I hope we win but they always play us so tough. They have basically no strikers though so that is good. But we basically have no experienced CBs other than Oscar who is probably dead tired right about now playing so many minutes including at high altitude. Not sure how Rueda will set us up. Either Cuesta is going to get his chance in a pressure filled match or someone like Medina or Tesillo may have to move to CB which they both play in Mexcio.
Seriously 3 points is needed to cushion our situation despite still being in the top 5 over the last few games. How we're not under is convenient due to the other matches going as they have.
Chile with some players out: https://gol.caracoltv.com/eliminato...ntar-a-colombia-echaremos-mano-de-los-jovenes
We may need to win but with a makeshift back line it makes it much harder. I think we can win but it will be very difficult.
Still can't understand how no Lucemi, he's stand alone probably our 3rd best CB but even if he wasn't you can have 3/4 of a backline playing together every day and use him in a pinch but we can't do that because Rueda would rather call up any player who's got ties to Nacional.
I am not sure how you can say he is our 3rd best CB when he has played like one official match for us and you do not watch him in training (for Colombia). Rueda obviously does not think he can add anything and does not like what he sees in practice.
Rueda did not call Lucumi to the June qualifiers and was not originally going to call him to Copa America either. Rationalizing his absence by saying Rueda "does not like what he sees in practice" is ignoring an inherent low estimation Rueda has of Lucumi since the start, before anybody had ever practiced under him. And this point, "you do not watch him in training (for Colombia)," is so dismissive, dude. We watch all these guys play for their clubs on a weekly basis. Outside of a few practices every few months, club performance is the primary data Rueda uses when selecting players, too. The only that thing that should measure above that is the actual performance in matches Colombia plays, which are even fewer. If what you say is true, "Rueda obviously does not think he can add anything and does not like what he sees in practice"--than this is exactly why Rueda is unfit to be our coach. Lucumi can clearly add something. He does it weekly for his club and has been for years now. Meanwhile, the starting CBs (one of them in particular) don't add anything close to what could be considered an untouchable backline. But wait, that shouldn't matter. Sanchez' performance yesterday means nothing because he probably has been practicing well...
The fact of the matter is Rueda did see him train during the Copa America. And he obviously scouts his club team with three Colombians on it and he came to the conclusion that he did not want him for these crucial games. I am in the minority here obviously but I liken people clamoring to see Lucumi play a bit to when people really wanted to see Bernardo Espinosa play. Maybe that is a bit extreme to compare but the guy has played one official game for Colombia against Paraguay and looked average to me. When I see him play at his club he sometimes looks a bit awkward and clumsy and not really the style of CB Rueda typically goes for.
Take it from me. I was the guy in this forum who constantly dispelled any bidding for Bernardo. That dude was average at best, only a factor in the aerial game and nothing else. Lucumi is a much better player than Espinosa ever was. I'm not sold that Lucumi is the 3rd best option we have, but he's certainly an option. Davinson and Mina would NEVER have been undisputed starters 10 years ago. There's really no reason for Lucumi not to be on the roster at the very least...especially when both the Murillos have been banished from the NT for months on end after disastrous matches. That's happened to both of them more than once. My main gripe here is not about Lucumi, btw. It's Rueda. If we do not see Cuesta against Chile than we're in serious trouble. If he doesn't play, it'll be because, as you say, Rueda will not have "liked what he saw in practice." The reality is Rueda is only fielding 3 different CBs, with one of them clearly lower on the pecking order than the other 2. Why hasn't Rueda called someone else to the roster than if Cuesta doesn't impress in practice? If Cuesta and Lucumi suck (they don't) than Rueda sucks even more for not trying to find somebody else when Davinson and Mina get injured or benched at their clubs regularly. If Tesillo gets the nod over Cuesta, Rueda will be rewarding a guy who has notoriously sucked every time he plays for Colombia.
The bulk of football by these players are played at club, he has lots of games at club, he has lots of stats and metrics, he's highly sought after by clubs that usually are very good at evaluating talent. I've seen him play and watched his games, he's a good player and has a very high ceiling. That's how people evaluate players, sure what a manager sees in training matters but there is no point in arguing unknowns for what's going on in Rueda's head who thinks that Chara and Perez were good call ups and initially also didn't think Barrios was a starter and that Andrade was better off the bench then Sinisterra. People who play for Colombia and at club are in fact the same players, they may not fit in systems but that's another argument and I'm not really sure how Rueda can be so sure with such a small sample of training and ignore the large body of work he's put forward that paints a different picture. If we went and polled 100 scouts and managers how many do you think would rate Oscar higher then Lucemi?
