Victims of a Campaign- The Other Footy Teams Thread

Discussion in 'Arsenal' started by GunneRy, Mar 25, 2015.

  1. GunnerJacket

    GunnerJacket Moderator
    Staff Member

    Sep 18, 2003
    Gainesville, GA
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Jinx!
     
  2. CarlosKaiser

    CarlosKaiser Member+

    Arsenal
    United States
    Jul 30, 2018
    Kansas City
    This happened quickly, guess he isn't going to United.

     
  3. footykid

    footykid Member+

    Jan 10, 2005
    Mississauga, Ont
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Nat'l Team:
    France
    More than anything this deal just shows how bad the Antony transfer was. Gapko is a significantly better EPL-level wide player. Even with my reservations about his production if he isn't dominating ball possession for his team.
     
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  4. maskito

    maskito Member+

    Arsenal
    Jan 14, 2006
    Nashville
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Seems very reasonable value. Hopefully this also helps us with negotiating a better price for Mudryk
     
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  5. mebeSajid

    mebeSajid Member+

    Feb 16, 2009
    Atlanta, GA
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    How are they going to play all these people?
     
  6. casoccerdad47

    casoccerdad47 Member+

    Mar 31, 2006
    I don’t know their injury timelines, but Jota, Firmino, and Diaz are all out injured. Ox started at left wing today and pool ended the game with three teenagers on the pitch.
     
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  7. ArsenalMetro

    ArsenalMetro Member+

    United States
    Aug 5, 2008
    Chicago, IL
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    And he was awful. Worst player on the field for them even taking Darwin's horrific finishing into account.
     
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  8. And_ROOS

    And_ROOS Member+

    Dec 30, 2006
    Melbourne, Aus
    I did think about it before I posted it, but I have had the bad luck of catching a few Spurs games while waiting for our matches and they have a habit of letting bad teams get the jump on them, then they reel them back in before getting the draw.
    The good thing is, in the general football threads I follow, this leads to the hilarity of Spurs fans realising that every game is following the same horrendous trend.
    Go behind early, be sad. Equalise, be angry that you went behind but at least you aren't losing. Game ends a draw, be grumpy for days for bottling it and dropping points against teams you should beat.

    Wonder if Big Van Dick was in his ear during the WC. You know, just like how Ramsdale and Saka would have been in Bellinghams ;)

    Well based on their team against Villa, Gakpo goes straight onto the LW where he plays for PSV. Cuts in on his right, they keep Salah on the RW cutting in on his left, and Nunez stays central and shanks everything. I think they had Elliott at LW against Villa at times today, so Gakpo is an immediate upgrade.
     
  9. The Jitty Slitter

    The Jitty Slitter Moderator
    Staff Member

    Bayern München
    Germany
    Jul 23, 2004
    Fascist Hellscape
    Club:
    FC Sankt Pauli
    Nat'l Team:
    Belgium
    amazing how people still overpaid for broke wenger products until late in the day

    ox literally can’t play football properly

    what did liverpools elite scouts ‘see’ in him?
     
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  10. casoccerdad47

    casoccerdad47 Member+

    Mar 31, 2006
    #32410 casoccerdad47, Dec 27, 2022
    Last edited: Dec 27, 2022
    They probably saw the same thing Arsene saw, a 16 year old that started 27 games for Southampton in League 1 and scored 9 goals with 8 assists. There are always coaches who believe they have the key to unlocking a player’s potential. Why they spent more than £30m for him is puzzling.
     
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  11. thebigman

    thebigman Member+

    May 25, 2006
    Birmingham
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Nat'l Team:
    England
    Ox was awful

    klopp thought he could Turn him into the next wijnaldem

    turns out he couldn’t
     
  12. The Jitty Slitter

    The Jitty Slitter Moderator
    Staff Member

    Bayern München
    Germany
    Jul 23, 2004
    Fascist Hellscape
    Club:
    FC Sankt Pauli
    Nat'l Team:
    Belgium
    I think an issue with some of these wenger products is they didn’t learn basics of football

    E.g Ramsey can’t play midfield yet excels at certain things
     
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  13. casoccerdad47

    casoccerdad47 Member+

    Mar 31, 2006
    The fact that Ox was able to play with men at 16, albeit in the third tier, suggests that physically he was so dominate at the youth level that he may have relied on his athleticism to succeed not basic skills and awareness.

    However, we shouldn’t forget that he is another player that has had an injury riddled career, both at Arsenal and at Liverpool.

    Finally, I know you like to lay blame for some of this on Wenger, but player development is primarily the responsibility of the academies. With 50 plus games in a season, and two or three trainings between weekend and midweek games most managers focus trainings on the next opponent, not the basics some players missed at the youth level because they jumped into the first team as teenagers. Wenger’s responsibility may lie in promoting teenagers into the team to early. A strategy he used in the second half of his Arsenal career to balance the books.
     
