USL to implement promotion and relegation

Discussion in 'Soccer in the USA' started by superdave, Feb 13, 2025.

  1. jaykoz3

    jaykoz3 Member+

    Dec 25, 2010
    Conshohocken, PA
    Club:
    Philadelphia Union
    Nat'l Team:
    United States


    Folding teams, a labor fight, and … expansion? The USL’s structure allows for it all to happen

    https://www.theguardian.com/football/2026/mar/10/usl-structure-promotion-relegation-expansion

    Some insight into USL's structure.
     
  2. STR1

    STR1 Member+

    Atlanta United
    United States
    May 29, 2010
    Club:
    Real Madrid
    USL HQ keeps all the money to themselves for TV rights, any USL sponsorship deals and franchise fees. There is no revenue sharing like in MLS.

    USL clubs keep whatever they make at the gate. They'll be lucky to break even if they don't own a stadium. All expenses are through the club; hotels, flights etc.

    USL HQ can't offer health care or any other requirements players are making as the players are not employed by the the league. They are employed by the clubs (smart move to get off responsibility by USL if you ask me tbh). Clubs can't offer everything players want because they are barely surviving as it is.

    This is the league all the MLS haters are cheering on to take out big bad MLS and replace it with a "league that feels more authentic and not so corporate as MLS" as Tactical Manager would say.
     
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  3. Paul Berry

    Paul Berry Member+

    Notts County and NYCFC
    United States
    Apr 18, 2015
    Nr Kingston NY
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Under The Club Dividend Plan USL splits 50% of national and international TV and sponsorship revenue with the clubs.

    Someone estimated that may be worth around $9 million, split between 42 clubs, which is about $215k each. That really doesn't cover much.
     
  4. jaykoz3

    jaykoz3 Member+

    Dec 25, 2010
    Conshohocken, PA
    Club:
    Philadelphia Union
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Read the Guardian article, it details out how teams are ran in USL.
     
  5. Paul Berry

    Paul Berry Member+

    Notts County and NYCFC
    United States
    Apr 18, 2015
    Nr Kingston NY
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I did. I was replying to "USL HQ keeps all the money to themselves for TV rights, any USL sponsorship deals".

    It's incorrect. The article doesn't contradict this.

    "The USL, meanwhile, still does not have meaningful revenue sharing with its clubs".

    The big money is currently in expansion fees.
     
  6. An Unpaved Road

    An Unpaved Road Member+

    Mar 22, 2006
    Club:
    --other--
    I just read a thread the other day on the USL subreddit how they will eventually “beat” MLS because USL is more organic. Thankfully there was some pushback and suggestions that the poster should just concentrate on the actual soccer.
     
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  7. Yoshou

    Yoshou Fan of the CCL Champ

    May 12, 2009
    Seattle
    Club:
    Seattle Sounders
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    And the annual licensing fees, right?

    Also, are licensing and expansion fees shared with the teams?

    Morning Kickaround talked about this and Jason Davis pointed out that for NuRock, there really isn't an incentive to make sure a new club is viable and that existing clubs are healthy. From a purely business perspective, as long NuRock gets enough expansion fee from new clubs to offset the lost licensing fees for contracting teams, it's a win for them.
     
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  8. Paul Berry

    Paul Berry Member+

    Notts County and NYCFC
    United States
    Apr 18, 2015
    Nr Kingston NY
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Expansion fees no. What do you mean by licensing fees?
     
  9. Yoshou

    Yoshou Fan of the CCL Champ

    May 12, 2009
    Seattle
    Club:
    Seattle Sounders
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    From what I understand, USL teams have to pay NuRock an annual fee for their license.
     
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  10. jaykoz3

    jaykoz3 Member+

    Dec 25, 2010
    Conshohocken, PA
    Club:
    Philadelphia Union
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
  11. jaykoz3

    jaykoz3 Member+

    Dec 25, 2010
    Conshohocken, PA
    Club:
    Philadelphia Union
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Sac Republic have not yet committed to USL Premier:



     
  12. Yoshou

    Yoshou Fan of the CCL Champ

    May 12, 2009
    Seattle
    Club:
    Seattle Sounders
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Because, according to the mayor, they are looking to join MLS…
     
  13. jaykoz3

    jaykoz3 Member+

    Dec 25, 2010
    Conshohocken, PA
    Club:
    Philadelphia Union
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Well yes there is that, and also the current fact that USL Premier does not exist yet either.
     
  14. jaykoz3

    jaykoz3 Member+

    Dec 25, 2010
    Conshohocken, PA
    Club:
    Philadelphia Union
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    So most would say that Wrexham is a success, and has been a success for Rob and Ryan.



