Howard Dean: Richard Gephardt: http://www.cmonitor.com/stories/news/politics2003/deanside122603_2003.shtml
You realize that Dean is far more statesmanlike in these quotes. Given that the outcomes will be the same (Osama slowly brought to room temperature), it's better it be done in the name of justice than revenge. There's also the uncomfortable prospect that OBL might roll over on the details of the AQ network, something that the Nazis in the Nuremburg trials weren't really able to offer. Do you exchange life in prison for taking more of his network out of commission? I do. Hey, if he doesn't give up his network, then plug him in like a Christmas tree, my heartfelt opposition to the death penalty notwithstanding. But the possibility is out there.
Well, if we get nothing else out of this thread, we at least now know that Ben thinks "electable" = "appeals to mitten-wearing mouthbreathers". Not that that's necessarily incorrect, mind you. It remains to be seen.
Perhaps, though Gephardt realizes we're at war, something Dean has yet to figure out. In any case, the issue I'm raising is electability. Sounding a lot like Dukakis about 9-11 isn't a good sign.
Ben used two quotes and bold text for one line. Knowing his position from other threads I agree with you, but in this thread he hasn't made any comment. What is most scary of Ben is that he thinks you can make a selection from two quotes based on one issue. I guess the question of electability should be in parts. What is your most pressing issue? Which candidate addresses your concerns best?
Sure you can. For example, "if your wife was raped and murdered, would you favor an irrevocable death penalty for the killer?" How a candidate answers that question says a lot about his electability.
Not really, in this case he asked the question, "Can someone this mealy-mouthed about OBL get elected nationally?" No, probably not. I don't know what the source of that quote is, but if Dean persists in stuff like that he will get squashed like a grape.
To me, the War is not the make or break issue. Keep reading the whole thread. Besides, if the two candidates answer in pretty much the same manner, you'd need a secondary issue to make your selection.
I agree, but it's surely more important than the death penalty was in 1988. The point is that Dean is out of touch with mainstream voters.
Dick Gephardt is opposed to fair trials? I suppose I'd vote for the guy who doesn't hate the Bill of Rights when you put it that way.
Do you have any evidence to back up your assertion? Since the $87B request, I think the polls have been split 50-50 more or less, depending on the wording, and the events of the preceding week.
First of all, I'm commenting specifically on his Bin-Laden response, which was Dukakassy. Regarding the war: "Looking back, do you think the United States did the right thing in taking military action against Iraq, or should the U.S. have stayed out?" Did Right Thing Should Have Stayed Out DK % % % ALL 62 34 4 Republicans 84 11 5 Democrats 35 60 5 Independents 67 29 4 Trend: 12/14-15/03 63 31 6 CBS News Poll
I thought the left hated it when Iraq and Osama were mixed? Besides, do you have a point? Maybe 100 billion dollars would do the trick?
As opposed to a revocable death penalty? The correct answer to this question is, "If you were wrongly convicted of raping and murdering the wife of a presidential candidate, would you still be in favor of the death penalty?"
I'm confident that Loney is even less electable than Dean Loney would probably still argue that the furlough for Willie Horton was a great idea.
So, are you saying that Dick Gephardt's views don't represent the views of the majority of Democrats? Phew, thanks for that info. You ARE making a strong case for him not to get the nomination.
Gotcha. I thought you were talking about his war position. And like I wrote, it depends on how the poll is worded. It's pretty easy to see how the one you quoted is gonna give Bush a nice number.
So, in other words, regarding the war he's a mainstream Dem. And his universe of voters (people who aren't already Reeps) is split pretty evenly down the middle where the most likely determinate of the majority opinion is "what happened in Iraq in the past week". Of course, this isn't accounting for the idiots still drinking the "Saddam was behind 9/11" Kool Aid. So maybe Ben is right about most Americans being a bunch of cretins and the more you pander to misinformed dumbasses, the greater your "electability". Personally, though, I think that the economy will drive this election. If we keep losing soldiers in Iraq without capturing OBL, though, the war may become a bigger issue than I think it is now.
Wait a minute. Wasn't Saddam captured on 12-13? I'm sure I could find a poll taken the two days after we lost 16 soldiers in the helicopter shoot down that would give a somewhat different answer.
The more electable guy is the one who can get more votes. And right now, it looks like the guy who can get the most votes is Dean. There's a less than 50% chance that the nom could end up being Clark (though he probably needs The Clenis' endorsement to win), but one thing that's clear is that it won't be Dick Gephardt. Iowa: Dean 42%, "favorite son" Gep 23% New Hampshire: Dean 37%, Gephardt 4% South Carolina: Dean in 1st at 16%, Gep tied for fifth at 7% Ben -- Some time within the next three weeks, reality is going to set in within the Gephardt campaign. Please don't be so bitter about it that you can't rally around the nominee in our efforts to defeat the real enemy.
"From what you know now, do think the United States did the right thing in taking military action against Iraq last March, or not?" Right Thing Not Right Thing Don't Know % % % 12/18-19/03 62 32 6 11/6-7/03 55 38 7 10/23-24/03 59 34 7 10/9-10/03 56 37 7 9/11-12/03 64 31 5 8/21-22/03 61 33 6 7/24-25/03 68 28 4 Newsweek
That depends entirely on whether you think beating George Bush is the goal or winning the nomination.
More votes amongst the general population, not the McGovernites voting in Democratic primaries. It will be a lot closer than that. George Bush is my President, hardly the enemy. Another example of Dean being out of touch (he said that exact same thing). Talk to me about rallying around the nominee when we have one.