USA goalkeeper discussion thread - Episode IV: A New Hope

Discussion in 'USA Men: News & Analysis' started by OWN(yewu)ED, Jul 9, 2023.

  1. xbhaskarx

    xbhaskarx Member+

    San Jose Earthquakes
    United States
    Feb 13, 2010
    NorCal
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Same except Beavers over Slonina because third division
     
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  2. Pegasus

    Pegasus Member+

    Apr 20, 1999
    Club:
    FC Dallas
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Who's to say Steffen isn't a few years ahead of Turner and Horvath? Steffen has already done the backup who didn't play bit and is now back in MLS getting minutes. Would anyone be surprised if Turner and Horvath are back in MLS soon? Would be funny if Schulte starts over all of them.
     
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  3. KALM

    KALM Member+

    Oct 6, 2006
    Boston/Providence
    Hmm, yeah not great.

     
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  4. gomichigan24

    gomichigan24 Member+

    Jul 15, 2002
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I think the thing with Horvath and Turner if they come back to MLS would be how they play. When Turner left he was the best goalie in the league so that’s the sort of level I’d want to see from him if he returned. And it’s not the level we’ve seen from Steffen.
     
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  5. ChrisSSBB

    ChrisSSBB Member+

    Jun 22, 2005
    DE
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    He also showed his inexperience on setting up the wall and thinking near post was covered on Messi’s free kick goal. It was Messi, but he bent it around the wall and into the near corner with ease.
     
  6. OWN(yewu)ED

    OWN(yewu)ED Member+

    Club: Venezia F.C.
    May 26, 2006
    chico, CA
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    that’s a crowd? lol oh boy……
     
  7. Clint Eastwood

    Clint Eastwood Member+

    Dec 23, 2003
    Somerville, MA
    Club:
    FC Dallas
    The new staff knows of Steffen from his time in England.
    I'd have to look thru the games to see if Poch actually faced him.

    This is really not a big deal. The new goalkeeper coach will get him into camp and evaluate him. If they think he's not good enough, then they'll move on.

    The new USSF goalkeeping guru (overseeing all programs) got to work with the 4 from the last camp. So at least Poch and his new USMNT goalkeeping coach have those scouting reports available.
     
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  8. KALM

    KALM Member+

    Oct 6, 2006
    Boston/Providence
    I actually don't think Steffen and Poch ever overlapped within the same league. Steffen was in the Bundesliga when Poch was at Tottenham. Then Poch was at PSG when Steffen was in the Premier League. Then Steffen was in the Championship when Poch was back in the Premier League last season. And they never faced each other in cup games across leagues.
     
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  9. OWN(yewu)ED

    OWN(yewu)ED Member+

    Club: Venezia F.C.
    May 26, 2006
    chico, CA
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    #1659 OWN(yewu)ED, Oct 3, 2024
    Last edited: Oct 3, 2024
    I have no issues with second chances. Seems like the Steffen bridge was burned with Gregg , or with Zac, or both…… but yeah, this is a new beginning with new chances. I guess current hope is Freese is this cycles turner. Haven’t watched much of him but reports are good.

    Turner literally had to force the issue , maybe freese can do the same
     
  10. Pegasus

    Pegasus Member+

    Apr 20, 1999
    Club:
    FC Dallas
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Agree but with possible loss of confidence would he be the best now? Really hard to know as his national team form isn't as good as it was. Maybe being the guy and getting minutes would help him regain form. That's kind of what I'm getting at. "If" the only place our keepers can be starters is MLS then if they want to play for the national they may need to come back to MLS or not leave in the first place. Canada's keeper looked fine and is an MLS keeper.
     
  11. gomichigan24

    gomichigan24 Member+

    Jul 15, 2002
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Sure but Steffen hasn’t been close to one of the top American keepers in MLS. Maybe our goalie should come from MLS, but we should at least pick the ones who play the best.
     
  12. Dervos

    Dervos Member+

    Mar 13, 2002
    Club:
    Austin Aztex
    Has anybody in our pool ever ridden a single good stretch of form long longer and further than Zach? It been 5 years(!) since his single excellent season at a high level of competition. I'm always rooting for Zach, and it's not his fault he keeps getting called up, but dear lord please stop.
     
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  13. An Unpaved Road

    An Unpaved Road Member+

    Mar 22, 2006
    Club:
    --other--
    Horvath got a ton of mileage from his Champions League "run."
     
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  14. thedukeofsoccer

    thedukeofsoccer Member+

    Jul 11, 2004
    Wussconsin
    Club:
    AFC Ajax
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I don't think Schulte was at significant fault for any of those 3 goals.

    1. The best fk taker in the world bent a shot around the wall & perfectly placed it in the corner.
    2. Messi took a ball over the top he was closer to and then nicked the ball passed Schulte
    3. His teammate, who had a mare, ran into Schulte while he was comfortably catching a ball

    The one I had questions on him was an early disallowed goal off a corner kick which he didn't necessarily need to give up cuz he may have beaten an attacker to the ball. But he played conservative instead of potentially running into the guy for a penalty.

    It wasn't a convincing night and I've never been over the moon about Schulte's shot-stopping. But it's also not the catastrophe it's being made out to be. I'd more put it into the category of "played Messi".

    Let's see how he does in camp and in more big games where he's shone before.

    There's been some slippage for the domestic gk'ing pool who was performing well during the season. Let's hope that's more coasting their way into the playoffs, instead of there not being an option as good as Turner was, or even is now, in which case we'd have to circle back to him.
     