    Wrexham still lost £14.85M during the 24/25 season....... and have lost £25M in the 4 seasons the duo has owned the club.
     
  15. superdave

    superdave Member+

    Jul 14, 1999
    Raleigh NC
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    IIRC that Athletic article correctly, a lot of those losses were related to the capital investment of rebuilding their Kop, and much of the rest was some kind of financial maneuvering. Not that they haven’t legit lost money, but it’s not as dire as that tweet makes it seem.
     
  16. Paul Berry

    Paul Berry Member+

    Notts County and NYCFC
    United States
    Apr 18, 2015
    Nr Kingston NY
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    The "record" it refers to is the revenue number, not the loss. Charlton lost £16.7m that same season.
     
  17. jaykoz3

    jaykoz3 Member+

    Dec 25, 2010
    Conshohocken, PA
    Club:
    Philadelphia Union
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    The Private Equity firms have ousted USL's Deputy CEO and head of Real Estate Justin Papadakis. Seems rather quick to be making board changes.
     
  18. jaykoz3

    jaykoz3 Member+

    Dec 25, 2010
    Conshohocken, PA
    Club:
    Philadelphia Union
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    song219 repped this.
  19. Paul Berry

    Paul Berry Member+

    Notts County and NYCFC
    United States
    Apr 18, 2015
    Nr Kingston NY
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I think but emphasizing oversized stadiums as the root of the issue, the article is missing the main factor.

    The main factor is that the big 4 clubs are competing with the top teams in Europe, generating revenue up to and in excess of €150 million, while the small town clubs play in front of a few thousand locals. There are only 4 urban areas in Portugal with a population over 110,000. The small teams try and play catch up and fail. They may have the odd season in Europe but that ends up making things worse in the long run as they become dependent on UEFA money.

    This situation gets worse as UCL prize money grows.

    In addition you have the globalization of soccer, where little Francisco grows up watching Arsenal or Milan on satellite TV and ignores the local team playing in a 30,000 seat stadium in front of 5,000 locals.

    The US definitely has the second problem. Even as MLS fans we are constantly reminded by our compatriots that our product is "inferior". USL teams have an even bigger mountain to climb. And if USL does start a D1 they're going to constantly be compared to Messi's Inter Miami.

    But US "lower division" teams have problems that don't exist in Europe, like geographic isolation, competition from other pro sports and even competition from high school sports. I used to walk into CVS opposite Dietz Stadium and see hats and sweatshirts for the Kingston Tigers high school team but nothing for Stockade.
     
  20. jaykoz3

    jaykoz3 Member+

    Dec 25, 2010
    Conshohocken, PA
    Club:
    Philadelphia Union
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Did you glaze over the points about the region not having other infrastructure (airports, rail) nor the population to support the growth ambitions?
     
  21. Paul Berry

    Paul Berry Member+

    Notts County and NYCFC
    United States
    Apr 18, 2015
    Nr Kingston NY
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    No but why do you need any airport or train station when most of the population lives with a two hour drive of the two major cities?
     
  22. jaykoz3

    jaykoz3 Member+

    Dec 25, 2010
    Conshohocken, PA
    Club:
    Philadelphia Union
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Why would they need a highway? You didn't read the article. The country's and Football League's ambitions were bigger than what the region could support. Those large stadiums have difficulty hosting events because there isn't any infrastructure to get more people to those places efficiently (airport, better highways, and rail; systems).

    To draw a parallel to USL's ambition as a league: How are teams and fans expected to travel to all of the non-major markets for games efficiently, and cost effectively? How are people, entertainers, etc supposed to get to these places in order to host other events to justify the larger stadiums?
     
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  23. jaykoz3

    jaykoz3 Member+

    Dec 25, 2010
    Conshohocken, PA
    Club:
    Philadelphia Union
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Kartik playing revisionist history............. MLS still has three Canadian teams because they were grandfathered in due to Canada NOT having a league when they entered MLS.

     
  24. Paul Berry

    Paul Berry Member+

    Notts County and NYCFC
    United States
    Apr 18, 2015
    Nr Kingston NY
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I did read the article. The cost of maintaining those stadiums is a factor but he seems to have missed the biggest factor in my opinion, which is that Champions League money is increasing the distortion between the haves and have nots.

    One of the three cities he focused on is 30 minutes from Porto, by train. All three are accessible by highway in less than 2 hours.
     
  25. jaykoz3

    jaykoz3 Member+

    Dec 25, 2010
    Conshohocken, PA
    Club:
    Philadelphia Union
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Gotcha.... so it's lack of champions league football that the local municipalities have difficulty attracting events for the stadiums?
     

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