Those are all questions that should be asked to Rueda by the media. We can only speculate what he is thinking and what he wants from back line players. But based from what I have seen him expect at Nacional and currently in the few games he has managed for Colombia I can try and come to some conclusions. Going back to this match, I think it is more constructive to talk about the players we do have on the roster instead of complaining about players who are not on the roster. Medina plays CB in Mexico and can be flexed in there. Cuesta has a good chemistry with Munoz so they may start together and help ease in his debut. Munoz has even played some CB but I would not trust him in a game like this against agressive Chilenos. Tesillo plays better at his natural position of CB BUT has played way too many minutes for us and in Mexico so I would probably sit him for this one. I am not sure there's many other options.
Let's just close the forum down then since we can't know what's in Rueda's head and can't question the undisputed genius who started Perez and called up Chara and didn't initially want to start Barrios.
There are players who play brilliantly for their clubs and never do a thing for their National team. They are different games really with different styles and expectations. It is very difficult to say he is our third best CB when Rueda did not even want him on the squad. But I trust his judgment more than you and others here obviously.
There's small remnants of contextual clues as to why each of those players were on the roster and used in various situations. No one is saying to close the forum or threads. I am just saying it is more constructive to talk about what is going to happen in reality on Thursday and what are the options.
We've heard this argument over and over again on this forum about players who were doing really well at club and quite often when the sample size normalized and they got more games under their belts they end up being who we thought they were. Bad players look good and good players look bad in small samples with new surroundings and teammates they aren't used to, it happens over and over again and people over value a small sample size which is likely to normalize out to when given more time and opportunity to play.
That is fine and dandy but talking about guys like Lucumi and Alzate and saying things like they are the best at doing things when our manager does not even think they should be called up is a bit of an exercise in futility in my book. You are free to do so, but I would want to focus on what we can do to win on Thursday (in this thread) with the players we do have and what we think Rueda should do in context.
Going back to CB options I forgot about Llinas. Starting him instead of Cuesta might be even more alarming and head scratching to people around here though.
Simply saying I'm sure the manager has his reasons adds nothing to the conversation, and adds no value or insights that people don't already know. We're on a Colombian soccer forum because people have opinions about the team and what they think should be done. Do you think that our opinions will change what the manager does or that criticizing and questioning him will hurt the team? IDK this isn't a forum for us to give our allegiance to dear leader Rueda, I have my opinions about the players and what they offer and if I didn't want to think and discuss those things I wouldn't be on this forum.
I am within a Colombian soccer forum for many reasons. The reason I made this thread is to talk about the Chile game and focus on what our Manager is going to do to win that game. I do not have any allegiance to anyone and I do not care if you have any allegiances to anyone. I am just trying to figure out what he will do on Thursday to try and win within this thread and trying to focus on reality.
Ok I didn't read the guidelines on the thread beforehand and didn't realize that me saying Lucemi is the 3rd best Colombian CB wasn't allowed. Clearly I should have studied Rueda more to try and predict what he will do since he's the ultimate judge and jury on Colombian talent because of his ability to see training. You don't have to comment on everything people said, if you don't want to talk about Lucemi then by all means bypass the post, but no need to try and police how people discuss the team and the game.
It is not policing. It is trying to steer the conversation into a practical real world conversation. It seems like you like to bring up hypotheticals like if James were in our lineup or if Alzate were in our lineup or in this case Lucumi our 3rd best CB was on the roster etc. etc. I have ignored most of the posts you do pertaining to these imaginary callups and lineups... ...believe you me. This time I was just baffled and bewildered a bit by how Lucumi could be considered our best 3rd CB and just had to say something. But alas, I will just ignore it and move on to what I think should be the majority of these types of threads, tactical and formation prognostications based on the roster we have.
You realize that our previous manager who you were cheerleading just like this guy had Davinson/Mina/Jeison and Lucemi judged as our depth on CB and clearly imo Jeison blew up and played horribly so at worst the previous manager had him one off of 3rd which imo is where he's at. But yes simply because Rueda the same guy who calls up Jimmy f'n Chara from the MLS and Perez out of the abyss has Oscar Murillo as the 3rd choice its crazy how a 23 y/o starting CB in the champions league linked to Atalanta could be considered 3rd best in our depth chart.
I cheer for Colombia. I do not cheer for any manager. I try to look at things through each manager's eyes though and be empathetic to each of their views and biases. This goes back to every manager we have had going back to the Maturana days. Bringing up players he trusts within his system only strengthens my point on that.