US-Martinique, analysis (please rant elsewhere)

Discussion in 'USA Men: News & Analysis' started by superdave, Jul 15, 2021.

  1. superdave

    superdave Member+

    Jul 14, 1999
    VB, VA
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Martinique looked pretty awful; we'll see if I'm right when they play Haiti. But, you can only play the team in front of you.

    Loved Sands. Dike's 2nd/3rd was terrific. I liked Hoppe's inventiveness. He doesn't play like an American. Zardes scored; he's the Cris Carter of the USMNT. Acosta was bad. Players got rotated, so Berhalter can play whom he wants against Canada.

    If we draw Canada and then lose to Mexico in the semifinals, I hope Acosta feels bad about it.
     
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  2. largegarlic

    largegarlic Member+

    Jul 2, 2007
    I think we're ahead of Canada on goal difference if Hoppe had started instead of Lewis against Haiti.
     
  3. adam tash

    adam tash Member+

    Jul 12, 2013
    Barcelona, Spain
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Martinique has no business at this level of the sport. its embarrasing. concacaf should just invite another decent team from another region if teams like martinique are allowed in....they cant even qualify for the WC - they arent allowed in.
     
  4. OWN(yewu)ED

    OWN(yewu)ED Member+

    Club: Venezia F.C.
    May 26, 2006
    chico, CA
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Sands, Hoppe, and Dike walked the walk today.

    I had my eye on Miles Robinson, and in a game that was overall much better, he stood out in a bad way. Whats with his passing? I think Sands just breezed by him. Sands also has a valuable versatility card

    Busio came out with wind in his sails, but quite a few mistakes towards the end. Same with Williamson and Bello. They came out with ambition and intent. But the mistakes started to add up towards the end. The biggest plus? Busio's set pieces. That kid strikes the ball so well.

    Dike, Zardes, Hoppe, and Gio all looked real good in their own way. If Dike, Gio, and Hoppe are three of our four WC forwards, I aint mad. They all got a unique good skillset, but man I was impressed as heck with Hoppe and what he was doing off the ball and creating chances. Really creative player. Gio came out gates crashing and could have easily had a hattie of his own. Dike as going to make West Ham, Newcastle, or some other EPL team that plays old school 9 verrrry happy.

    Turner had to make a couple stops today and did well when tested. PK was well taken and he guessed the wrong way, nothing he can do about that

    RIP Acosta at right back for the rest of history
     
  5. ChambersWI

    ChambersWI Member+

    Nov 10, 2010
    Club:
    AC Milan
    Busio was up and down early. I felt that he played like a guy early that knew he was getting publicity and tried to do too much early. HOWEVER he settled down and showed the talent he had.

    Roldan was invisible in the first half as a wing but once he played more centrally he looked more comfortable and had some dangerous passes.

    Hoppe away from Schalke showed some Flair.

    Sands may be the next yank to move to Europe.

    Dike may not be very technical but he is a tank.

    Not impressed with Bello today. Actually think Vines looked a lot better than he did. Of course with the hype Bello got and the hate Vines got the expectations are skewed

    Overall I think you saw the difference playing guys like Williamson, Busio, Dike, Giacchinni (central) and Hoppe made. Sometimes sloppy but a lot more chances.
     
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  6. OWN(yewu)ED

    OWN(yewu)ED Member+

    Club: Venezia F.C.
    May 26, 2006
    chico, CA
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    big fax

    that and the whole, uh.......acosta thing.
     
  7. Ghost

    Ghost Member+

    Sep 5, 2001
    They won to get here. They have six or seven players in second divisions in Italy, France plus an MLSer, of which about four or five are here. There are a lot of worse teams in CONCACAF.
     
  8. JUnionFan

    JUnionFan Member+

    Philadelphia Union
    United States
    Sep 30, 2020
    All in all I wanted to see some young, fresh faces and we did. And overall I liked what I saw. I am glad we got one more data point on a lot of players, some of which had 0 before going into this game.
     
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  9. YNWA Rob

    YNWA Rob Member+

    Liverpool FC
    United States
    Nov 12, 2020
    Indiana
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    #9 YNWA Rob, Jul 16, 2021
    Last edited: Jul 16, 2021
    Was I supposed to post this here?

    So everything here is in the context of Martinique being our easiest opponent.

    We were much more active and purposeful in attack, created more chances, looked more dangerous, etc.

