I doubt it’ll be the last, but there might be a break. Which, is understandable. I see them letting the USL Championship gain a little more traction first.
What I want to see next is the strengthening and stabilization of USL... USL Championship West: El Paso Locomotive Las Vegas Lights New Mexico United Phoenix Rising San Diego Loyal SC Riverside/Inland Empire [Expansion] East: Oklahoma City Energy FC Tulsa Roughnecks San Antonio FC Memphis 901 FC Milwaukee [Expansion] Cleveland [Expansion] North: Hartford Athletic Pittsburgh Riverhounds SC Indy Eleven Louisville City FC Baltimore [Expansion] Detroit [Expansion] South: Birmingham Legion Charleston Battery Raleigh FC (North Carolina FC) Tampa Bay Rowdies Fort Lauderdale Strikers (Miami FC) New Orleans [Expansion] USL Championship Expansion Teams: New Orleans Riverside/Inland Empire Cleveland Milwaukee Baltimore Detroit Note: These are the markets that would most improve USL Championship. USL League One: West: Colorado Springs Switchbacks LA Galaxy 2 Orange County SC Portland Timbers 2 Tacoma Defiance Real Monarchs FC Sacramento Republic FC 2 Reno 1861 FC FC Tucson Oakland USL Fresno [Expansion] Boise [Expansion] East: Saint Louis FC Austin Bold FC Rio Grande Valley Toros FC Chicago USL Forward Madison FC North Texas SC Toronto FC 2 Union Omaha Dayton [Expansion] Des Moines [Expansion] Corpus Christi [Expansion] Little Rock [Expansion] North: Loudon United FC New York Red Bulls 2 Philadelphia Union 2 Queensboro FC USL Rhode Island USL Buffalo NE Revolution 2 Richmond Kickers Rochester Rhinos Harrisburg FC [Expansion] Syracuse [Expansion] Worcester [Expansion] South: Charlotte Independence Atlanta United 2 Inter Miami FC 2 Greenville Triumph Chattanooga Red Wolves South Georgia Tormenta Orlando City 2 Jacksonville [Expansion] Greensboro [Expansion] Asheville [Expansion] Cape Coral [Expansion] Bradenton [Expansion]
Actually, at this time USL Championship is looking to expansion to: Jacksonville Armada (2021) Buffalo (2023) Grand Rapids (2022) Des Moines (2022) Oakland (East Bay) (2021) Cleveland (2022) Queensboro FC (2021) They recently stated they wanted to cap the league at 36, with a push for USL League One expansion
You have Des Moines on the wrong list, according to the owners and the USL. Considering how much the MSA has grown, Des Moines's ranking as the best minor league city in the nation, the long-term attendance success of the Menace, and the presence of an ever-growing portfolio of regional headquarters for multinational corporations, Des Moines has demonstrated that it has what the USLC is seeking. Hell, the city l already has AAA baseball (for over 40 years), the AHL, and NBAGL. Why wouldn't the highest level of minor league soccer want to be in Des Moines?
I wouldn’t get too hung up on the particulars... I’m definitely open to change in this model. Which, in my opinion, should be set up for promotion/relegation between USL-C and USL-1.
Lol the guy that said there was no way they were going past 28 thinks that they are really stopping at 30.
I think we’ll stop through 2022 for now. I believe though around that time frame we’ll add 31 & 32. Depending on the hype around the WC, I could see us expand up to 40. But, I do believe that we’ll only expand at this point if the owners make it too good of a deal to pass up.
FWIW, there's a Carolina Crown drum corps. They won the DCI championship in 2013. Don't know if that carries any legal weight of not.
Expansion may slow down a bit now that the price for entry has skyrocketed over the past 12 months. Going forward prospective ownership groups are going to need to outlay a serious chunk of cash upfront to not only gain entry into MLS, but to get their new team off of the ground. For a new team you'd be looking at $1B+ initial outlay for the expansion fee, stadium, training facility, academy, etc. That's just to build those necessary pieces of infrastructure, you'll also need a decent outlay of cash every year to keep the lights on and operate those pieces as well. MLS may not add any teams for a while, not because they don't want to, but because the number of prospective soccer loving crazed billionaires will be in shorter supply.
what about Las Vegas, who are currently trying to iron out a Stadium plan with their government, and just got an extension to do so? sounds like everyone there are serious about MLS. Yes the price will be steep to get in, but I don't see any signs of slowing down in Las Vegas. The price is high, but the spots are fewer to get in. If you're not willing to pay the price now, you may never get in.
What about Vegas? I didn't say that MLS would STOP expanding. I said that the rate of expansion would slow way down now that the initial costs to not only get into the league, but also to get your new team up and running have significantly increased from just 12 months ago.
I totally agree. Latest reports put future MLS expansion fees at $600M. This would be on par with what was charged by the NHL for its latest expansion club in Seattle at $650M.
I just can't see it. Their are not enough Billionaires or viable markets to support 40 clubs. I believe that 32 clubs will be the max, as indicated by the other major sports leagues in North American.
UH Huh... Forbes sez we have a market for 50 clubs... When u got Billionaires ponying up 500 million for a club, that will expand soccer footprint across the country... I can't see MLS turning it down. Peter Vermes last year expected up to 40 teams before it's done. There is no magic number.
