They seem to have a plan. Start a pro league. Focus on the first team, then use the money to drive youth teams. It's not all that different than what the US did. It takes time to affect things. It seems to me youth development is as strong as its been systematically in Canada in a long while. CPL is starting to generate chances, MLS is being more productive. Excuses is just a silly word that focuses on blame rather than cause. Is the cause of the most recent loss indicative of where Canada is going? Doesn't seem necessarily so. Their pro league is too young; many of the MLS prospects and European prospects weren't released/didn't go. Their youth pool isn't massively deep, but it's clearly improving and there's things in place to keep improving it. Is it more likely the base fundamental issue was lack of prep time, perhaps bad coaching? Yes. Are those pretty solvable things? It can take money, but Sure. I found this kind of bluster and rhetoric pointless and actually counterproductive when it was used with the US but we clearly had a plan, and I think it likely is here as well.
I disagree with the 0 upside. Before CSB came along, CSA had no clue how to handle its marketing and media rights. Just to think that the CSA used to pay cable channels to get the National team on TV - CSA turned that around by selling them to MediaPro and cutting a check to the CSA. Also, it's CSB/CPL that provided that organization with it's own D1 (finally) - an embarrassment that this didn't happen before and I never bought into that there was no corporate money in Canada, I think that the idea was never pitched properly/competently until Bob Young, Scott Mitchell and Paul Beirne started working on it. Also, look at BC League 1, CSB played a major role in it's launch and look at how further along League 1 Ontario is with the creation on Canada League 1. CSB is doing what the CSA should have done decades ago... at a fee. Actually, Scott Mitchell of CSB came out and agreed with the players. The fact that they didn't know about the CSA/CSB deal was just as shocking to CSB as it was to the players. That's on the CSA to properly inform the players on its affairs but the players have also a responsibility to proactively inquire about such business. It's just recently that they made a hiring to represent them and keep them in the loop at the CSA level. Clearly, before the team got successful, players weren't that interested until the extra cash came in. I'm not blaming them but that CSB deal was made in 2018 or 2019 - that's not a good look on them either. Those clowns needs to go. The CSA hasn't adjusted to the recent success of the national team - the governance and who get appointed based on which merits needs to be completely revamped
That's the same Guatemala that eliminated Mexico no less. You have to keep in mind that most of them play domestically on the better clubs of their D1 league and are used to one another. Same for the US for that matter and even the DR. When you look at Canada's and I think you touch on player's selection - too many academy players with limited playing time at a pro level gets selected either because the better prospects (who aren't many) aren't released by their clubs and the pool of players having 1st club minutes is too shallow. Only Justin Smith from Nice and CPL players were the ones with consistent playing time at a good level and happened to be the ones looking better.The players on MLS 1st team aren't playing that much whn you compare with the other team rosters. Not sure what you mean by making "excuses" - not many will disagree that the performance was disappointing but pointing out the "obvious" matters. It's not an excuse to point out the obvious that there was no D1 league in this country since 1992 and COVID slowed down CPL operations significantly as early as season 2. As pointed out earlier, this will change with CPL having a U21 mandatory Canadians minutes rules - (2000 minutes per club). It will get better, no doubt about it.
Dino Bontis being there is weird to me (the CSA president's son no less) Also, I think the bulk of the pro minutes were clocked by the CPL players because Campagna and Zouhir don't really see that much minutes in MLS and I'm excluding academies. BC League 1 having their 1st season under their belt along with L1O and PLSQ - that's more youth players that will play in CPL and clock more minutes. What you want to see in future competition is all of them playing 1st club minutes at pro level and almost no one attached to academies. I watched the games and you looked at how defense reacted to guys clocking way more minutes than them in a competitive environment and that told much of the story For me, Mauro Biello has a bias towards MLS academies and we saw that with some of his decisions for the U23 selection where...wait for it - we under-performed. New people with fresh ideas needs to handle the youth teams - Let Biello worry about the senior team only
To be fair player selection issues are something every team has to deal with. The US was missing a ton of guys who they couldn't get released, and Mexico couldn't bring in Flores who is far and away their best player at the U20 level.
