Not sure why I didn't include this before, but name 5 or 6 MLS lifers that shows the league can develop talent without the help of outside sources. If we keep it to 2015, then the list currently stands at zero so zero so show me the MLS player that made the improvements in their game after 22/23 that we have seen in quite a few Americans abroad. You can also name all the MLS players that were prepared well for Europe such that hit the ground running and didn't need a low level (Aaronson) or a season to acclimate (Aaronson again) or had didn't get time because they just weren't up to it and had to come home. This is such a stupid discussion. There virtually zero to suggest MLS is actually any good at developing American players and we have some weird English guy trying to argue that. You do know that MLS was the biggest source of Adu's failures.
I've not said any of that. You must be mistaking me for someone else. I've always said that Yurp is an exciting option for young players and if I was in my teens I would probably jump at the chance. What I disagree with is that Europe is automatically a better option for players than spending an extra year or two in MLS. Adam Tash just likes to throw barbs at MLS. In fact he probably blames MLS for 9/11 and for failed invasion of Canada in 1812. I have no idea what you are rambling on about. As I said above Split is a beautiful place and Hadjuk is a good club. One example of someone you think has progressed the best based on his move from SKC. But there's no real comparison because we don't know how he would have progressed at SKC.
Correlation is not causation. If they were good enough to play in a top 5 league they would never have been a MLS lifer, with the odd exception of a couple of players who choose to stay in MLS for other reasons.
I'm not mistaking you at all and was think about you at all when I was directly responding to another poster. Very weird!!! You should figure out this forum and the quoting thing works. If you go back to the actual post, you can see what I was responding to.
Don't talk to me about correlation and causation. We can go down this route. We have more than enough players to fill a roster who are capable of playing in top 5 leagues, so there should be no MLS players on the USMNT. Hopefully, you can let the silly MLS fans know their players aren't good enough for a top 5 league because they constantly claiming that is where their hyped up players are going. Remember when they told us that donkey Aaron Long was going to the EPL? What a joke. Explain Kellyn Acosta to us then. He has been one of very few Americans to go to the u20 WC as an underage player. He had what I think you called raw ability that should have made a top 5 league an option. Instead he is an MLS journey man. Not the first teenager that is viewed as one of the best in the country to have less than impressive careers in MLS. I think underestimate dramatically how potential has been wasted in MLS.
You were literally quoted and responded to his post. Perhaps you should take a breath, purge your rage, before responding and incoherently rambling on.
We don't know how that would have turned out, but we do know that SKC has had top prospects in the past, but don't recall any successes. I dont see any basis to suggest the kid would have made the same progress at SKC other than you guys wanting it to be true.
Perhaps I am wrong but my statement was based upon the fact that I have not seen posts declaring that any player that does not leave for Europe by 18 has ruined his career. For a while there were several posters that were pushing that narrative. My impression is that all but a few people still believe that players should leave for Europe as soon as they find a team that offers a better situation than MLS, but that is different than saying that they should go asap regardless of the situation. To be fair, I don't believe it was the majority opinion but there was a vocal minority that pushed that narrative. There are still debates on the value of certain European teams/leagues vs MLS but most are more nuanced than before. There are only a few that occasionally make a statement that implies or states that ANY European team would be a significant upgrade for ANY MLS player. The narrative now, I believe, is much more nuanced. For a young player that can get playing time at top team (Reyna, Pulisic etc), I think the sentiment is likely almost unanimous that they should go asap (to a good situation) but I don't see too many fans advocating for a young player to move to Chelsea if their best hope is to join the loan army ala Miazga (I am not making any prediction about what would have been...only that going to Europe at all costs didn't really work out for him.) It wasn't that long ago that most American fans were extremely happy for Tab Ramos to be playing at a second division club in Spain....now we have progressed to the point where our best prospects...let alone actual stars are looking to move to a much higher level in Europe. It's still Europe that they many are looking at, but not Europe at any cost. Could you imagine our fans being happy with any of our best prospects, let alone best established players moving to a lower tier club? Sure we have plenty of our better players and prospects move to teams outside the top 5 leagues but how many move to division 2 leagues? The one exception that I am aware of is the Championship, but even many first division leagues are at least a step sideways with, for some, a spot in a top team in a substandard league and the main selling point being competition from a few games in the CL. As for how many have failed? The answer is a lot. Is that surprising? Oh.....you were talking about those that failed while remaining in MLS....the answer is still a lot. That shouldn't be at all surprising either. The fact is that the number of players that fail (in any country) is far greater than those that succeed and if you narrow the definition of success to those that become successful national team players the percentage of failures goes up. As for whether or not they would have been more successful if they had taken a different route? My answer is maybe...for both. Undoubtably some moved into or stayed in a better position and some did not. It's kind of difficult to argue a position of what could have been...especially when there are plenty of failures on both sides of the pond. It's not a position I would argue on either side. There are plenty of failures on both sides.
