It is wrong like swearing is wrong in my book. That does not mean you should lose fans because of it when there are worse things done and said at games. Or lose a World Cup bid.
Society moves on what is offensive and what isn't and the things you bring up don't have tangible real world consequences. Groups of people don't get discriminated against, or harmed because someone drops F bombs every other word or says God in a colorful context. On the other hand, sexist, racist, and homophobic statements absolutely do have real world consequences.
You must live in an alternate world I live in. Discrimination happens in many various forms. Tangible or intangible. I do not know of any LGBT Groups of people harmed at a soccer match because some drunk idiot Mexicans yelled something. It is a bit of a leap in logic to say that one set of swears have real world consequences but others from another side of the political spectrum or paradigm do not. I find it funny actually.
You must not know or belong to any LGBT groups of people then. The normalization of homophobic terms is directly related to the discrimination of those groups in society at large.
That is leftist mumbo jumbo you are typing that means absolutely nothing to me in the real world. When applied to a soccer match (which is the context) what those fans say during a goal kick does not physically hurt people. It just hurts their feelings or it makes them angry that they are allowed to say it.
There's nothing leftist about recognizing that normalizing the usage of racist, homophobic, sexist or ablest language translates into increased usage in every day life. Which in turn harms the groups said language is belittling.
Yes there is. That is the whole point. The other side of the political spectrum does not believe that words harm people. There's no statistical data on earth that proves that stopping people from saying something at a soccer match is going to lower crime against a certain group. All of that is just ideology being spewed.
No statistical data? How about the statistical data that over the last 4 years the normalization of these very things by certain people in positions of power has translated into the highest level of hate crimes across the board in more than a decade? If you normalize such bull crap during soccer games among everything else it all adds up to normalizing it in society, which does translate into real world harm. The other side may not think words hurt people, but they don't really have the best grasp of language anyway or an understanding of how it can be used.
Over the last 4 years globally ? People in positions of power in this world have done many atrocities in all walks of life and on both sides of the spectrum. That has nothing to do with FIFA and their rules and how they should apply them to a soccer match or whether or not a Country should host something. We obviously have different world views and I do not see it as normalizing anything I see it as moronic Mexican fans doing moronic things. The main issue to me within my world view is that if you tell people what you can say and what you cannot say at a match and only pick and choose based more on one side of the political spectrum you are setting yourself up for catastrophe. Hypocrisy galore as well. I do not think people should be so fascist and say you will not have fans or host something because of a leftist agenda.
Problem is, this isn't a political agenda thing. It's a human dignity thing. And one FIFA has tried to be pretty consistent about disallowing in their venues. They don't condone racist language and have and will continue to punish teams and countries for violations of. Why should homophobic language be treated any different?
I would not have much of a problem with sanctioning a Federation if maybe the keeper taking a kick was a homosexual and the fans were individually trying to incite violence against him. That to me is more of a logical point to argue. What is happening here is not a human dignity case. It is FIFA grandstanding and punishing a Federation for what a certain sector of fans are yelling at a player who in most cases does not even know what is being said within those stands towards him.
Okay.. I think we've reached the end of this discussion in this thread. If you wish, there are various threads such discussion can occur in the P&CE forum.
For us non CONCACAF types, are you referring to a particular word the Mexicans tend to shout when a goal kick is taken or something else?
Thank you. And apologies to moderator Yoshou, I posted my question when still reading page 25 and didn't see your warning to cease the discussion as it was on the next page. I did not mean to infringe the forum rules.
This is true. However, if for some reason Mexico does not host matches I think it is appropriate to come back to this discussion in the future. As of now it is just a rumor so maybe we should just focus on other news.
Then why not just suspend Mexico similarly to what FIFA did in 1990? I definitely would suspend Mexico from qualification for 2022 for Qatar and replace them with another country for Octagonal I'm just saying if it is me that is what I would do
That suspension had to do with on-the-pitch shenanigans as the Mexican Federation knowingly fielded overage players during the 1988 CONCACAF U-20 tournament. They outright cheated to win a youth tournament and the two year suspension imposed by FIFA was on all of Mexico's (mens) national teams. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cachirules As offensive as some fans may regard the shouts from Mexican supporters I'm not sure that equates to cheating on the pitch.
Here is an NBC Sports opinion piece about venues: https://soccer.nbcsports.com/2021/07/18/2026-world-cup-ranking-usa-host-cities-stadiums/
I definitely think USA will get 18 venues and Canada will only get 2 and Mexico will still have 3 unless Canada somehow gets a 3rd venue again to replace Montreal
Arguably the two crappiest stadiums are ranked 1 and 2. I know more probably went into their ranking than the features and overall quality of the stadium itself, but still.... 18 seems a bit excessive and unnecessary. Especially if Mexico only has 3.
it seems 11 or 12 is the number for US. There are 18 stadiums in 17 cities in the running, doubtful all 18 get chosen.
I wanted to bump this back to the first page so thought this opinion piece on stadium contenders can do the trick: https://www.foxsports.com/stories/soccer/2026-world-cup-us-host-cities-contenders-doug-mcintyre
That's the second article I've seen this week - after one on MLSSoccer IIRC - implying that Montreal's withdrawal would lead to an 11th US venue rather than a replacement Canadian one. Has there been any official or quasi-official rumbling that this will happen? To be fair, when asked (multiple times now) about Vancouver possibly getting back in the picture, Montagliani's limited himself to just responding that the door isn't entirely closed...