Pre-match: USMNT v Saudi Arabia Gold Cup - Thurs June 19

Imagine it will be the same lineup plus Adams and Turner though I’d like to also see Tolkin.

 

I will just say this: Ream was actually pretty good. He was very important in the build up and I don't remember any mistakes.

Where are we getting any passing? It says something that Richards basically deferred to him on the build up.

 

White for Patrick

 

________freese________
__richards__mckenzie
freeman__________tolkin
_____cardoso__seb
tillman__luna__aaronson
________wright

i dont get the relative awe of the saudis around here and really dont care- this is our best team (with the notable exception of the two cms). get the three points so we can rotate the guys we need to (richards, tillman, luna), keep working on those questions in the middle and buy adams more time against haiti.

well, the only reason i count freeman as part of our "best" team here is harriel, but that line of two needs sorting out. and to be clear the only one of the guys weve used/are likely to use there that would surprise me at all if they didnt make the wc is johnny- this is a strictly gc issue due to the roster and adams' injury.

cardoso has to show some ability to cover the backline, and this is at least one one-hundredth of a percent more of a test than haiti will be. luca is obviously a better play than berhalter (either really, minus any real defensive ability) but thats what seb needs to show- that he can be a more defensive presence in the middle than freaking ldlt (who ive always liked a lot, but cmon...). seb has had a couple of games, hopefully he can find a little rhythm and give a better showing of himself so we have a better read going forward.

also, luca can join the other vets in giving us a servicable enough (at the low, low concacaf level) framework so that haiti match isnt a complete throwaway/hubris loss.

i want to see pax get minutes on that two line here- im not super familiar with his game over the last year, but everyone who says they are insists hes more of an 8 than a winger/attacker. i want to see downs just to know if theres any hope at all. i absolutely dont want to see adams at all until our fourth match. just, you know, manage as usual other than that. my only other note would be any of my attacking mids could play in any of the spots, i just want to get luna minutes in the middle as i think thats more transferrable to our full team going forward, and helpful to his development now.

its just tournament management. put out our best team out here so we can let harriel, arfsten, mcglynn, seb, pax, sullivan and agyemang/white take bigger roles against haiti with our training wheels- zim, ream, miles and luca (aka the guys we should be looking to push out). a gc dead rubber match shouldnt present any "hard" questions, but im not sure what id do in goal- my impulse is to give freese every minute of our run, but turners lack of playing-induced collapse isnt going to get any better on the bench, and anything can happen over the course of a tournament...

anyways, before anyone wants to point out that im looking past saudi arabia dont bother. im sure poch is going to teach us all a thing or two our feeble american minds can barely comprehend in this one (like arfsten and mcglynn are in his best team), and im fully prepared for that haiti match to mean something (including the fact that my rotation/training wheels lineup is also among the best according to him).

 

I do not see the USA winning this on merit. But i do see them winning it by SA's incompetence. This USA side is unable to establish any steady solid play and they will find ways to keep vastly inferior teams in matches that they should handle and to completely fold up when faced by a team with any real skill.

The match may well come down to who makes the last stupid mistake.

I did not think it would be the case but the Club World Cup is more entertaining than this Gold Cup. At least even the lesser games are in half full stadiums while the lesser Gold Cup matches have maybe 12 people watching.
But the USSF and CONCACAF do not prioritize the Gold Cup fiasco at all and they get exactly what they deserve.

 

Were you one of the people who was worried about Trinidad in the last thread?

 

Worried? No. But this USA side is very able to lose to anybody.

 

"I don't think he's {Patrick Agyemang} the finished product by any stretch of the imagination and I'm not comfortable saying that he's the starter come the World Cup."@AlexiLalas discusses Patrick Agyemang and Hajii Wright's roles as a starter and sub vs Trinidad and Tobago 🇺🇸 pic.twitter.com/JLzKWGAMK9

— Alexi Lalas' State of the Union Podcast (@SOTUWithAlexi) June 16, 2025

"I don't think he's {Patrick Agyemang} the finished product by any stretch of the imagination and I'm not comfortable saying that he's the starter come the World Cup."

Alexi Lalas discusses Patrick Agyemang and Hajii Wright's roles as a starter and sub vs Trinidad and Tobago

 

agyemang probably not the starting striker in the world cup!?! boy, theres no take too hot for that lalas

 

Couldn’t have said it better ourselves, @clint_dempsey 🫡🇺🇸

pic.twitter.com/U5moHQmBUt

— Charlotte FC (@CharlotteFC) June 17, 2025

 

The guys at home or in the CWC ain’t done sh**, which is why it was so incredibly stupid of them to have missed this tournament. They may be watching from home this time next year as well. Pochettino is developing these guys and developing trust with them.

 

I normally rate Saudi as a second-tier AFC team (after SK, Japan, Australia—teams that often make the R16). They usually make the WC and while they rarely get out of the group, they did upset Argentina in the first group game last time out (though they ended up losing the next two and not qualifying for the R16). That Saudi team also played us to a scoreless draw in the runup to the 22 WC in one of the most boring games I’ve ever seen.

