USSF Registration in two states?

Discussion in 'Referee' started by Chas (Psyatika), Jan 3, 2006.

  1. Chas (Psyatika)

    Oct 6, 2005
    USA
    Club:
    Crystal Palace FC
    I'm just about to do my cross registration from AYSO to USSF. I live in New Jersey, but i did all my AYSO work in New York, and i plan on paying my cross-registration fee to the NY State Association.

    Does anyone know what i'd have to do to also be permitted to officiate in USSF matches in New Jersey? It seems like the state affiliation requirement is a bit useless in major metropolitan areas like New York/Northern New Jersey, where it's actually easier to travel to matches in New York than it is to travel to Southern New Jersey when you live in North Jersey. For now i'd like to avoid South Jersey and ideally officiate in New York and North Jersey.
     
  2. USSF REF

    USSF REF Member

    Red Bull NY
    United States
    Nov 6, 2005
    Rochester, NY
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    You will have to obtain permission from the WNY SRA (or possibly via the SYRA) to "travel" from ENY to NJ. This could be easily achieved, just make sure you get that permission in writting. Then get the right contacts in NJ (probably for you, Barry Towbin, SYRA) USSF will not permit you to have a "dual-cirtification" if you will. Not sure why, thats just the way it is. Though, you might have difficulty doing this if it's your first year as a USSF, regardless of your affiliation with AYSO, it's up to the SRA. Also, working youth matches, you will likely not be assigned to south jersey, unless it's something like state cup.
     
  3. Chas (Psyatika)

    Oct 6, 2005
    USA
    Club:
    Crystal Palace FC
    Just so we're clear, did you mean to say that i need permission from EAST NY to travel from ENY to NJ, or do i really have to get permission from WEST NY, maybe since it's closer to NJ? I'm not trying to be a jerk, i just want to make sure i do the right thing.
     
  4. USSF REF

    USSF REF Member

    Red Bull NY
    United States
    Nov 6, 2005
    Rochester, NY
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    The "state" you would be joining is ENY. I live in NJ now, but I used to referee in WNY for the last 3 years. WNY begins around Binghamton and up to Syracuse and goes west. This is well west of any where near NJ, plus all the WNY games are located near Rochester and Buffalo (6-8 hours away, driving). You would be joining (registering with) ENY and then getting "permission to travel" from ENY to NJ in order to referee in NJ.
     
  5. SoccerFamilyStyle

    Dec 9, 2005
    Des Moines, Iowa
    Club:
    FC Kaiserslautern
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I think this is right. I register out of state because the powers that be in my home state didn't think I was fit to be a State Referee. Since I'm married to a national referee, I chose the path of least resistance, and registered out of state in the state where I actually was doing most of my USSF games. After almost 3 years of trying to upgrade at home, I got it done in 2 weeks away.

    Just be careful that you don't step on any toes. Make sure everyone knows what you're doing and that you always have "permission to travel" (i.e. when I want to ref in Iowa, I email my SRA and get permission). Trouble is, for me, my bridge is probably burned in Iowa until several higher ups die or retire. Plus, now that I'm mother to a daughter, I feel like crap that I didn't fight the power.

    It can make life hell when you want to upgrade if you've pissed off whoever wherever.

    Politics aside, that's how you do it. Wouldn't it be nice to just ref? Or if I lived in one of the 49 states that it pays to be a girl ref!? Sigh....can't wait til DD asks if she can referee. Does referee registration follow matrilineal decent?
     
  6. Claymore

    Claymore Member

    Jul 9, 2000
    Montgomery Vlg, MD
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    There's a helluva story behind this, I'm sure.
     
  7. MassachusettsRef

    MassachusettsRef Moderator
    Staff Member

    Apr 30, 2001
    Washington, DC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Just for the record, there's officially no such thing as acquiring "permission to travel" from your SRA and/or SYRA. You're merely required to inform those persons if you intend to travel outside of state. They can then in turn try to block your assignments or inform the other state if you're not in good standing within your own state. But they technically cannot prevent you from travelling out-of-state, should it ever come to that.

    Of course, if you end up travelling out-of-state against your own SRA's wishes, you've got to know that you're burning a bridge that you probably can't rebuild.
     
  8. USRef

    USRef New Member

    Nov 28, 2005
    MassachusettsRef is correct, however, it is a good idea to inform the SYRA/SRA when referees want to referee out of state as this is the only thing that can release you from state obligations. The paragraph in the Indiana referee handbook says "Some tournaments and leagues require a copy of the approval from the SRA/SYRA, stating that you are currently a certified referee in good standing in Indiana and have permission to referee out of state." Also, it would be very wise to inform your state director of assesment, and inquire whether any games you do out of state can be counted for upgrade and maintenance in your home state. While each individual matches circumstances are different, you stand a better chance if you have a letter from the SDA.
     
  9. Chas (Psyatika)

    Oct 6, 2005
    USA
    Club:
    Crystal Palace FC
    Would a SRA really go through all the trouble to block someone they don't even know? I thought refs were in shortage around here!
     