    We defended well enough in the first half, mainly due to the midfield. We had less control in the 2nd half and that put the defense under more pressure. The defense also struggled a bit in playing out of the back in the 2nd half, contributing to what was overall a more raggedy game in the 2nd 45 (like a pickup game I see at the YMCA when I drive home from work).

    Individually I saw three very good and one great performance from our players.

    Busio was very good, showing for the ball consistently and playing quality short and long passes to help transition to attack. Mostly good set pieces as well. He has to be one of the starting three midfielders in the bigger matches here.

    Dike bullied his away around the forward third and showed some decent touches as well. Strong play from him overall, although his timing was a bit off at times.

    Hoppe I thought I added a lot to the attack. Along with his cross for the first goal, he showed some real creativity in the forward third and I think should have gotten a couple of goals but his teammates either got in his way or failed to pick him out. He looked to me like he was carrying a knock from the very beginning, or does he just run in an awkward-looking manner.

    But the player I thought was an absolute standout was James Sands. He was so good at winning the ball, clearing his lines and hitting purposeful passes out of the back. I thought he was a giant for this team tonight, and what a warrior. All those center back depth charts I’ve seen floating around haven’t included him, but maybe they should. Oh, and he’s not going to be playing in MLS very much longer.

    There were some other decent performances. Gioacchini was very lively and I thought deserved a goal on the night. Zardes made a lot of good runs and scored a nice goal. Roldan looked pretty energetic in midfield but lacked a great final ball. Bello added an attacking option on the left and Zimmerman was solid again in the back. Turner did well when called upon.

    Nobody was poor but Williamson had a difficult game I thought. Shaq Moore was pretty quiet on the evening compared to the first game.

    Bring on Canada.
     
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  10. OWN(yewu)ED

    OWN(yewu)ED Member+

    Club: Venezia F.C.
    May 26, 2006
    chico, CA
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I think everyone knows about the existence of Hoppe and Sands on our team now, stars in waiting
     
  11. adam tash

    adam tash Member+

    Jul 12, 2013
    Barcelona, Spain
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    i'd like to see some invite teams from other regions fill out the groups instead of some of these minnows....6-1??? 4-1? 4-0? etc....its just not enough quality to make it fair and interesting. top 12 is enough...then 4 invites would make a lot better tourney, imo...but make it a lot harder to win for us/mex....which is what we all need.
     
  12. nbarbour

    nbarbour Member+

    Jun 19, 2006
    Washington DC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Sands reminds me a bit of Geoff Cameron. Versatile across the back or as a six. Smooth and composed on the ball.
     
  13. mfw13

    mfw13 Member+

    Jul 19, 2003
    Seattle
    Club:
    Newcastle United FC
    Overall, the front line was great, as were the two central defenders. Roldan had a terrific second half. Everyone else was pretty mediocre....the midfield passing was horrendous, nobody was effective winning the ball back once possession was lost, and Martinique had was too much possession on the counter-attack. Busio's corner kicks were laughably bad, with most being overhit or underhit, and rarely finding a US attacker.

    Here are my player ratings:

    Turner: 5/10 - one big save, but looked shaky on a few other plays

    Sands: 7/10 - excellent

    Zimmerman: 7/10 - excellent

    Robinson: 5/10 - nice goal, but struggled defensively and was poor passing out of the back

    Bello: 4/10 - passing and tackling both below average

    Moore: 5/10 - not much impact on the game

    Busio: 4/10 - tackling and ball-winning in midfield was non-existent, service on corners & free kicks was horrendous.....a 3/10 until the late assist.

    Williamson: 4/10 - like Busio, tackling and ball-winning was poor, and passing wasn't great either

    Roldan: 7/10 - two assists, several shots on goal, and got into a lot of dangerous spots running the inside right channel that earned the US corners

    Hoppe: 7/10 - showed his inventiveness and unpredictability

    Dike: 8/10 - the new Jozy Altidore....physical in the box, and finished his chances

    SUBS:

    Acosta: 3/10 - gave away a PK unnecessarily

    Gioacchini: 7/10 - scored and had several other dangerous chances

    Zardes: 7/10 - scored and had several other dangerous chances

    Yueill: 5/10 - why was he on the field when we needed goals?

    Pines: 4/10 - poor defensively in his limited minutes
     
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  14. madvillain

    madvillain Member+

    Aug 28, 2011
    Club:
    Brooklyn Knights
    Striker pool looking a lot better, that's my deep analysis.
     