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  14. CarlosKaiser

    CarlosKaiser Member+

    Arsenal
    United States
    Jul 30, 2018
    Kansas City
    Always thought Ox played his best as a right-wing back, never understood Wenger's contention that he would be a CM. Never had the touch and it wasted his speed. Don't think Ox liked RWB, got a higher fee for him than Iwobi but in the same ballpark for homegrown talent that's PL proven.
     
  15. The Jitty Slitter

    The Jitty Slitter Moderator
    Staff Member

    Bayern München
    Germany
    Jul 23, 2004
    Fascist Hellscape
    Club:
    FC Sankt Pauli
    Nat'l Team:
    Belgium
    There is a next level of midfield play you only can learn in the first team. You saw this with Kroos who was absurdly talented at age 22 but only developed into a complete midfielder over the next couple of years

    it’s been well covered before but wengers teams lacked key ideas is spacing, pressing and structures. Mostly because he never hired any elite first team trainers to bring in the IP

    Ramsey is an obvious example of this. When he first came in as a wide midfielder he was atrocious. I was amazed he would even be considered for Arsenal his touch was so poor. But his general confidence and dynamism took him far. But it never became clear what type of player he was. Wenger tried him in pivot when he is clearly more of a 10

    a huge ongoing issue at arsenal was also the lack of any elite midfielder anyone could learn from

    remember fabregas came up with Gilberto and Vieira at the club …
     
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  16. The Jitty Slitter

    The Jitty Slitter Moderator
    Staff Member

    Bayern München
    Germany
    Jul 23, 2004
    Fascist Hellscape
    Club:
    FC Sankt Pauli
    Nat'l Team:
    Belgium
    yes his speed is highly valued at the top end of football

    I agree he lacks 5% on dribbling, first touch and passing
     
  17. casoccerdad47

    casoccerdad47 Member+

    Mar 31, 2006
    Has Ox picked up the next level midfield play from Kloop?
     
  18. The Jitty Slitter

    The Jitty Slitter Moderator
    Staff Member

    Bayern München
    Germany
    Jul 23, 2004
    Fascist Hellscape
    Club:
    FC Sankt Pauli
    Nat'l Team:
    Belgium
    well no

    but I was responding to the idea players would learn all that outside of premier league football

    there are of course plenty of players who don’t make the further strides from teenage talent and they will fail in the first team

    it could be that ox is simply a below average EPL player which is still a reasonable level
     
  19. The Jitty Slitter

    The Jitty Slitter Moderator
    Staff Member

    Bayern München
    Germany
    Jul 23, 2004
    Fascist Hellscape
    Club:
    FC Sankt Pauli
    Nat'l Team:
    Belgium
    I do think it’s fair to say Nasri was the last genuine talent Wenger brought in who wasn’t a failure
     
  20. ArsenalMetro

    ArsenalMetro Member+

    United States
    Aug 5, 2008
    Chicago, IL
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Every signing between 2008 and 2018 was a failure?

    Edit: or do you mean like U21 signings only?
     
  21. The Jitty Slitter

    The Jitty Slitter Moderator
    Staff Member

    Bayern München
    Germany
    Jul 23, 2004
    Fascist Hellscape
    Club:
    FC Sankt Pauli
    Nat'l Team:
    Belgium
    i mean players not developed elsewhere
     
  22. casoccerdad47

    casoccerdad47 Member+

    Mar 31, 2006
    Yea, but he was a prick and I was never convinced he seriously applied himself.
    I suspect it was the latter, Santi was signed the year after Nasir left for City.
     
  23. ArsenalMetro

    ArsenalMetro Member+

    United States
    Aug 5, 2008
    Chicago, IL
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Nasri had like 160 Marseille appearances and had just played with France at the Euros before signing. I don't think it's fair to say he wasn't developed elsewhere.

    If you want to start that timeframe with Ramsey (signed 10 days earlier), I'll give you that. Nasri was a well-established professional on arrival though.
     
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  24. ArsenalJake

    ArsenalJake Member+

    Feb 11, 2013
    Charlotte
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Na, na na na, na na na na, Samir Nasri NASRI, SAMIR NASRI!!

    so good for 12 months we added an extra syllable to his name
     
  25. NorthBank

    NorthBank Member+

    Arsenal; NYRB
    United States
    Mar 29, 2006
    Connecticut
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I kept an eye on Chelsea game today and one thing I noticed was their goal celebrations and how they were different than Arsenal's.

    Something I've been saying about our boys this season (and Monday was no exception) is that they have great unity, chemistry, etc. By and large the group is more important than the individual.

    You can see that in our goal celebrations. And it wasn't the same with Chelsea's I thought.

    Long may that last.

    p.s. Leeds might be a bit similar these days, so maybe just maybe they can use this to their advantage against Citeh today. I can't think of a game that I'll be a bigger supporter for Jesse, Tyler, Brenden and all their boys. Come on you whites!
     

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