas swept #2 LA, #4 Colorado swept #1 KC, and #4 Colorado swept #3 Dallas.

    But still, most of those games were not "victory or death" games, where there was no tomorrow. In most of those games, a loss meant that things would be much, much more difficult, but not they wouldn't be over. A better analogy to a one-off playoff would be Game 3 in best-of-three, or Game 3 in first-to-five when both teams had won a game:

    1996: 3-1
    1997: 0-0
    1998: 1-0
    1999: 3-0
    Overall in best-of-three era: 7-1

    2000: 2-0
    2001: 1-1
    2002: 1-1
    Overall in first-to-five era: 4-2

    So, like I said, there's not much statistical evidence that single-elimination would "invite flukes." Would there be upsets? Sure. But "inviting flukes?" No. And the better teams throughout the regular season would have a significant advantage. It would make the battle between #2 and #3 in a conference something worth fighting over.
     
  23. Nico Limmat

    Nico Limmat Member+

    Oct 24, 1999
    Dubai, UAE
    Club:
    Grasshopper Club Zürich
    Nat'l Team:
    Switzerland
    I wouldn't say it "invites flukes", but the chances of a fluke happening are positively greater than with a 2-leg series.
    There's definitely an advantage, no question about it. I just happen to think that a playoff system modeled after the MFL provides an even greater advantage to the higher seed.
     
  24. kenntomasch

    kenntomasch Member+

    Sep 2, 1999
    Out West
    Club:
    FC Tampa Bay Rowdies
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Dustin, you know better than that. People don't want to be shown that their worst fears are unlikely to happen - they want to bitch that it still could happen, dammit!

    Still waiting for all those injuries that were going to happen in the MLS All-Star Game and the boos and the mismatch and all that.
     
  25. Guinho

    Guinho Member+

    May 27, 2001
    San Francisco, CA
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Re: Semifinal


    Hmm.. Even though the context and purpose of the matches is COMPLETELY different from that in which aggregate score is used? Great. I love the smell of a mindless drone in the morning.

    G.
     

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