US-Jamaica, the midfield

Discussion in 'USA Men: News & Analysis' started by superdave, Oct 7, 2021.

  1. a_new_fan

    a_new_fan Member+

    Jul 6, 2006
    anyone who thinks musah and mckennie are the same player or similar skill sets is crazy they literally couldn't be more different.
     
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  2. a_new_fan

    a_new_fan Member+

    Jul 6, 2006
    the best way to sum up the midfield today is that lletget had a really bad match...and he didnt play.

    so did roldan
     
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  3. The Clientele

    The Clientele Member+

    Portland Timbers
    Jun 25, 2005
    Portland, Oregon
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Having Musah out there is a game changer.
     
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  4. The Clientele

    The Clientele Member+

    Portland Timbers
    Jun 25, 2005
    Portland, Oregon
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Musah is more skilled than McKennie. He also might be a better all around soccer athlete.
     
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  5. Eliezar

    Eliezar Member+

    Jan 27, 2002
    Houston
    Club:
    12 de Octubre
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    He also lost two 50/50s today that shouldn’t been 50/50s because he went in weak whereas McKennie doesn’t lose those.

    Played well though.
     
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  6. Percussion

    Percussion New Member

    United States
    Oct 8, 2021
    So A, B, or C.. who you got?

    A-
    ----------------------------Ricardo Pepi
    ---Christian Pulisic--------------------Brenden Aaronson
    ---------------------------Gio Reyna
    ---------Weston McKennie-------Tyler Adams
    Antonee Robinson----------------------------Sergino Dest
    ------------Chris Richards-------Miles Robinson

    B-
    ----------------------------Ricardo Pepi
    ---Christian Pulisic---------------------Gio Reyna
    ---------------------------Yunus Musah
    ---------Weston McKennie---------Tyler Adams
    Antonee Robinson-----------------------------Sergino Dest
    ------------Chris Richards---------Miles Robinson

    C-
    ----------------------------Ricardo Pepi
    ---Christian Pulisic--------------------Brenden Aaronson
    ---------------------------Gio Reyna
    -------------Yunus Musah---------Tyler Adams
    Antonee Robinson----------------------------Sergino Dest
    ------------Chris Richards----------Miles Robinson
     
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  7. rgli13

    rgli13 Member+

    Mar 23, 2005
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    d.

    pulisic__________weah
    __reyna___mckennie__
    _______adams_______

    i think of it as musah for reyna being a secondary look/tactic and aaronson as primarily a bench option/rotational starter.

    acosta is locked in as the "backup" 6 and im about two matches of heavy minutes from taking ldlt over lletget as the 6th cm on a standard 23 man roster.
     
  8. frankburgers

    frankburgers Member+

    May 31, 2016
    The best midfield moving forward is Adams Musah reyna.

    It has everything you need from your midfield.
     
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  9. a_new_fan

    a_new_fan Member+

    Jul 6, 2006
    you are the winner

    the first thing I noticed last night is the simplest thing. mckennie could've been lletget and it wouldn't have changed the match at all. when a team is playing a low block he is useless.
     
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  10. frankburgers

    frankburgers Member+

    May 31, 2016
    Useless is a bit much lol

    but yea, he has clear weaknesses in possession if asked to help create.
     
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  11. adam tash

    adam tash Member+

    Jul 12, 2013
    Barcelona, Spain
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    thats what i was saying in terms of mckennie and musah being redundant.

    they arent the same player but

    playing them together in the same midfield is redundant.

    i think mckennie was told to play the lletget role.

    its the role itself that is the problem...zero benefit from having 1 mid be a "circulator"/backpasser like mckennie was last night.

    1 dmid = adams
    1 combo mid = musah
    1 amid - reyna

    if you really need a goal take off the dmid and play 2 amids.
     
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  12. Maximum Optimal

    Maximum Optimal Member+

    Jul 10, 2001
    I'd like to see this one too. There will be a time when McKennie is out due to injury or cards. Or maybe rest him one game during a 3-game window. But we need to try the RMA midfield.
     
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  13. Maximum Optimal

    Maximum Optimal Member+

    Jul 10, 2001
    That's how Dortmund operates, with Bellingham the combo mid.
     
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  14. gogorath

    gogorath Member+

    None
    United States
    May 12, 2019
    #39 gogorath, Oct 8, 2021
    Last edited: Oct 8, 2021


    I really like Musah, but the midfield from Jamaica was the weak point of their lineup, with a 38 year old playing in Jamaica and a dude playing in USL (the other is in Belgium at a Chris Durkin-level club).

    This is not to criticize Musah ... but maybe, before we bench a took who systematically tore apart Mexico, we should see more than a game or so?

    I don't really do Best XIs anymore -- I think they differ by opponent and gameplan. But don't you think this is a bit reactionary?
     
