Post-match: USA vs Mexico - October 15, 2024 [R]

Discussion in 'USA Men: News & Analysis' started by schrutebuck, Oct 16, 2024.

  1. Khan

    Khan Member+

    Mar 16, 2000
    On the road
    All managers have blind spots.

    But certain players getting exposed can make them fade out of a manager's plans.


    I'm more disappointed in the effort, and in the inability to complete 2 passes in a row.


    The selection will sort itself over time.
     
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  2. NietzscheIsDead

    NietzscheIsDead Member+

    NO WAR
    United States
    May 31, 2019
    NO WAR
    Well, it looks like the most memorable thing from the opening window was Kasey Keller basically sniffing this out and going fire-and-brimstone prophetic.

    I hope that the story gets better from here, because at this stage the pre-2026 performance is shocking. It’s stunning, but not so brave.
     
  3. gogorath

    gogorath Member+

    None
    United States
    May 12, 2019
    We have been taught this lesson fifty times, and no one ever seems to learn. I've given up on it.

    And Poch spent the entire lead up talking about getting on the ball once you lose it. But did we do it? Not really.

    Welcome to this team. It's been happening at least since WCQ started in El Salvador. Over and over and over. Seriously, go back and listen to Adams talk about how they underestimated CONCACAF on the road, blah, blah, blah.
     
  4. Marko72

    Marko72 Member+

    Aug 30, 2005
    New York
    THIS is what I really dislike about this team. We've never been like that before.

    It's understandable when it happens to you for the first time. Maybe even the second. But for much of our player pool, this has happened so many times I've lost count. You AREN'T getting that call, Hoss. Meanwhile, as you sit on your ass and bitch, the other side is running right through your zone and we're playing with 10.
     
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  5. Yowza

    Yowza Member+

    DC United
    United States
    Oct 23, 2019
    Arlington
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Thank goodness the WC is at home.
    Glad I missed this one, yeesh.
     
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  6. NietzscheIsDead

    NietzscheIsDead Member+

    NO WAR
    United States
    May 31, 2019
    NO WAR
    It was part of the “Golden Generation” thread, but really who do you all see being the players to pick this thing up by the scruff of the neck and to make the plays that change games? There has to be a core of guys who grind out control in every game. It can’t just be Pulisic on an island.

    I think that we see that from Antonee we saw that from Adams before injury. There are a few guys who could step into that as well like Dest, Weah, McKennie, and Reyna. Maybe Balogun, who will be looking to make a name for himself internationally at the next World Cup. Balogun was one of the only bright spots in Copa America. But if that’s it, that is a shallow pool. You basically have three competitors, 4 guys who are inconsistent, and then what else?

    It’s not looking good. I think that Pochettino will need to start testing MLS guys, especially brash youngsters who want to make a name. I call in Cavan Sullivan to the January camp and I see if he can piss off my defensive players. If so, I give him his international debut.

    Pochettino is going to have to shake the tree.
     
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  7. NietzscheIsDead

    NietzscheIsDead Member+

    NO WAR
    United States
    May 31, 2019
    NO WAR
    I thought that this was the case as well, and Martino probably has an insider view on what Mauricio is doing.
     
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  8. jond

    jond Member+

    Sep 28, 2010
    Club:
    Levski Sofia
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Are people surprised there’s a massive drop off after our top 15 players?

    There’s a reason Morris is a 2nd division player and Busio was a 2nd division player last year. And that’s just the middle of the pitch.

    We’ll see what Poch does in Nov with a hopefully healthier pool.

    Tillman tho, I’ll acknowledge his club form and talent. But he simply isn’t displaying that quality time and again with the NT. And I’m not talking about systemic or positional issues. It’s like dude, you’re a top player for PSV and you’re not flashing any individual qualities. Do something with the ball that says, I’m talented. Clock is ticking.

    Try Luna.
     
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  9. Marko72

    Marko72 Member+

    Aug 30, 2005
    New York
    Our subs, however, were ok today. Tessman, Zendejas, Vazquez, etc. It was the backups who were in the XI tonight who were the real disappointment.
     
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  10. NietzscheIsDead

    NietzscheIsDead Member+

    NO WAR
    United States
    May 31, 2019
    NO WAR

    Tillman is at his best in a system like Berhalters where he can focus his game around the 18 and get involved in both creating chances, combining, and carving out shots. Whatever it was we were doing in these two games does not suit him, even though he did help create the second goal against Panama on a more direct play.

    Tillman did not look happy in this camp in any footage that I saw. He may be being asked to move more in the open field and to win and keep the ball to circulate it before making runs at goal. That’s different from what he is comfortable with.

    Also, I think that Fossey is almost the de facto right back in Dest’s absence.