  10. USSF REF

    USSF REF Member

    Red Bull NY
    United States
    Nov 6, 2005
    Rochester, NY
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    In most cases, probably not. One day though, probably when you're trying to upgrade to state referee, you'll start to see a lot of strange things happen. This is the politics that can surround refereeing. It seems stupid, but it's something you'll likely have to deal with.
     
  11. Claymore

    Claymore Member

    Jul 9, 2000
    Montgomery Vlg, MD
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Moral of the story: don't piss off your SRA. If he's having trouble covering a state-sanctioned tournament and you're at some out-of-state tourney - and he didn't know about it - you're toast.
     
  12. billf

    billf Member+

    May 22, 2001
    Club:
    Philadelphia Union
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    No, if you want to register in ENY and work in NJ just contact a NJ assignor and let the ENY SRA know. If ENY has recert requirements, you'll need to be sure you make yourself available to fulfill them.

    Why not register in NJ? The soccer in NJ is fantastic and most of the best games are up north anyway. I don't know what you consider south jersey, but I'm pretty sure you won't travel that far.
     
  13. SoccerFamilyStyle

    Dec 9, 2005
    Des Moines, Iowa
    Club:
    FC Kaiserslautern
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Indeed there is! And someday, when I've retired from climbing the referee ladder and my husband and maybe kids have too, I'll tell all in an earth-shattering best seller.

    I'm not entirely sure what happened with my referee career. It may have something to do with my growing up empowered in New Jersey and moved to Iowa to marry one of the up-and-comingest referees. I didn't get the memo that girls in Iowa are supposed to look pretty on the sidelines, not referee. Missed that day in the cultural assimilation class.

    So, I guess I was a little too Jersey (and I really wasn't THAT bad) and there are a few key people in Iowa who decided I would not become a state referee in their world. One guy on the fringe on the old boys club actually told him that they were taking turns amongst state assessors so everyone would get a chance to fail me. Nice.

    I drew the line on a travel issue actually. A regional level referee admin told me that I should be a State, I told him why I wasn't, he said to go get permission to referee out of state, and then while there, get assessed by a national assessor (who couldn't be argued with).

    So I took his advice but a few days before the game my SDA called the Nat'l guy and told him not to assess me under any circumstances, developmental or otherwise. This was after a whole lot of other crap I'd been through, and I decided it was more important that I 1) save my 2 referee marriage 2) get my damn state badge so I could get pregnant (that was my goal, State before motherhood!) So I quit Iowa, got assessed at the tourney by a State assessor, passed, got the rest at Regionals and that's that.

    Like I said, I've been plotting my way back into Iowa recently. I feel like I have to do something to change policy here before my daughter hits referee age. I feel like crap that I didn't fight the power in the first place, but I was SO sick of it. I do have a huge file of all the crap I was put through, but I haven't reached the point where bustin' old boys club matters more to me than refereeing does.

    That's my confessional. You can send me a personal message if you have any advice on bringing state officials into the 21st century!
     
  14. MrZedd

    MrZedd New Member

    Jul 18, 2003
    I'm getting a great visual of a soccer pitch in the middle of a cornfield with a ref in stiletto heels, long nails, a black leather mini skirt, and big, BIG hair!
     
  15. Chas (Psyatika)

    Oct 6, 2005
    USA
    Club:
    Crystal Palace FC
    Thanks for your help everyone!

    I received a PM in which part of my reply might actually be relavent for the thread, so i'm copying it here.

    ------------------------------------------------------------
    i guess my main concern is whether i should register with East New York and get permission to travel to New Jersey, or should i register in NJ and get permission to work in ENY. I live in Newark, NJ, and i don't have a car, so travel is easiest within the NYC area, and anywhere in New Jersey where i could get a train or bus. Due to my lack of exierience with USSF, i don't know where i would be better off in terms of travel to matches. I'm actually going to copy and paste this into a post in that thread, in case anyone else has a similar situation.
    -------------------------------------------------------------

    Judging by people's advice, i'm leaning towards New Jersey, and i guess i'd just have to explain that i don't have a car yet, so early on in my career i may be asking to work in New York a lot. I haven't submitted anything yet, so i still have time to choose.

    Again, you have all been very patient and helpful!


    -Chas
     
  16. MassachusettsRef

    MassachusettsRef Moderator
    Staff Member

    Apr 30, 2001
    Washington, DC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    This issue is being overblown, especially for a metro area like NYC. Register in one of them and simply inform that state's SRA (or SYRA) that you plan to referee matches in the other state as a matter of convenience. They won't stop you.

    The requirement to inform the SRA is really for two purposes (as best I can tell). The first is so that, as Claymore says, you don't abandon the state in a time of need (working an out-of-state tournament when you're needed at your own state's State Cup, for example). The second is so that the state knows what you're up to; remember, you are representing that state and if any issues come up when you're in another state, your home state should have a clue where you were/what you were doing if another SRA or tournament assignor comes with a complaint (or a compliment).

    This all comes down to just keeping everyone informed. And it's REALLY a moot point in some urban areas near state lines, like NYC, Philly and DC.
     

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