But this is not that Saudi team. This version of the team is missing something like 7 players to the CWC and they’re at most a B version of the first-choice squad. They struggled mightily to beat Haiti, doing so thanks only to a penalty and some luck.

So while this SA team probably compares favorably to the T&T team we smoked (and even that’s just a mildly educated guess), they are much closer to that team in terms of talent than they are to us. This would all suggest that we handle them pretty easily, maybe 2-0 or 3-0.

But there are no guarantees in soccer, and performance can vary widely from game to game. So while I’m cautiously optimistic, I still think the smart move is to put out our best lineup and go all-out to lock down top spot in the group. I’d love to see Haji get the start in his true role—a pure 9 rather than a winger. Ream and Richards seem pretty capable at the back, at least vs this level of competition. And if healthy I’d like to see us deploy Adams, and then if we’re comfortably ahead at the half sub him out (and vs Haiti) for rest in preparation for the eliminatorias. If the best XI in this squad gives us the win I think they will, that then allows us to rest guys and use Haiti as a bit of an experiment, maybe cap tie Downs.

 

New promotional poster ...

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Indeed. This isn't the Saudi group that did well at the World Cup.

That game against Haiti was ponderous....................

This will be a better test for us than that T&T game.
It can't NOT be.

.................but enough with the negativity.

We should do fine in this game. 2-0, 3-0 sounds about right.

We probably will rotate a little bit depending on knocks and rest needed.
Turner will probably be in the nets. We probably will start McKenzie. I like the suggestion of Haji starting over Agyemang. If Adams is good to go, then we play him 60 minutes. I don't think Arfsten did particularly well in the last game, so maybe Tolkin in this one. We'll see.

Go with the best available lineup in this game, get the win, and that allows heavy rotation against Haiti in the last game.

 

First, the people at the CWC were required to miss the Gold Cup. That's true no matter how often you suggest that they should have escaped from Juventus as if it's Alcatraz.

Second, the idea that Pulisic or Weah or Jedi are going to miss the WC for anything other than injury is laughable nonsense.

 

The fact he's even considered shows our dearth of attacking talent. I long for a McBride or Dempsey...

 

i’m hoping Tyler Adams has recovered enough to play. I also believe that Matt Turner is out best goalkeeper and gets the opportunity to prove it.

I especially hope that we win this match and can play a fun/experimental lineup against Hati, giving a few untried call up the opportunity.

 

Arfsten did just fine but it was a shambolic display from T&T. He’s potentially a late sub caliber player if things go well.

Not sure anything Saudia Arabia is bringing warrants concern about whether it’s Arfsten or Tolkin.

The question for me is… what happens when Ream and Arfsten are playing against any formidable team? Not sure Tolkin shores that up much either.

 

There are a lot of guys at home. Landon Donovan, who was better and more integral to the USMNT than Pulisic, was left at home for less. It’s time to shake free of the loser mentality that the USMNT is something that people can kinda do for fun outside their clubs when they want a vacation.

There were a lot of people suggesting that Pulisic taking the summer off was not a big deal. Meanwhile, in reality, you all were unaware that Pulisic was told by the coach to take the summer off. Not for rest, but because he wasn’t willing to commit to the team. Pulisic was put in his place.

Pulisic’s story became public because Pulisic made it public. None of the other guys have chirped up since Pulisic got dealt with like that by our non-mannequin coach, so you don’t know whether your assumptions about their absences are true or not.

 

I think you’re right. Tournament strategy typically calls for at least 65 minutes of your best lineup against this team. I’m not sure if there are any strategic rotations that need to be made to better attack the Saudi squad (I don’t know them), but I think that Pochettino will try to close out the group before resting legs. We saw Tillman limping over to Pochettino in the second half of the last one and Pochettino telling him to finish the game. I think that we will see something similar to that unless we are up multiple goals in the second half.

There is no given that we will be up multiple goals. This is a World Cup team. They should not be underrated.

 

My thoughts for any changes.

1. You do NOT run Turner out there at keeper. Freese gets his first competitive match in the kit and came up big the one time he was called on. Something Turner has not done for a long time.
2. Replace Ag with somebody. Just being big isn't good enough.
3. Run as strong a team as you can, based on fitness, and get 3 points so you can make changes freely for Haiti. Don't go into the last match needing points.
4. Don't take chances on Adams. If hes ready then great but don't push it.

 

Good plan, I’m with it.
I still wish it was someone besides Ream, I believe there’s an opportunity cost here I’m not getting max minutes to players who should actually be at the WC. Because now it looks like he’ll take Ream, which isn’t so bad for the room but then I know he’ll be tempted to actually use him, he’s his crutch.
I get why he played v Trini, Poch trusts him and it was really a must win match in essence, a match where the opponent would be mostly defending. But I have to say, in MLS, he looks old and past it and his play there didn’t justify a call up. I don’t know how that gets better.