Ok, I hit see ignored to get the context, but that’s exactly right. The arrow of causation goes the other way. zJust as a topic, where does Kevin Paredes stand in all this? IMO his rate of improvement has been pretty steady from his first minutes with DC to now. He seems to have picked the right time to go to the next level.
Yep. If I was 17 and had a European passport and had the opportunity to play in Europe, even if it was a step down, I'd take it. Why not?
I agree. Some would jump at the chance, others would prefer to wait. My argument isn't that staying in MLS is better than going to "Europe". It depends on the individual, the opportunity and the club. But there are a bunch of posters stuck in fifth grade with a "MLS sucks and if you disagree you're a shill" mentality. Anyone who doesn't see how MLS has changed for the better in the last 10-15 years is a moron. So I choose IGNORE.
I know you MLS dorks prefer your endless circle jerk to nowhere…but in case anyone can take a break from D&D, here’s some actual articles you won’t take the time to read: MLS owners are ensuring competitive balance. That is not the same thing as fostering a culture of competition. They want this balance because it limits expenses and maximizes revenue. They have a committee that is dedicated to ensuring just that. Slow and steady growth at the expense of open completion. It’s a great way to grow a professional sports league and enrich the owners as franchise values appreciate. It’s a really shitty way to develop the best players in the world. Meanwhile American owners in Europe are burning through money like it’ll never run out. https://www.nytimes.com/athletic/35...-european-leagues/?source=user_shared_article https://www.nytimes.com/athletic/51...les-messi-spending/?source=emp_shared_article
We need some transfer news, this has devolved to yet another battle ground thread. McKennie to MLS would be a good start.
No. He needs to stay abroad until after WC26. I know it likely won't happen given their financial struggles, but Everton should make a loan move for Brenden Aaronson.
That used to be my argument, but after doing that analysis over and over and getting the same answer and seeing all but a very few stagnate, I see no need to use that information. Europe has shown to do a better job developing our players and don't believe MLS really cares. I think MLS sucks because I dont think it is good for amaerican soccer in the long run. I think American players in MLS suck because they have been a drain on our national team since 2017. I probably would have never come to that conclusion if they weren't forced down our throats. I think you and most MLS fans are shills because they won't acknowledge the actual issues raised. I am looking forward to sixth grade next year. Lots of interesting observations about this last sentence. First, it appears to just be the opposite of the MLS sucks/you are a shill strawman you created so you don't have to address the real issues being brought up about this silly league. The accomplishment you describe doesn't really tell us anything other than you have very low expectations. Luckily, I am not a moron and can see some ways that MLS has changed for the better. The quality of play used to really suck and now it is better. Just having an academy even if they don't care is probably better than not having one. The league was a mess and unwatchable 10 to 15 years ago, so a benchmark of improvement isn't impressive to me. Id say cheerleading the smallest of improvements and ignoring issues kind of sounds like the way a shill would act.
the cumulative effect of all of this is dreadful in so many ways dont let teams build any cohesion from year to year.....if a team gets good...they have to be broken up.... lest anyone "laps the field" and makes the shtty teams seem too shtty its a race to the middle! lol also...every signing or roster mechanism is only assessed on direct impact to revenue? it honestly o insulting to mls fans....but how many fans even realize how insulting it is??? obviously not enough..... the actual product ...the actual quality of the product...the level of play only matters relative to revenue.....thats not how to make the product better..... the only way a true fan of the sport in the US can do anything is by ignoring it all.....its a los lose for everyone..... giving them your eyeballs fr low cieling, communism medicocrity ball (with max profit margins!)....just enables the cycle of crap to continue