The overarching issues to this outsider seem to be a power struggle between the CSA and the main investors behind the CPL & CSB. The CMNT is finally having a period of real success, and promise of a sustained bright future. Those running the CSA see this as their opportunity to finally make some real money. In some ways it's mirroring the USSF in the 90's where a small handful of individuals is looking to consolidate their power and influence over the game, while also growing their own personal wealth. They look and see how Montagliano parlayed his time as head of the CSA to being the head of Concacaf and gaining a high level seat at FIFA's table, and they want that too. On the other side of the coin, you have the money backers behind the CPL. They're the ones who have real skin in the game. They are the ones who stand to lose if their venture and vision isn't successful. So now we have the CSA which doesn;t have the money and apparently the vision to make Soccer a sustainable and successful venture in Canada. They still want to have all the say and governance over the game. They also have few revenue streams to get money to fund their programs. Not many friendlies are played in Canada, and there won't be any WCQ's for the next 6+ years either. With Nation's League here to stay, high profile friendlies in Canada will be difficult to come by too. The CSA is in a tough spot The group behind the CPL and CSB are spending millions and millions of dollars to grow the game at all levels in Canada. IMO they may be trying to do too much at the same time (IMO they should first stabilize and build out the CPL before building the lower levels). Regardless, they're spending real money to grow Soccer in Canada. If they're unsuccessful they will lose a lot of money. Naturally they want to have a lot of say over how their money is spent, and where it's being spent. IOW, they want a say in how the game is organized at all all levels in Canada since they are the ones funding the efforts. It's interesting how the CSB/CSA/CPL relationship is being viewed by fans, investors, stakeholders, players and the media. In some ways it's similar to the USSF's relationship with SUM/MLS in the early 2000's to very recently. Hopefully this power struggle wont impede the progress too much.
Well, I think the relationship is intentionally like the MLS/SUM/USSF relationship -- it was literally patterned that way -- but I think there's a characterization difference here. It's clear that some part of the CSA leadership is much like USSF was -- in completely alignment with the relationship. And it makes complete sense. The most important thing is development of professional teams. It really is. That was true for USSF then and frankly, still now. The anti-MLS sentiment was much more from fans, the press, and people not in USSF leadership. And actually, it was driven largely by people who wanted a cut of USSF money. The differences here seem to be that someone in the CSA didn't have all their ducks in a row and get everyone on board ... OR there's a power struggle inside it that some are looking to exploit (which is what I expect). Toss in players who want cash, which the USSF never had an issue with because a) they paid better and b) the players mostly benefited from MLS but the CMNT players don't benefit from CPL salaries ... and it's a bit different. I guess my point is that it was never USSF v MLS/SUM. It was always Pro/Rel Truthers/Riccardo Silva/Eurosnobs/Klinsmann v USSF/MLS/SUM. (And yes, there were legitimate conflict of interest concerns, but USSF leadership was all in on the partnership). This seems like "Part of CSA/CSB/CPL" v "Part of CSA/Players" conflict. Bluntly, I think the contract is too long for the money they got, but the concept is not bad at all. It's money well spent to grow your fledgling league. And revenue certainty is really nice for a federation that is mostly funding more fixed expenses. The issue of player bonus v federation spending is different than if the federation got value for media rights from the CPL.
Reading the article over part of the issue is they tried to replicate the SUM deal, but didn't quite get it right. Their biggest mistake is locking themselves in for 20 years of payments from CSB that at least to me seem below their future market value. In the first ten years they are getting $3 million a year to start and they top out at $3.5. And then the next 10 years its 4 million a year. In an ideal world they would have signed a six year contract or something along those lines, which would have provided the chance to renegotiate in the lead-up to the 2026 World Cup. USSF definitely was getting a much more reasonable payment from SUM compared to what CSA is getting from CSB. Now in some ways this is meant to be a subsidy of CPL so they would be expected to give up some of the value they'd be getting otherwise. But it seems like there's too much of an imbalance here. I'm not sure how the prize money would end up going to CSB though as that doesn't really fall into broadcast or sponsorship revenue. The other factor is that SUM had the 2006 and 2010 World Cup rights to package with US Soccer and MLS rights, which definitely helped in growing the amount of revenue available.
That valuation seems low for the timeframe. I will say this, though: the English media rights for US Soccer only went for ~$26M. Yes, Spanish language rights and a few other things will add to that ... but I'm actually wondering now if we may be a bit off. I still think you don't lock in that long, but I'm not sure the number is as off as it sounds. They weren't going to get $8M or something, I don't think. ------------------------------------ The other thing they potentially screwed up was not going through the correct governance. I think people don't realize how small these federations can be in terms of number of people and control, but if certain things need to be approved by the board per the bylaws, then the board needs to see them. The inter-board squabbling is either someone breaking pretty serious governance rules or part of the board trying to pin the blame of a bad deal on someone else. Knowing federations, it could be either.
What and how many games are they broadcasting though? Nations League and Gold Cup TV rights are controlled and sold by Concacaf. With no World Cup Qualifiers until 2028, how many games are they talking about here? If Canada is invited to play in Copa America, those rights would be handled by Conmebol and Concacaf. I agree it sounds like a small amount. There were quite loud cries about SUM only giving the USSF $30M / year for their TV rights. As we've seen with the deal that the USSF signed after ending their partnership with SUM, they didn't get all that much more for their TV rights. Small inventory of games to sell, and how many of those will be attractive matchups? In the CSA's view, having a set amount that they can budget every year is useful. As fans we tend to overvalue these things.....
Well it’s also not just broadcast revenue, CSB appears to take all sponsorship revenue too (which is a decent revenue source for USSF). I just think it’s bad business to lock yourself in for 20 years when things are clearly on the upswing in Canada when ir comes to soccer. Maybe you don’t see a huge bump, but you at least are able to see if it’s there.
