WOAH, HOLD UP GUYS! The hysteria that we are experiencing now is clearly JUSTIFIED. It is easy to make all the excuses in the world, but we SHOULD be panicking (sp?) due to how we have behaved in the past year and a half. Sure, it was just ONE GAME, regardless of how big it was, IT WAS JUST ONE GAME. And even the best screw up on at least one game (some even 3, France WC). But looking back at the past year and a half, two years, most of our dynamic and optimism for the future has been based on ONE GAME. Regardless how big it was and its immense importance, it was just ONE GAME. We got the last spot in World Cup qualifying, we played horrible in the Confed Cup and are not going to the next one, are not going to Copa America because we did'nt even get to the final in the Gold Cup and are now not in the Olympics after being demolished by a far superior Mexican side. Oh but yes, there was the World Cup. Our group play was mediocre at best and we fought hard but lost to Germany. Lets be realistic, South Korea put us into the second round. BUT , and we have made this a HUGE BUT We beat Mexico 2-0, and since then we have been transformed into a world contender, a better team than Mexico and are going to take the Cup in 2010!!!!! GO USA!!!! ONE GAME If we were to be fair, this should be the end of the world, But lets be realistic, its not. And if we are to be realistic about that, we must also realize that Mexico is a better team than us, we will probably not qualify 1st for the World Cup out of CONCACAF, 2010 is OUT OF OUR REACH TO WIN, we still have many years to go to be a world power, we still need players who can hang with the reast of the world, we can't rely on counterattacks to win. But we have a good future.
South Korea? Oh I thought we beat Portugal. Guess that 3 - 2 victory was just a dream. Along with the 1 - 1 tie with South Korea. And I'm sure that CONMENBOL only PRETENDED to invite us to Copa America. guess your right. Losing a U23 match is the end of the world. Even if we were missing about 5 starters. Even if it was in Mexico. Even if Mexico was playing out of its mind crazy well. We're not EVER going to be distinctly better than Mexico. Have you ever heard of the term "Cyclical"? Get your facts straight and do some research before you start posting stuff like this.
Did I ever say we didn't beat Portugal? We played bad against Korea and were killed by Poland. I would consider that mediocre. Whats so hard to understand?
We did have a great World Cup. We were unlucky not to beat Portugal 3-0. I would agree with Solid444 though because we should have done much better in the Confederations Cup, the Gold Cup, and Olympic Qualifying. To be a world soccer power and contend for the World Cup in 2006 and 2010 we should be able to walk through the Gold Cup and Olympic Qualifying.
#1. Lets be realistic, South Korea put us into the second round. we put ourselves into the 2nd round. Poland DID NOT kill us. They ogt a good first goal. A bad call took away our tying goal, they scored again while we were still arguing. We dominated for 80 minutes. Missed about 5 goals, and put one in the net. Poland got lucky is what they did. Stop taking away credit from us. #2. we must also realize that Mexico is a better team than us. In what way do the UNDER 23s represent the senior side of Mexico? When was the last time the senior Mexico team beat the senior USA team OUTSIDE of Azteca? #3. 2010 is OUT OF OUR REACH TO WIN So you can see into the future? Did you know that Turkey would finish 3rd in the World Cup? And then not even reach Euro 2004? Did you know that South Korea would defeat Portugal, Italy, and Spain in consecutive matches? It would be impossible to accuratly predict a quarter of the starting line up in 2010 yet you're already saying that we won't win it.
#1. Poland lucky? Give me a break buddy, you can break apart every single game and take credit away from goals and give credit for misses and make every winner lucky and every loser unlucky but it doesnt change the score or who the winner is. I could do the same thing for US-Mex but that wouldnt be fair. South Korea's goal in the 2nd half against a portugal team playing for a tie put us into the 2nd round, theres no way around it. #2. Apart from the WC game Mexico has had more success in the past. You cant be better than a team that has decisively won the last two big tournaments that both teams competed in and qualified on top of us for the WC. Any team can beat any other team on any given day, and just for that, it doesnt make them the better team. Imagine who we would consider best teams in the world if we used these standards. #3. Of course I can't predict the future and ANYTHING is possible. But then, using your standards noone should be able to predict anything. The Denver Nuggets will not win the NBA Championship. Does that mean they have no chance of winning? Of course not, if so they wouldnt be wasting their time playing. But lets be realistic her and use some God-given common sense. And yes Turkey is a great squad deserving of 3rd place. My point was that the US will not be in shape in 6 years to be the best team in the world!!! I dont get how you can get that through your head. Sure there are suprises, and underestimated teams get far but tell me of the last time when an underestimated or unapt team won the world cup, good luck.
We qualified before Mexico. If we had played for a win in our last match we possibly would have finished above them in qualifying.
man I hate to think about how much server space this thread is wasting. actually not likely to be much while we are still only on page one, but every little bit counts as they say.
Hmm...You seem to be of the opinion that just because you would like to be contenders in 2006, that means you should have done better in those tournaments. Now I've seen a few wild extrapolations used to predict future US success, but that's the first time I've seen someone interpolate from a desired future point to complain the current team is underachieving. To put it more simply, if/when the US team is good enough to be condenders they will probably do much better in other tournaments too. Cart. Before. Horse.