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  15. gogorath

    gogorath Member+

    None
    United States
    May 12, 2019
    He's not at all.

    He was played further back last night, and I'm pretty sure he was gameplanned that way to help defend behind the fullbacks who played very, very high.

    McKennie's heading ability and runs into the box have actually been one of our more effective plays against a low block. Considering how hard it is to score against a well organized defense, having someone who is excellent on either set pieces or run of play in the air is a huge asset.

    I thought Weston played to the needs of the game very well last night. He was the essentially the fourth most defensive player according to the schema, and he was on Dest's side, and we didn't see much exposure there at all.
     
  16. frankburgers

    frankburgers Member+

    May 31, 2016
    No.
     
  17. thedukeofsoccer

    thedukeofsoccer Member+

    Jul 11, 2004
    Wussconsin
    Club:
    AFC Ajax
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I think that midfield is going to work a lot better against the better teams, to have some game control, and efficient counter.

    But when teams are organized, like Canada was (w/ different personnel), Jamaica in the first half after the very start, and they were at Wales, so many attacks will go to die in the final 3rd. Not enough patience & problem-solving.

    And even as far as the tougher games go, we don't know how Musah will travel in CCAF. We haven't found out if he's up for that fight, yet. If so, all systems go for most roadies.

    But at home, outside of v. Mexico, we need a 3rd man with more answers to the questions defenses typically pose. That's especially true in several days v. Costa Rica, kings of the nil-nil.

    In which case, Wes should be the one that gets sacrificed, & when healthy Gio the one who replaces him, then Ledezma would be the next up if he recovers well. But in the interim that option is Lletget, who'll benefit from Musah's ball progression.
     
  18. a_new_fan

    a_new_fan Member+

    Jul 6, 2006
    none of that is actually what happened. Mckennie was the furthest upfield of the midfielders literally the entire first half and he also didnt play exclusively on dest's side the midfield isn't structured that way at all.

    He did play to the needs of the game as it progressed early he tried to get into tight spaces and both make and rec passes but that doesn't play to his strengths at all. Once he got out of the way in the second half things opened up a lot and musah got more room to operate on both sides.
     
  19. a_new_fan

    a_new_fan Member+

    Jul 6, 2006
    maybe you dont know what the word reduntant means?

    they are very different players its tough to watch that match and see again how different their skill sets are and how they were used and think they were reduntant. I never thought for a second that they were the same player or doing the same role.
     
  20. superdave

    superdave Member+

    Jul 14, 1999
    VB, VA
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    You kinda sorta are right. (Useless is too strong.) But McKennie is pretty great on set pieces. So he should sub in for probably Adams if it's the 65th minute and we need a goal.
     
  21. a_new_fan

    a_new_fan Member+

    Jul 6, 2006
    Set pieces don't matter, if ur facing a low block having a guy on the pitch whose weakness is a soccer ball being anywhere where he can't head it.
     
  22. adam tash

    adam tash Member+

    Jul 12, 2013
    Barcelona, Spain
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    call it redundant call it what you want....there just needs to be more offensive firepower in midfield....adams and mckennie and 1 other player puts a lot of responsibility on the 3rd mid to be creative.
     
  23. Marko72

    Marko72 Member+

    Aug 30, 2005
    New York
    LDLT is one of those guys, if not a truly stellar example, but he can ball. I don't know if he's up for a dogfight, though. He's been very good whenever he's been brought on into a situation that affords him space. Some games when teams are really parking the bus, I suspect that he'll be able to thread in a lot of nicely-weighted passes that create opportunities. But I'm not sure that I trust him when the midfield's being really contested. I see him more as a 2nd half guy in the right situation.
     
  24. Scotty

    Scotty Member+

    Dec 15, 1999
    Toscana
    Does anyone know if there is an all-touches video for Luca de la Torre from last night's game?
     
  25. thedukeofsoccer

    thedukeofsoccer Member+

    Jul 11, 2004
    Wussconsin
    Club:
    AFC Ajax
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    He can ball in some ways, but as far as unlocking a d, there's not real evidence of that. He has 1 goal & 2 assists in 3,000 career minutes in a pretty offensive, second tier league. So there's no real evidence of that.

    As far as being up for the dogfight, we've seen that he'll try. But I don't know if he's going to win many 50-50's in the middle w/ that body type. He has a winger's body.

    It's true about the sample being skewed for him though. The level of comp has been lackluster and he's coming in during situations where the game is open from tired legs and the opponent going for it. Fast-break fb. He doesn't have to battle as much (still got little brother'd at times last night) and can dribble into that space. The final ball is still off for the most part. I liked him more during the friendlies. And we have to ask what translates as a starter against better opponents.
     
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