Yeah, the timeline is the problem, not the current payment. Worth noting that there will be no home 2026 WCQ, which is a big chunk of a Federation's games. I'm sure there will be friendlies, but I imagine that doesn't sell as well. And if a Fed pulls a Qatar, which is smart, they likely get nothing.
Damage control rebuttal! Canada Soccer update https://t.co/3KUAyPeVy4 pic.twitter.com/aQVIExBoO1— Canada Soccer (@CanadaSoccerEN) July 13, 2022
Sure, I get all that. How strong is the Dominican Republic's professional league? All the other nations dealt with COVID. All the other nations have player selection issues. All of the other nations have issues with their players in this age group getting minutes in pro leagues. [Even Mexico U20s don't get a lot of time in Liga MX.] All I know is that Mexico fired its sporting director (its entire department actually) and U20 coach yesterday due to their program failures. Heads are rolling. They also fired their women's coach after their 1-0 loss to the US women in their WC qualifying event. No such thing as a moral victory I guess. Mexico fires sporting director Gerardo Torrado, women's coach Monica Vergara after World Cup woes - sources (espn.com) Its called accountability. I don't see accountability from up North. I see "circling the wagons" and rationalizing poor performances. 7 straight failures at the U20 level mean a federation-level problem. If you actually CARE about performance at this level, something has to change. Just saying "kids are going to get more playing time in the CPL" doesn't solve the issue if its a federation problem. You have enough talent to beat Cuba NOW in 2022.
Lol @ this. You just can’t make this up. Canada Soccer announces Earl Cochrane as General SecretaryMORE: https://t.co/B2zPh5X4VL pic.twitter.com/Hm0D7owQEN— Canada Soccer (@CanadaSoccerEN) July 13, 2022
Catching up to the Haitian & Jamaican leagues - if they aren't already there. The point is that younger players sees minutes and that helped them get results. Doesn't mean this will translate at senior level CPL is the youngest league of the continent. It only had 1 season before COVID while everyone else had several Perhaps but in the case of your Mexico example - they trained with the 1st team in a high level professionals environment, same elsewhere (level may vary) but they are with the 1st team for the most part and train with their senior counterparts. The CSA has been allowed to operate in utter indifference for decades. They haven't changed with the times and aren't used to be held accountable by the players, media - let alone the general public. Outside of Montagliani / Montapoli management - it's been terrible. Good on the players, media and fan to demand better. Hoping Bontis takes the hint and leave. You're not teaching us anything we don't already know - CSA governance is terrible and I have little hope for it. CSB restructuring the game in Canada is one of the only bright sides to all of this. Canada being a regional power will be as always "in spite" of the CSA. The difference is that CSB is laying the foundation to make this success sustainable and not a 1 time fairy tale like 1986 or 2000
The CSA really likes to double down don't they?? The USSF hasn't been a model organization either. MLS has succeeded because they took control of the own destiny, not because the USSF did a lot to help them. There are parallels between Canada and the US. As soon as Soccer started to gain mainstream traction (i.e. Domestically) and people started to make money from it......lots of folks suddenly wanted in. Neither Fed is known for being transparent either. Although IMO, that's largely because FIFA and its' Confederations have never been fully transparent. That type of behavior tends to flow down from the top. There are many other parallels too.
Agree with your statement and no Fed anywhere seems super competent for a variety of reasons. That all said, it's worth noting that when the players call for transparency, they are also conveniently calling for the extra information that says how much the Federation can afford to play them while in a salary negotiation. I, too, would like to know my employer's budget when negotiating my deal.
Well, seeing as the federations are supposed to be non-profit public organizations their budgets should be public knowledge.... Part of the lack of transparency can be attributed to private business owners/executives running a public organization. I'd imagine they tend to lean on the skills that have made them successful executives/business owners. Those people aren't used to having to divulge their budgets to the general public. To your point about contract negotiations. Each side wants every advantage they can get in order to negotiate the best deal.
Bam! Luton Town have agreed a deal to sign Cavalry FC striker Aribim Pepple. #ltfc— Pete O'Rourke (@SportsPeteO) July 16, 2022
Lol - i still remember the posts calling me a heretic for calling CPL a good league... CPL to Championship having existed for only 4 years. What will it be 10 years from now...
👋𝐖𝐄𝐋𝐂𝐎𝐌𝐄, 𝐖𝐈𝐋𝐋𝐈𝐀𝐌 𝐀𝐊𝐈𝐎🦌William has today joined County from Canadian Premier League side Valour FC! Let's do this🤝 @willyakio— Ross County FC (@RossCounty) July 17, 2022
It has a lot of room for improvement but the quality of play has noticeably improved over the 3.5 years it’s existed. I’m looking forward to the 9th team joining next year in B.C and the rumours of new ownership in Edmonton coming to fruition.