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  15. largegarlic

    largegarlic Member+

    Jul 2, 2007
    I only saw the third goal that was posted here, but I agree on that one. If Schulte made a mistake, it was not communicating clearly enough with his CB. But that's a common thing for younger GKs to have a problem with and is pretty easily correctable. It's not like he's failing to save slow rollers to the corner or something, which could show an unchangeable lack of athleticism.
     
  16. Dervos

    Dervos Member+

    Mar 13, 2002
    Club:
    Austin Aztex
    Heh, he was also the closest I could think of, which speaks to the keeper pool, but it's not actually very close.

    Ethan's had a grand total of 10 appearances for the US since 2016, 7 of the 10 were in friendlies, and he's never appeared in World Cup qualifying. It's nothing at all like what Zach's been given based on his hot streak at Fortuna in 2019.

    Ethan's done enough competent stuff in the Championship (not this year!) to slot in to a camp back up role / occasional friendly start when Matt or Zach weren't avaiable.
     
  17. nobody

    nobody Member+

    Jun 20, 2000
    Thing is, we don't have a good choice. All of these guys have bad moments and bad stretches. That's a big part of the problem. We're not picking from a solid group where a guy makes a string of errors and you can cast him aside and move to the next one with confidence the mistakes won't happen with him too. They will all have stretches of poor play. The coach has to take it all in and make a decision who he thinks is likely to be the best, most consistent choice over time. Just throwing out every guy for the latest mistake and constantly reshuffling the deck isn't going to magically improve the situation. When all your choices are limited, you have to be a bit less obsessive about little mistakes when a guy makes them because the competition will inevitably do the same. The hope is that you end up with the guy least likely to make them when the most is on the line.
     
  18. Clint Eastwood

    Clint Eastwood Member+

    Dec 23, 2003
    Somerville, MA
    Club:
    FC Dallas
    I don't really understand this Steffen conversation.

    Berhalter turned the page on the older guys used in the 2018 cycle (Guzan, Howard, etc.) and also in MLS.

    He turned to the young and developing guys just like we're turning to Schulte now.
    Steffen had just been MLS Goalkeeper of the Year in 2018 as a ~23 year old.
    He and Horvath were "next men up." And, by and large, that's what the board wanted to happen too.

    Unfortunately, Horvath went into club purgatory and Steffen started having serious injury problems in the 2019/2020 season. Our plans with those two went out the window.

    So we turned to Turner midway thru the cycle, who was MLS goalkeeper of the year in 2021
    Which is what the board wanted.

    I do think there's quite a lot of "hindsight is 20/20" on these boards when talking about Steffen.

    We weren't going to use the MLS Goalkeeper of the Year that was purchased by Manchester effing City in 2019????? Of course we were going to turn the page from Guzan to him. It just didn't work out. If the American version of Oliver Kahn existed, we would have turned to him. That person didn't exist. And still doesn't. Hence the endless discussion about goalkeepers we've had on these boards since the 2014 World Cup. Its been 10 years since we've had that unquestioned #1.
     
  19. Yowza

    Yowza Member+

    DC United
    United States
    Oct 23, 2019
    Arlington
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    When I’m doubt, punch it out.
     
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  20. KALM

    KALM Member+

    Oct 6, 2006
    Boston/Providence
    I don't think it's a catastrophe or anything, and I agree all of our options seem at least somewhat error prone at this point, but it is unfortunate timing for Schulte right before his first UMSNT game with a new manager when it seemed possible he might take the starting reins going forward.

    https://www.cleveland.com/sports/20...columbus-crew-in-3-2-loss-to-inter-miami.html

    “It’s football. Simple as that,” Nancy said. “(Schulte) saved us many times during the season, and tonight he had not a good night. He knows that.”
     
  21. comoesa

    comoesa Member+

    Aug 13, 2010
    Christen Press's armpit
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Eh, this is a Horvarth constant nightmare type error.

    This something that rarely happens most defenders are aware enoguh even if there goalie doesn't give them the proper shout.
     
  22. gomichigan24

    gomichigan24 Member+

    Jul 15, 2002
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    The think with Steffen is everyone always talked about his potential and would he could be if he reached it. Tim Howard in particular has always talked this up. And this point Steffen is 29 and I don’t think there’s any realizing that potential anymore. He basically is what he is.
     
  23. gomichigan24

    gomichigan24 Member+

    Jul 15, 2002
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I don’t think the problem is that we used Steffen in 2019. No one is arguing against that and I certainly didn’t have a problem with it.

    But we’re now in 2024 and he’s not shown him self to be as good as some of the other options just based on how he’s looked in MLS. I don’t think anyone thinks for instance he has any shot at being MLS goalkeeper of the year for this season.
     
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  24. gogorath

    gogorath Member+

    None
    United States
    May 12, 2019
    1. It was a poorly set up wall. Yes, Messi is great, but that's a learning moment on what players can do.

    2. Agree. It's Messi.

    3. This comes down to communication. A lot of young keepers struggle with this -- but he's the guy who can see everything. He needs to be communicating with his CB. If he was loud and clear on what to do and the guy ignored him, then the blame changes. If he didn't say anything or was too late, it's on the guy who can see everything.

    One of the things we rarely talk about is how much of the keeper's role is organizing the defense. That's a big part of the job.
     
  25. thedukeofsoccer

    thedukeofsoccer Member+

    Jul 11, 2004
    Wussconsin
    Club:
    AFC Ajax
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    It's also ambiguous to evaluate, & in the end all you can control are your own actions. Macho Camacho had a mare. He was making glaring mistakes all night.
     

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