USWNT sues USSF 2019 version

Feyenoord’s point is also a decent legal argument that actually has more precedent in the US legal system. Here’s a thread from Prof. Bank that explains the precedent:

Let me try to provide legal perspective on why USSF is arguing that the WNT and MNT players, in the words of the USSF brief in support of its motion, "Do Not Perform Equal Work on Jobs Requiring Equal Skill, Effort, and Responsibility Under Similar Working Conditions." https://t.co/2T4xQGzTfN

— Steven Bank (@ProfBank) February 21, 2020

But the short version is that 20ish years ago, the Head Coach for USC’s women’s b’ball team sued USC for discrimination because she eas being paid leas than the HC for USC’s men’s b’ball team. She ended up lose her case because the court decided that men’s bball and women’s bbal weren’t the same, so USC wasn’t required to pay the women’s bball coach the same as the men’s.

Now that was 20 years ago and things have changed, but precedent seems to be on the side of USSF here.

 

Since I'm not getting paid for my legal opinion here, I'm not going to read the case and try to distinguish it. Although, I believe the Court could have decided this against the women at the stage where it certified the class, and did not do so.

I would note that, the Ninth Circuit is now one of the most liberal in the country, I don't know if that was the case 20 years ago (unless the Trump appointees change things).

I agree wholeheartedly that if US soccer wins on this argument, it might be more of a loss than a win...

 

Roughly a third of the 9th is Trump appointee (and I now feel old, many of them are younger than I am), and the 9th is a little over 1/2 Dem appointees. No idea where that places them on the rank of things. Just noting that precedent in the 9th is that the men’s and women’s sports are different workplaces.

 

One problem with the "the job is "US national team soccer player" and hence is substantially similar." argument, IMHO, is that you turn every single USSF team that has a FIFA World Cup into a potential suit (U17,U20, Futsal and beach soccer). If the job is a USNT soccer player then they all deserve the same deal, no?. USWNT has been generating most of USSF's revenue (ex-SUM) they might end up having to foot the bill for equal pay if this goes through.

 

We shall see.

My prediction from day one was that this case will settle, and the more we go along, the worse it will look for both sides if they do not do so.

Although, I think the team is still way ahead in the PR battle.

 

The team is ahead in the PR battle but does it matter? It isn't like this is news on CNN or even ESPN. With the election and the importance of soccer in this country, it is a small group of people that are even following this. Most of them already have a poor opinion of the USSF already.

If you look at the comments on any Athletic, Yahoo, or ESPN article on this, 98% are with the Fed.

$67 MM is about the whole operating budget for USSF. They can't settle for anything close to that. I think the women's lawyers have them convinced they have a case, and most media that follow the case are in tight with the women. So, will they settle for a tenth of that figure? If they did, would it be considered a loss?

I think one side has a PR campaign and is made up of very competitive people, the other side probably has the stronger case. I don't see a settlement. But of course, almost all civil cases do settle.

 

A bit of topic, but I really wish USWNT together with USSF and the other women's teams and their federation would pressure FIFA to make a financial valuation for FIFA's women WC. I think France was a paradigm shift for the women's game. TV rights should be negotiated separately, which, IMHO, would allow for more investment into the women's game. I think FIFA is behind the curve, at least UEFA and Conmebol are making strides to develop women Club game.

 

That would be a stupid take from a judge as it has nothing to do with inferiority or not. It's simply economics. Male soccer is in hugher demand worldwide, whether one likes it or not, compared to female soccer and it shows in the money generated by both different entities. Can the USWNT players show the WWC generates as much money as the male one? I donot think so.
One cannot from a political pov demand the public recognizes you as equal attractive as male soccer. You have to earn it.
I personally for instance appreciate female lawn tennis more than male tennis, as it's less power and muscles and more technique and style. Female tennis players are not that much less earning per match as males in the top segment because of that earned love for their game.
Just take this away from soccer and into photography. Several male photographers earn huge amounts of money, because their clients like what they put out.
Imagine a female photographer goes to court to demand her clients to pay the same as she presses the same buttons those males do.
Everybody would point a finger to their foreheads as a sign of "you're nuts".
Yet the female WC players do this with "we kick the same ball over the same pitch".

 

There's only one sport in the world where women and male sporters are doing the same thing on the same pitch in the same team, and that's Dutch invented korfbal, which has mixed male/female teams.

 

Embarassing; like he was Iranian Monitor in an earlier incarnation or something...

 

Here's a suggestion, rather than coming into a thread almost 500 posts long, with some of the same arguments that have been discussed here at great length, why don't you go back and read the thread.

 

The women's team won the World Cup, and millions watcched them. The men's team didn't even qualify.

It would be unfair to pay them equally.

 

And, according to USSF, the women were paid more than the men as a result. The primary driver in this lawsuit isn't necessarily the amount of pay that the women are getting in comparison to the men, it is that the men are paid more on a per game basis, the men get higher performance bonuses, and that the women play more games than the men do.

 

I started to post this in the NWSL section but it seems to fit here just as well and it will be a bit more visible here:

Sydney Leroux says she paid more for child care than she made in salary from Pride
https://sports.yahoo.com/sydney-ler...made-in-salary-from-nwsl-pride-012355672.html

 

Thay's more a problem of child care costs than soccer salaries, though.

I've known a clutch of single moms who would trade their income for that 20000 minimum in a heartbeat over exactly that stress--bartenders, cooks, teaching assistants, retail clerks, etc. Plus others who have delayed or eschewed children for the same reason. Syd's ol'man at least, makes serious money...

 

I have heard it said that child care is the one redeeming factor of mother-in-laws.

"Honolulu - it's got everything. Sand for the children, sun for the wife, sharks for the wife's mother."

 

This is a perfect example of the woso fanbase's failure to support club football. It's going to be tough to grow the women's game with nothing but a quadrennial event.

If every woman who attended an MLS match had just bought an NWSL ticket as well, woso could be a self-reliant institution.

 

Ugh. Not this crap again.

The NWSL is an entertainment option, not a cause. Causes recede. Sports leagues are enduring.

"But think of the girls" - "If only the women bought tickets!"

******** that. Just treat it like a ********ing sports league. It's "your" team, and it doesn't matter what sex, gender, age, or whatever "you" are.

 

The NWSL isn't much of an option entertainmentwise. Being supported as a cause is about all they can hope for, and IMO it's perfectly okay to support a sports league as a way of supporting a cause. When I went to Atlanta Beat games back in the early 2000s, I certainly wasn't going because of the football on display. I went to some degree because I felt that it was the right thing to do. Why is that a bad thing?

If it continues to be treated like a ********ing sports league, it'll continue to get the revenue it's getting now, and the tail will continue to wag the dog paymentwise. What, exactly do you want to see happen to the NWSL?

FWIW, United is pretty well supported as MLS goes. And my cause is being able to see top-flight club football close to me- I have no illusions that they're among the best teams on Earth.

 

I'm in dubio about reporting this as a misogynic remark
It did make me chuckle a little, so I had to slap myself.

 

Mother-in-laws are not a protected class...

 

I don’t see mentioned anywhere how many club games the men are called away from outside FIFA Windows, or how many camps they leave their clubs for during the season.

 

Which kinda highlights the fact that the women no longer need as many games as they play. It made sense back when they didn’t have a league to play in, but now that they do, the USWNT games should probably be cut back...

 

US Soccer Doesn’t Want To Give The Women’s Team Equal Pay Because The Men Have “More Responsibility

https://www.buzzfeednews.com/articl...argued-women-shouldnt-be-paid-the-same-as-men