Solid444 I hit on some of the same points as you but being that im not wanted in these parts of town my thread got moved to World Rivalries.. take a peak : https://www.bigsoccer.com/forum/showthread.php?s=&threadid=96206
As long as MLS continues to progress, we have nothing to worry about in the long term. The continued growth of MLS is the only thing that matters.
What a way to take what I said out of context. I am making the point that all the "success" that we have had for the past year and a half and all the optimism and future predictions of supremacy basicly revolve around one big game. And if we were to be consistent, we should be panicking if we loose one big game. Dont take what i said out of context and then respond with something smart.
We should panic ???? WC 2006 - NO. With CONCACAF having 3.5 places, then I can't see the USMNT not getting a direct place (1-3) or (in 4th place) not winning the play-off with an Asian team for the ASIA/N. American shared place. Where after that in the finals tournament ? My guess probably last 16 but not certain about last 8. Definitely not last 4. WC 2010 - Too far away to tell. WC 2014 - Gimme a break ! I personally don't think that the US footballing setup can sustain any further improvement (internationally) until Football becomes as mainstream as the NFL / NBL / NBA in the USA. It's exactly the same dilemma as Football in Australia, not being the main sport (that is, as supported by the population of the country). Andy T.
I hate to think about how much time reading this thread is wasting... ...but I do like cheese. Do you?
Solid you bring up an interesting point. CONSISTENCY But that's the thing as tournaments go : good consistency is something all clubs & nations aspire, but don't always achieve.... In World Cup play let's look at 'multiple' WC winners ((just go with me on this one)) most recent winning in paranthesis. THE DATA: Brazil (Jaoorea 02') Germany (Italy 90') Argentina (Mexico 86') Italy (Spain 82') Uruguay (Brazil 50') Not menitoed are the 1-timers France (France 98') England (England 66') THE QUESTIONS: Did England have the best team in 66' ? A lot of people'd say Brazil was fouled out of the tournament esp. poor Pele .... after all they won 58' 66' 70' Germany won 54' Switzerland against the legendary Hungry team of Puskas, Kocsis, Hidegkuti. Days before the tournament began Hungry beat England 7-1 and in the 54' WC they routed the German side 8-3! The same team that would hand them defeat in the final days later. if this game was played 10 times (imagine like a coin being flipped) I'd suspect that Hungray would win 8 out of 10 times. Same thing in Germany 74' ... Germany knocked out the amazing Dutch team nick-named "Clockwork Orange" (i.e. Cruyff) Again if this match was replayed 10 times... i'd say Netherlands would win 8 out 10 times.... What about the most famous upset of all-time. The Uruguay win in Maracana' If this game was replayed i'd say 6 out of 10 would be won by Brazil.... but that's how it goes... that's why it's soccer - the great slow-down Speed chess game (with no comercial stops) - that is as much pleasure to play as it is to watch - like life you get penalized for the slighest tactical error- and like life you get rewarded for good preperation and out-thinking and out-performing your enemy. On a final note I'm glad you care about the U-Nats Solid but as a fan we take it as it comes - even if it's an ugly win of 2-0 over Mexico in 02' it's still a win. Was I thrilled how the US Nats played against Mex? No. But was I happy when the marker read USA 2 MEX 0? You better believe it. ~ s94
Wow! There's a lot of wailing and gnashing of teeth here! However, Solid444 makes a good point. If you objectively look at the results -- and quality of play -- from the last two years or so, we haven't done as well as many think (certainly as well as some of us would like). We DID advance to the Quarterfinals after beating our archrival -- which was great -- but we haven't been playing top quality, consistent ball over the last two years. On the other hand, we have been getting some good results. That, in and of itself, tells me that even not playing our best game, and getting results, is a positive. If you look at where we are now vs. two years ago, you can see some of the warts and blemishes. But if you compare where we are now vs. six years ago, you can definately see the progress we've made. Add on top of that, that we also haven't really had the top US team playing in these tournaments or as good a line-up as we will have in the Holland game this week, I think we've still continued to move ahead. If nothing else, to get some younger players some good experience at the top level. I think the Holland game, with our top team against their top team, will be a true measuring stick (albeit only one game -- and a friendly at that) of where we are. But even so, our quality of play is so much more important that the final result of this friendly. If we play poorly and win, that doesn't mean we don't have a lot of work to do. If we play well and lose, it doesn't mean the sky is falling. Results matter. SOMETIMES even more than quality play. But to continue to get positive results, the play has to stay at a high level. From this point on, we really need to concentrate on being good -- consistently good -- to continue our progress.
Re: Solid444 Don't act like the martyr. You're a known Mexico fan, and that was a wind up. That's why it was moved.
of course...no one mentions that we havent played one match with our "A" team since the World Cup... the Olympics..uggh
First off all, pay attention to Tree's post, we haven't seen our first choice lineup on the field since the Mexico game 1.5 years ago. We'll see it on Wednesday, but I wouldn't put too much stock in that game. Friendlies and 2nd rate tournaments are no way to judge a teams quality, and look at some of the lineups that Bruce has put on the field and players he's brought into camp, Wolyniec, give me a break. If we fail to qualify for the world cup then you can hit your panic button, even then we'll still develop as long as MLS is around and maturing, but hold off for now.