Here what they are reporting on MLS expansion in Europe. https://www.goal.com/en-us/news/par...limax-as-charlotte/1hgc18qw6k84m1elzxf1dzw0tx In the article they have an interview with the soccer Don which basically states that this is it at least till after the 2026 World Cup. So if this holds true you won't hear any further expansion talk till at least 2026 or 2027.
It might be believable if Garber hadn't said pretty much the same thing pretty much every time MLS reached an even number.
Well, the NHL went thru a period of rapid expansion during the 1990s. There was talk of the NHL expanding to 40 clubs at the time. Then they capped at 30 in 2000. Then it wasn't till 2017 that they added the 31st team and have just added the 32nd team coming on board in 2021.
Completely different influences tho.. The NHL froze at 30 because it ran into financial difficulties at that time and had to focus on fixing those issues over expanding. Once the financial situation was worked out, they were able to start expanding again. MLS currently isn't having financial issues like the NHL was at the time, so has no reason to stop its expansion...
My bet is that there won’t be any expansion news until after the 2022 WC other than a little of this here and little of that there. But, all bets are off come that point. If the economy is still surging, billionaires still want to get into the game, and there’s a lot of hype surrounding the 2026 WC here in America; I would bet anything that there are going to be AT LEAST two more teams. Most realistically, I see us getting to 36 teams, with West/East split into 18 teams, and 34 games home/away in total. My front runners for those spots: Las Vegas Lights Phoenix Rising Indy Eleven Detroit Comments: Unless something catastrophic happens; I’m betting these are locks by 2026 to be announced. Strong Contenders: New Mexico United San Diego Loyal OKC Energy San Antonio FC Louisville City Comments: These will be the front runners to contend for those 35 & 36. Still in the Running: Raleigh Birmingham Tampa Bay Riverside Fresno Virginia Beach Pittsburgh Milwaukee Cleveland Buffalo Memphis New Orleans Jacksonville Rochester Omaha El Paso Comments: None of these guys have that strong of bids, but if a billionaire steps up and says hey, I want a team here, then I wouldn’t be shocked to see them in the league. Prediction: No new teams named until after 2022. Between 2022-2026, MLS reaches 36. After that, I see the league beginning to consider promotion/relegation before allowing new teams to expand. Although they may let it get up to 40 before entertaining that idea fully. Nonetheless, I predict it will become a more serious argument in the 2030s or 2040s.
There is probably enough viable markets, (if you consider 1.5 Million population viable). Going by MSA numbers here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_metropolitan_statistical_areas#United_States #38 market Providence RI @ 1.6 Mil population (two teams each LA /NY) #40 market gets you down to Jacksonville @ 1.5m population. The last city at or above 2.0 million population if you want that as a new minimum, would be Indianapolis @ #34. And smallest current city, Salt Lake City is #47 on the list at 1.2 million. Now another 10 Billionaires?
If either a member of the Forbes editorial staff or Peter Vermes were capable of ponying-up the expansion fee necessary to secure a Major League Soccer expansion franchise, I'd be more likely to put m Who is to say how many billionaires are out there that are ready, willing, and capable of "ponying up 500 million for a club"? Also, part of the value of a modern, major-pro sports franchise is contained within the relative scarcity of teams to be had in each league. As such, expanding league membership to 40 or 50 franchises runs the risk of undermining said value. Further, whether fair or not, the leadership of major-pro sports leagues values the leverage of having empty markets to which they can threaten to relocate franchises for any number of reasons - low attendance, an antiquated stadium, insufficient revenue streams from a stadium, etc. It's safe to say that once a league expanded to 40 or 50 members, said circuit's leadership would be extremely hard-pressed to convince civic leaders in the markets they were already operating in that municipalities outside of the 40 to 50 were legitimate targets for relocation and/or expansion. From where I'm sitting, the notion of any of North America's major-pro sports leagues - including MLS - expanding to 40 or 50 members is a pipe-dream.
Some of the people, all of the time. At least he is consistent. And putting some thought into USL. The only reason they are pausing is no other bid is ready at the moment. A brief look at expansion, contraction, & relocation. 1. 1998: Chicago & Miami 2. 2002: Tampa & Miami fold. --------------- 3. 2005: Chivas & RSL 4. 2006: Houston (from SJ) 5. 2007: TFC 6. 2008: San Jose 7. 2009: Seattle 8. 2010: Philly 9. 2011: Portland & Vancouver 10. 2012: Montreal ----------------- 11. 2015: NYCFC & Orlando, Chivas folds. 12. 2017: Atlanta & Minny 13. 2018: LAFC 14. 2019: Cincy (new Crew & Fire owners) 15. 2020: Nashville & Miami 16. 2021: Austin & Charlotte 17. 2022: St. Louis & Sacramento There is no way MLS stops expanding until they hit NFL/NBA/NHL/MLB size, 32 teams. Now, if they are going to stop at 32 (which I doubt), then there are only 2 seats left, and there are 2 markets that are considerably bigger than all the others left: Detroit & Phoenix. Maybe they try to ensure 1 gets a seat. Or encourage it. Plus, if regional/local rivalries continue to flourish (El Traffico, Cascadia, NY derby, NY/DC, NY/Phil, Crew/Cincy), then proximity to an existing team could be a plus (Raleigh, Tampa, SA, Indy, Det, Balt, CLE, Bay Area, etc). MLS has not gone 3 years without adding a team since 1999-2004. Consecutive years would be 2013-2014.