    With all of the out-of-position stuff that was happening, it would be good to see Scally at center back because what we have there is inadequate and Scally is inadequate at right back. He is unable to contribute to the offense and at times he struggles to keep the ball in front of himself when defending.
     
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  11. NietzscheIsDead

    NietzscheIsDead Member+

    NO WAR
    United States
    May 31, 2019
    NO WAR
    I agree. Both Zendejas and Vazquez were pissed. Their teammates embarrassed them. Those guys are ridiculed for choosing the USMNT and this kind of display (in Mexico, even) fuels that nonsense. Tessman did connect to the front line much more than Morris, so he was an improvement also.

    Vazquez and Zendejas should have played 90 in this one.
     
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  12. jond

    jond Member+

    Sep 28, 2010
    Club:
    Levski Sofia
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Part of the issue is we’re seeing a team who has been coddled with all the home games.

    Not sure why people ignore the longer term negative impact of rarely playing on the road.
     
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  13. BMWDeuce

    BMWDeuce Member

    AC Milan
    United States
    Aug 15, 2024
    I will say this for all the doom and gloom from tonight, I do think over the course of 2 windows You have seen encouraging stuff that Morris, Busio, Vazquez, McKenzie Tessmann, and Zendejas could have roles on the team. They may be specific roles and they may just be bench players but there are things to say.... okay we can maybe work with that

    We are also seeing that some of the guys many in the fanbase have been banking on stepping up just... aren't.

    I do expect better going forward. Just gotta admit that the Mexico game was probably not the one to sit key players
     
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  14. Reccossu

    Reccossu Member+

    Jan 31, 2005
    Birmingham
    Uh oh. The wheels are coming off at a bad time.

    No fight but also no skill. You’d think each player could manage one or the other. Especially against Mexico.

    The midfield was absolutely dominated. The team could not play out of the back at all when pressed. And every throw in was a turnover.

    Just awful. And while I didn’t expect new manager tactics to make a big difference, I am surprised by the lack of intensity.
     
  15. jreadusaf

    jreadusaf Member

    Jun 18, 2009
    Tübingen, Germany
    Club:
    Fulham FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I'm not sure what everyone is freaking out about, it's a friendly game with a new coach who is testing things out. I'm okay with experimenting in friendlies to see what works and what doesn't work. Who cares?
     
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  16. Ghost

    Ghost Member+

    Sep 5, 2001
    It's like we have players who can be players 18-23. But they're player 15.
     
  17. BMWDeuce

    BMWDeuce Member

    AC Milan
    United States
    Aug 15, 2024
    A lot I think is emotion from a bad game. But as I said, guys like Busio and Morris who are fighting to break into the team having a poor game? I can live with that. Players who have been on the team for years and continuously failing to rise to the occasion when given a bigger role? There I have an issue
     
  18. gogorath

    gogorath Member+

    None
    United States
    May 12, 2019
    The big problem as I see it is this:

    We know the team's intensity and focus dropped in the past 6+ months.

    Our new coach spent literally the entire camp publicly, and I assume, privately, basically saying all we were focusing on was intensity.

    A large portion of the roster still really failed to bring intensity.

    I'm less concerned about some of the rough games. I'm more concerned about the continuing issue that this team seems lax and physically and mentally soft across large portions of the roster.

    Second string or no ... you can bring some level of heat. But getting beat to balls constantly, losing duels, watching as the opponent takes the ball back immediately while you sulk when you lose it ...

    First it was Berhalter. The it was an interim coach waiting on Poch. Now it's still here.

    There's just so much egg laying and I'm far less concerned about the errors than the effort level. The post game show refused to say what they really wanted to say: there's a decent portion of this roster that simply doesn't bring it, and I suspect it just isn't in their skillset.

    It's a B team, for sure. And the reality is that the A team is simply better and for the most part, doesn't have as many of these issues.

    But our A team is also never healthy.
     
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  19. xbhaskarx

    xbhaskarx Member+

    San Jose Earthquakes
    United States
    Feb 13, 2010
    NorCal
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    would be pretty cool if more of our guys displayed those things like character attitude and fight


    aggressiveness
     
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  20. gogorath

    gogorath Member+

    None
    United States
    May 12, 2019
    We will be better with our A team.

    But who from the A team will be there in November? Not Dest. Not Reyna. Not Balogun. Richards pulled a hammy, so I doubt him?

    Tyler and Weah are maybes? McKennie probably is, too, though he's Wolverine.

    I mean, we may be playing Jamaica with a team not too far off from this.
     
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  21. gogorath

    gogorath Member+

    None
    United States
    May 12, 2019
    Yeah, I mean Mexico didn't look all that good. Without Raul, it's a 0-0 tie, I think and ugly as hell.

    But they won the loose balls and they won the duels and they completed passes. So it's miles ahead of what we saw.
     
