I think we agree. I think bringing Pepe up brings out reactionary responses. I think I said SN gave him a pretty fair shake (particulalry for SN). I think I also said any AM better be consistently productive (I'd agree 10 a year and a boat load of assists is productive) to stay in SN's lineup. Where was I trying to be clever? In thinking the other players have to play in a system that uses the AM? That they have to be able to do something with the passes he gives them? I don't think it is a coincidence that SN doesn't bring in an AM, SN's been here a long time with out addressing AM. Was Pepe his choice? I tend to think he was Clavijo's.
He was answering my question in which I asked him specifically for a Latino player, because I know his background is deep there. I don't think any of us would look sideways at a European or African player (or an Asian player for that matter), but I think the consensus is that most of the desirable players in MLS's budget are south of the border.
He doesn't--except that recent imports from European leagues (Jank, Celades, Zoltan) are skidding toward the end of their careers, and the NE-TFC investment in young Gambians has yet to be proven out. Colombia, meanwhile, has provided a huge boost to MLS rosters in just the past few years. So it's about finding a league/nation with proven yet affordable players who also have a desire to leave their country, combined with the specific skills needed to survive in MLS. Colombia is that place. That could be Montero, Conde, Benitez, Ferreira, Cuesta, Olave, not to mention Toja--but the number of solid Colombian starters joining the league in the past year combined with the economic crisis could give us a unique opportunity down there for a loan-to-buy on a really good player if we play our cards right.
I don't think there was any problem with Nicol and Cancela - as long as Cancela performed. And I don't think there was any disagreement here about Cancela - as long as ... The disagreements came when Cancela started to fade (IMO) and Nicol lost faith in him. He *was* an excellent player with us for a while, then his physical abilities started to fall off. Considering that he did nothing after leaving here pretty much confirmed that.
FYP Sorry, I had to go for the humor factor, I actually agree with you on this. Cancela sat because he was being outrun by the practice cones (he might have lost a footrace at this point to Stumpy Kelderman).
Okay, if I agree to every opinion you have on Cancela, will you drop it. I'm sorry I brought him up. Please do a global delete. I don't want to have another 700 post Cancela thread. I'd like to ask if anyone else thinks even a "good" AM could struggle if the players around him and the system played don't support his skill set?
i think its just hard to find, and its not just SN that is like this - any team that could bring one in, would. you are talking about a donovan or a dero, maybe a gbs player. if every team could just look up AMs for Hire in the yellow pages and order one up for delivery, they all would, and they would all have understudies. ralston, if he put in a full season, might have actually fit the bill. but if grandma had balls she'd be grandpa. fernando clavijo is probably the only MLS coach ever to commit to AMs regardless of results - he seemed in love with the idea, results be damned.
I thought Cate was good here. 3 goals (not from the spot), 8 assists. I don't know if I'd think he was a good AM (at least not in comparison to what I want from the position).
Ok, good point. You articulated a lot better what I was trying to get across. Probably greedy of me but FWIW my threshold for how I define good is having an output in the neighborhood of 5g+, 10+ assists per season. That's only part of it though - there has to be a lot of things that are unseen in the statistics but are subtleties that impact the team's overall attack. Doing the little things to create opportunities, off the ball runs, having the vision to make the killer pass. I'm sure that I'm asking too much of the Revs to provide these attributes but if I'm in charge those are the on-field components of a good AM that I'm looking for on the Revs. I don't think it's impossible to find someone with these qualities in Colombia as Autogolazo suggested or elsewhere south of the border. For Badilla/Twellman money I think you can finds someone that fits this description.
I think the difference between a good a-mid and a very good or great one is exactly this. A good a-mid help good goal scorers score more. A great a-mid helps almost anyone score more. Cate, at best, was a good a-mid (he was definitely good as a withdrawn striker with the Revs).
Which physical tools does he have? First touch? No Field Vision? No Creativity? No Final Ball? No Change of pace? No Finishing? No He is one of the last people on the team who should be considered an attacking midfielder.
I'm sorry to be argumentative, but field vision and creativity aren't physical tools, his first touch isn't the worst on the team, nobody on the team can finish, and maybe 4-5 can put through a killer pass on their best day. To paraphrase Richard Pryor, if there's two lines - one for the Rev players who could play attacking mid, and one for the players who can't - WT is going to be in that long m----rf----r.
Yeah, I realized that after, and didn't want to go back and change the post, haha. Still he has none of the requirements or skills needed to be a good attacking midfielder. That is a good point
He used to spray around a lot of very good passes, but the problem was that none of his teammates had the same vision and didn't anticipate what he was going to do. It was a classic case of someone playing with a higher understanding than his teammates. Should he have dumbed it down or should they have smartened it up? That was/is a good topic for debate.
Cate was a good prototypical creative attacking midfielder, and theoretically should have been better in MLS. As you suggest, maybe he should have resorted more to route 1 football, because the rest of his team was...to be kind...not that creative. Look at Schelotto for example. If he were not surrounded by good creative attacking players, then his qualities would be lost, like...Gomez in Colorado. Yes an good attacking midfielder can raise the level of creativity on the team as a whole. But, if there aren't players good enough to think along similar lines, then the creativity will be a waste. It is why continental Europeans and South American players hardly if ever succeed in the lower divisions of English football.
I stand by my semi-ridiculous statement. He has the physical tools. He's fast, has pretty decent size, and the energy to play a two way game. That being said, there's no way Wells Thompson is our attacking mid! I'm not sure Cate's teammates were capable of smartening it up. That's the genius of Steve Ralston, isn't it? "Dumbing down" isn't quite the right word for Stevie - too pejorative - but he adapts to his surroundings better than a lot of so-called superior attacking midfielders. He plays more simply with our current crowd, but no less effectively.
Being fast and having size are not physical requirements for an attacking midfielder. Those are the qualities of a winger, outside midfielder, a wingback or an out and out striker etc...Maradona, Schelotto, Blanco, Zidane, Fabregas etc...none of them are big and strong. Attacking midfielders need to be mobile (great workrate), great first touch, creative in passing, strong in possession and the ability to finish when needed.
My original post was a joke, so I feel a bit silly continuing to discuss it. Suffice to say that I agree with most everything you said, but think it has next to no relevance for the 2010 Revs. Sadly I think it's unlikely that we'll get anyone even close to the players you are mentioning. I think we may find someone who brings some of those qualities, but also other qualities that make them a better fit for MLS. I think Blanco and GBS are the exceptions in this league, not the rule. That aside, you still need to think about an attacking option off the bench - almost certainly at MLS pay scale. It's not essential that the spark off the bench be a CAM, but they have to bring more than <every Rev non-starter>. There are things I like about both Thompson and Colaluca, but neither is a complete player at this point. At this point I would definitely settle for Nico's brain on Wells' body.