News: USMNT for the first time publicly defends USWNT in a new statement

Discussion in 'USA Women: News and Analysis' started by McSkillz, Feb 12, 2020.

  1. McSkillz

    McSkillz Member+

    ANGEL CITY FC, UCLA BRUINS
    United States
    Nov 22, 2014
    Los Angeles
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
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  2. lil_one

    lil_one Member+

    Nov 26, 2013
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Not the first time.
     
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  3. gunnerfan7

    gunnerfan7 Member+

    SJ Earthquakes/Arsenal
    United States
    Jul 22, 2012
    Santa Cruz, California
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Aside from the instantaneous and consistent support for the WNT on Twitter.

    Even acting purely in their self-interest, the MNT, playing without a CBA, has an interest in the WNT getting as much money as possible so that they can say: "See what you gave the WNT? We want this now."
     
  4. jackdoggy

    jackdoggy Member+

    May 16, 2014
    Big D
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Ahhhhhhhhh, the ol' rising tide raises all ships theory.:thumbsup:
     
  5. gunnerfan7

    gunnerfan7 Member+

    SJ Earthquakes/Arsenal
    United States
    Jul 22, 2012
    Santa Cruz, California
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I think it fits here, if you think about it.
     
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  6. FanOfFutbol

    FanOfFutbol Member+

    May 4, 2002
    It can also capsize or sink one if it is moored too tightly to a non-floating rigid dock. ;)
     
  7. jackdoggy

    jackdoggy Member+

    May 16, 2014
    Big D
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    sailor.jpg
    "but then of course, I was never a sailor"​
     
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  8. espola

    espola Member+

    Feb 12, 2006
    "Soccer is perhaps the most corrupt sport in the World. We do not want a US Soccer Federation that behaves like FIFA."
     
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  9. FanOfFutbol

    FanOfFutbol Member+

    May 4, 2002
    You are correct in so far as we do not want the USSF to be like FIFA. However I am not so sure that soccer is the "most corrupt sport" in the world. There is just in this country Major League Baseball, the National League Football and even the National Basketball Association that would give worldwide soccer a strong run for the top position on the corruption ladder. That does not even take into account Boxing, including all the corrupted versions like MMA, and horse and automobile racing. Not to mention lesser games like Jai-Alai.

    Those are all very corrupt either by actual manipulation of results or by choosing to ignore rule violations or outright cheating and giving out no real punishments for serious transgressions of the "rules."

    What it comes down to is that whenever big bucks, or Marks or Franks or Yen, are involved there will be some corruption trying to take advantage to a greater or lesser extent. The fact that almost all sports organizations are corrupt to some extent is readily apparent and he big money that many draw makes the corruption more obvious.

    Is soccer at FIFA corrupt? Yes. Is soccer at the club or conference level corrupt in many countries? Yes. But is the corruption unique to soccer anywhere? No.

    Heck I have even noticed parents at U9 basketball games trying to bribe, sometimes successfully, officials to get a win for their kids team.

    It is natural in today's culture for money or pride to almost create corruption out of the air.
     
  10. luvdagame

    luvdagame Member+

    Jul 6, 2000
  11. Cliveworshipper

    Cliveworshipper Member+

    Dec 3, 2006
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  12. Cliveworshipper

    Cliveworshipper Member+

    Dec 3, 2006
    one of the most corrupt in the world was in ussoccer by the name of Chuck Blazer.

    he kept a $6000 USD a month apartment in Trump tower for his cats! And he got the money to the tune of $15 million directly from FIFA.

    https://ftw.usatoday.com/2015/05/chuck-blazer-fifa-trump-tower-cats

    Ussoccer has no special claims to Puritan honesty.
     
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  13. Cliveworshipper

    Cliveworshipper Member+

    Dec 3, 2006
    #13 Cliveworshipper, Feb 13, 2020
    Last edited: Feb 13, 2020

    When will the USMNT get no money from ussoccer? And when will the MLS cease to get a monopoly position and salary caps that are against FIFA laws?
     
  14. puttputtfc

    puttputtfc Member+

    Sep 7, 1999
    You didn't answer the question but I'll ask another.

    Would the USWNT agree to the USMNT contract?
     
  15. Cliveworshipper

    Cliveworshipper Member+

    Dec 3, 2006

    You are Piting the men against the women. That’s not the real issue. It’s is bad faith threatment of players. The men don’t even like the USMNT contract. The statement says it was negotiated I bad faith in a poor economy should be triple what it is based on increased revenue.