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  22. Rahbiefowlah

    Rahbiefowlah Member+

    Oct 22, 2001
    Las Vegas
    I do wonder if this is rock bottom…or are we going to lose to Jamaica over two legs in November and have to schedule Guatemala and El Salvador for friendlies in March.
     
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  23. S.J. Jim

    S.J. Jim Member+

    Jun 11, 2006
    S.J.
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I didn't (and still haven't) seen the pre-game comments by Keller that have been referred to here, but when I looked at the starting line-up (especially our four "attackers"), I said "Uh-oh". This is probably not going to go well. Sure enough. Sargent isn't the kind of player who's going to make much of an impact in a game where we aren't driving things and creating much danger for our opponent. So, a "lack of service" is probably a fair excuse to some degree, but you still have to find some way to make a positive impact.

    Musah as a way of disappearing in some games, and for me this was one of them. I guess I'll have to watch again to see what he did (and didn't do).

    I've never been a fan of Aaronson. One has to admire his motor, but after awhile he just looks like a wind-up toy. He made a couple of good passes tonight, but just way too many turnovers and weak challenges. At some point he started back-passing way too often, as though we were the team that was up 2-0 (and he wasn't the only one who was acting like that was the score). As someone already mentioned, it seemed crazy to me for Aaronson to remain on the field for as long as he did.

    Tillman took a moderately hard foul to his calf early in the game. Then he seemed to want the ball less, and proceeded to fall down nearly every time he was touched, hoping for a call. This was a game where we needed him to step up, and I don't think he was that interested.

    I thought Morris and Busio looked pretty good vs Panama, and pretty good in the first part of this game, but gradually I think they both got frustrated, sloppy, demoralized, and probably tired.

    Our back line was scaring me at times- even early in the game before the wheels started to come off. Too many loose passes into the midfield from Robinson, Ream and Jedi. I'm not recalling Scally as being as guilty, but I could be wrong. I thought they defended reasonably well up until that second goal. The first goal was the result of Mexico being more aggressive than we were, and earning that free kick. Great shot by Ramirez, hats off, etc. The defending on the second goal was more egregious, and is more concerning as we look ahead. Ream should have cleared that ball immediately after winning possession; and Robinson needed to be tighter on the goal-scorer... but it too was well-taken. As for Turner, his distribution is still my biggest concern about him as our potential #1.

    I was pleased with what I saw from all the subs, with the exception of Lund. I thought Vasquez was very impressive considering the circumstances. I've always liked his game, and I'm not so sure he won't end up ahead of Balogun on our A team. But until we get everybody (hopefully literally everybody) healthy and back together again, it's hard to know who will fit Poch's plans and vision more effectively. Pepi may also have a shot, imo.

    This game doesn't really cause me any concern with regard to Poch, even though some of his decisions make me scratch my head a bit. I think he was simply content to experiment and risk poor results, and just calmly deal with the consequences since it's so early in the process and because he's still without so many of our most talented players.
     
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  24. rgli13

    rgli13 Member+

    Mar 23, 2005
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    i saw the same things the rest of you did, and i dont think most of you are pissed off enough but i will say this-

    one very tangible, identifiable thing poch has done is go with passers in the middle (morris and busio with a bit of tesserman/pushing musah wide) and considering our cbs thats a very understandable move.

    ...still relying on cbs dominating the ball is a steaming pile of horseshit, but i dont think the idea of possession/passing in the middle is the problem.

    adams is acceptable in that regard, but he doesnt play much soccer between rushing back from injuries too quickly anymore. johnny is more sporadic than either of these guys. luca (and busio, imo) doesnt give enough cover. musah has found his happy place in the only role he can complete any passes whatsoever- five yards ahead of scally where he can first touch every damn ball straight back in the blink of an eye.

    so however inexperienced/raw, morris and tesserman are as important as any other factor to our becoming a decent team.

    we have to move further away from the cbs on the ball to that presumable line of 2 and the pool is adams, morris, tesserman and possibly johnny. no one else. thats it.

    cause we can defend/counter or we can find some way to build attacks, but we cant do both. since the latter is obviously what we are committed to it cant start at the (center)back. it cant include musah, wes, etc in the middle. there is no non-reyna 10 so we need to find some way to play a second striker without calling them a striker cause 2 forwards is sooo passe.

    every minute we spend on that is wasted. from game 1 to game 2 poch didnt seem to learn any lessons. window 1 of 9 is now over.

    we can only hope his long term comprehension is better. im trying real hard to keep his job at chelsea in mind- it took a while but he did figure it out about halfway though the season.
    cause our timeline is even tighter than that.
     
  25. rgli13

    rgli13 Member+

    Mar 23, 2005
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    yeah, i especially liked how he stomped twice before being beaten for a goal.
     

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