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  15. Ghost

    Ghost Member+

    Sep 5, 2001
    Hoppe looked like he was a step ahead of the game. Dike did the business. I still think he has a plateau, but it should be fun to figure out where it is. Sands has a lot of potential. We'll see how it goes.

    Bad: Not really that bad. But Roldan obviously isn't of the same quality as Busio, Hoppe, etc. And I thought Turner had a slightly bad game. He was shaky on the long shot in the first half - looked like he slightly misplayed it. On the stretch save, he left the ball slightly on the doorstep. Not enough to be a danger, but I didn't like the direction it bounced. Did nicely on the one on one at the end of the game.
     
  16. nbarbour

    nbarbour Member+

    Jun 19, 2006
    Washington DC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Busio a 4? Wha? He was the engine.
     
  17. papermache16

    papermache16 Member+

    Jan 30, 2009
    Club:
    Liverpool FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Was Hoppe misused in Germany as a forward?
     
  18. madvillain

    madvillain Member+

    Aug 28, 2011
    Club:
    Brooklyn Knights
    Turner looks like a guy we hope never has to start a game that matters. Stay healthy Ethan and Zach.
     
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  19. um_chili

    um_chili Member+

    Jun 3, 2002
    Losanjealous
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    No one was saying this in 2017 when they almost tied us in the group stage. These French state teams often give more established teams a real run for their money. I loved that Guadeloupe got to the semis in 2007 and almost beat Mexico to make the final. We barely beat them, 1-0, in the 2011 group stage.

    Martinique is here because they earned it. If other official FIFA nations are better, then they are free not to lose their qualifying matches to French departements. Martinique has been a credible team at the GC when they've qualified; third in their group with three points in both 2013 and 2017.
     
  20. papermache16

    papermache16 Member+

    Jan 30, 2009
    Club:
    Liverpool FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Yeah, I know he and Williamson were guilty of some bad passes, but it was pleasing to see them recognize space on the turn and transition into the next third of the field. You can see the talent was there, just have to clean up the passes. I give them each a 6 or so out of 10.
     
  21. thedukeofsoccer

    thedukeofsoccer Member+

    Jul 11, 2004
    Wussconsin
    Club:
    AFC Ajax
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    The defense was a lot worse in this one. Turner had way too much to do. I advocated for the 3-man back-line becaause of the personnel, and it was still the best way to deploy them and test out guys, but functionally it creates defensive problems. Prone to being pulled apart when not sitting deep, which the US wasn't much in this game. Those outside cb's get too far wide & your ccb is pretty isolated. Obviously Sands isn't the fleetest of foot, so he can't dominate still in space. In his area he was and is phenomenal.

    Offensively we were far better without true wingers. Dike and Hoppe could just drop back in the gaps and be the playmakers for the runners and wide guys. Occasionally they could just be a hub in the box for the others to feed. Didn't need the most precise ball, especially against Martinique. That is the caveat. But I think there was something to it as a team.

    I think the adjustment to make for Canada and maybe the rest of the way is a 442 diamond. Sands in the hole above the two cb's in Robinson and Zimmerman, who are tighter together. Maybe Lletget as the "creator" (closest we have here), in the hole behind the 2 strikers - probably Dike & Hoppe still.
     
  22. mfw13

    mfw13 Member+

    Jul 19, 2003
    Seattle
    Club:
    Newcastle United FC
    Roldan had a much better game than Busio did.

    Busio was invisible as a mid-field ball winner, and his 14 corner kicks were largely horrendous.

    Whereas Roldan created numerous good chances in the 2nd half, almost scored himself, and earned many of the corner kicks with his runs down the inside right channel that Busio then wasted.

    Busio has much more potential than Roldan given his age and skills. But he didn't show it tonight.
     
  23. gtrower

    gtrower Member

    Jul 14, 2014
    Club:
    DC United
    Agreed. Busio/Williamson too low. Robinson too high. The formers a 4 while the latter a 5 makes me think we weren’t watching the same game.

    I’d go 7/7/4.
     
  24. CU soccer

    CU soccer Member

    Mar 28, 2005
    Panama City Beach
    Club:
    Los Angeles Galaxy
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Thumbs up: Hoppe, Sands, Dike

    Thumbs down: Bello, Acosta, Roldan

    Thumbs neutral: Everyone else
     
  25. nbarbour

    nbarbour Member+

    Jun 19, 2006
    Washington DC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Yes, I failed to mention Williamson as well. I’ll take aggression and progressive passing with a few turnovers all day long over passivity that bogs down the attack (as long as the turnovers aren’t in awful spots).
     
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