    You didn’t answer my question, so I’ll ask another.

    when will ussoccer stop giving owners of leagues of both genders a monopoly position against FIFA laws?
    There is no provision in FIFA for leagues or federations to hold player contracts. All FIFA regulations say primary contracts are held by clubs.
     
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  16. puttputtfc

    puttputtfc Member+

    Sep 7, 1999
    How am I pitting the men against the women? If the goal is equality, then the USWNT should accept the men's contract.

    Of course the statement said everything should be triple. Unions releasing ridiculous statements are a given during negotiations.

    I'm not well versed on FIFA rules with respect to international labor laws and I get the feeling you are not as well. If you can point to the statute, please do.

    Your last statement leads me to believe you are against the USWNT contract as these players are USSF employees playing in NWSL. Am I misreading the statement? I do not believe that is your intention.
     
  17. luvdagame

    luvdagame Member+

    Jul 6, 2000
    btw, I myself think that the uswnt still needs allocation (decreased each year, which they are doing), and I think that nwsl still needs ussoccer $$ to survive (the amount should probably be decreased each year as well, but I don't know if the league would survive, and I certainly don't want it to die).

    i'm only asking if the women will be ok with this new contract they seek minus those two piles of ussoccer $$.
     
  18. Cliveworshipper

    Cliveworshipper Member+

    Dec 3, 2006
    #18 Cliveworshipper, Feb 13, 2020
    Last edited: Feb 13, 2020
    in reverse order:

    yes, I am in principle against the USSF holding the primary contracts on players for several reasons. It gives the federation control of when and where they play in opposition to FIFA rules, which state players can be drawn away from their clubs only during FIFA Windows, among other provisions. It also caps earning for players.

    I am perhaps a little more familiar with the regulations than you. I have read them, you apparently have not.
    international football is governed by FIFA regulations with appeal to the Court of Arbitration for sports. The operant document is this:

    https://resources.fifa.com/image/up...2018-2925437.pdf?cloudid=c83ynehmkp62h5vgwg9g

    those regulations are specifically “A professional is a player who has a written contract with a club and is paid more for his footballing activity than the expenses he effectively incurs.”
    I’ll let you familiarize yourself with the document. Then tell me where Leagues hold contracts or federations do. (Hint:There is no provision for a primary contract with either a league or a federation, only with a club.) federations only have relases durimg FIFA Windows. The USWNT regularly draws players outside those windows. (They are in camp right now, for instance and will be during the season.)

    and disputes between clubs and players are adjudicated by the local federations with approval from FIFA .
    Which makes it pretty difficult to arbitrate a dispute if you are one side of the dispute by virtue of owning the contract, isn’t it?
    The only real recourse is where it is, in the labor courts.

    as owner or the NWSL, USSOCCER has played fast and loose with FIFA regulations. One example it article 16 which states that contracts can’t be terminated in mid season. The standard NWSL contract allows the NWSL to terminate a player at any time.
    As holder of monopoly positions granted by the USSF, the two leagues have ignored that and other provisions of the document ( solidarity payments, player dispute resolution, transfer provisions,training compensation to lower leagues, salary caps, etc.) that are not supported by the document or by US law.

    Further, Article 19, Paragraph 1 of FIFA’s Regulations Governing the Application of Statutes mandates promotion and relegation. Specifically, the article provides that a “club’s entitlement to take part in a domestic league championship shall depend principally on sporting merit.”
    This is the promotion/relegation system enshrined in the document. ( page 65)

    https://resources.fifa.com/mm/document/affederation/generic/01/09/75/14/fifa_statutes_072008_en.pdf

    MLS and NWSL don’t follow that. He is no relegation. The only thing that gets you out of the league is your own financial incompetence and bankruptcy . Promotion is by franchise, with payments to the league and club franchisees. The primary considerations for promotion are ability to pay franchise fees, the attractiveness of the market for future league revenue, and stadium fitness. There really isn’t a competitive component.

    and the USSF owning player primary contracts is against another provision against third party contracts.

    “18: Third-party ownership of players’ economic rights
    1.
    No club or player shall enter into an agreement with a third party whereby
    a third party is being entitled to participate, either in full or in part, in compensation payable in relation to the future transfer of a player from one club to another, or is being assigned any rights in relation to a future transfer or transfer compensation.”

    Transfer of players in the MLS and NWSL is governed by the USSF and the leagues, not the clubs, with only the exception of players who’s affiliation is with other federations. They actually get more protection than US federation players.


    so on the basis of the two documents cited, I think there is plenty of support for the position that both the men and the women on the national teams and in the leagues are not being treated fairly, and that the USSF has carved out a position for itself that is contrary to FIFA regulations.
     

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