Ukraine vs Russia III

Discussion in 'Politics & Current Events' started by argentine soccer fan, May 16, 2023.

  1. Brilliant Oranje

    Ajax
    Netherlands
    Mar 4, 2023
    Amsterdam and Marbella
    Nat'l Team:
    Netherlands
    Zelensky seems to be okay with giving up some land if Ukraine is allowed to join NATO

    https://news.sky.com/story/zelensky...oesnt-immediately-return-seized-land-13263085

    Zelenskyy suggests 'hot phase' of Ukraine war could end in return for NATO membership if offered - even if seized land isn't returned immediately

    Volodymyr Zelenskyy has suggested a ceasefire deal could be struck if Ukrainian territory he controls could be taken "under the NATO umbrella" - allowing him to negotiate the return of the rest later "in a diplomatic way".

    In an interview with Sky News's chief correspondent Stuart Ramsay, the Ukrainian president was asked to respond to media reports saying one of US president-elect Donald Trump's plans to end the war might be for Kyiv to cede the land Moscow has taken to Russia in exchange for Ukraine joining NATO.

    Mr Zelenskyy said NATO membership would have to be offered to unoccupied parts of the country in order to end the "hot phase of the war", as long as the NATO invitation itself recognises Ukraine's internationally recognised borders.

    He appeared to accept occupied eastern parts of the country would fall outside of such a deal for the time being.
     
  2. Cascarino's Pizzeria

    Apr 29, 2001
    New Jersey, USA
    Good times for Putey

     
  3. goliath74

    goliath74 Member

    May 24, 2006
    Hollywood, FL, United States
    Club:
    FC Dynamo Kyiv
    Nat'l Team:
    Ukraine
    Moscovia was never a part of Rus. It was a colony of Rus but Moscow held the seat of Mongol-Tatar daruga (local ruler) and Moscow princes were no more than military protection for the said daruga.
     
  4. goliath74

    goliath74 Member

    May 24, 2006
    Hollywood, FL, United States
    Club:
    FC Dynamo Kyiv
    Nat'l Team:
    Ukraine
    Giving up some land TEMPORARILY.
     
  5. The Irish Rover

    The Irish Rover Member+

    Aug 1, 2010
    Dublin
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Ireland Republic
    Not even giving it up, temporarily or otherwise. Just not fighting for it for the time being.

    In any case the plan is moot. Putin invaded Ukraine back in 2014 over Ukraine agreeing a lousy trade agreement with the EU.

    Nato troops on Ukraininan soil makes the bulk of Ukraine a Nato protectorate. It's a complete defeat and Putin doesn't do defeats
     
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  6. rslfanboy

    rslfanboy Member+

    Jul 24, 2007
    Section 26
    I know it isn't directly related, but this Syria/Aleppo insurgency is really something!

    God, if only the Dems could have carried this one election! Russia and Iran are both really up against it and unable to continue their rat********ery at the scale they aspire. It doesn't seem like Syria and Assad will be toppled anytime soon, but diminishing power of strongmen is a good thing.
     
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  7. The Irish Rover

    The Irish Rover Member+

    Aug 1, 2010
    Dublin
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Ireland Republic
     
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  8. The Irish Rover

    The Irish Rover Member+

    Aug 1, 2010
    Dublin
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Ireland Republic
     
  9. spejic

    spejic Cautionary example

    Mar 1, 1999
    San Rafael, CA
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    I also didn't think a whole lot of it at first because Aleppo (or at least the area around it) has changed hands many times already, and thanks to Russia Aleppo isn't Aleppo any more. But Russian Telegram seems to be very pessimistic. From what they say this seems similar to what happened to the US in Afghanistan - spending a lot of blood and money to fight for a country that doesn't actually exist. Outside of a couple elite units there really isn't a Syrian army of any worth. They don't think the country will last.
     
  10. The Jitty Slitter

    The Jitty Slitter Moderator
    Staff Member

    Bayern München
    Germany
    Jul 23, 2004
    Fascist Hellscape
    Club:
    FC Sankt Pauli
    Nat'l Team:
    Belgium
    The former head of MI6 Sir Richard Dearlove says Europe is no longer in a pre-war situation with Russia, but an actual war.

    "I don't think there's any point in beating about the bush," Europe & the US are in a "very dangerous situation." "We are in an extraordinary situation historically."

    https://bsky.app/profile/youranoncentral.bsky.social/post/3lc2qw4c4ic2l
     
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  11. Cascarino's Pizzeria

    Apr 29, 2001
    New Jersey, USA
    "Hey Vlad - am I still trippin balls? Looks like we're in a cold, wet bunker at the Ukrainian border"

     
  12. spejic

    spejic Cautionary example

    Mar 1, 1999
    San Rafael, CA
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    I'm rather surprised this happened - this is in Moscow. Got to be some rich / connected people among those snapped up. From some research, Denis Simachev is constantly rated among the top 5 nightclubs in Russia and is for the high-end set of fashionistas and the intelligencia. Mutabor/Arma is a warehouse type setup for the young crowd. Mono is well known as a gay bar, and has been closed down before.
     
  13. The Irish Rover

    The Irish Rover Member+

    Aug 1, 2010
    Dublin
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Ireland Republic
    It's about Putin's manpower shortages.

    Conscripting the healthy sons of Muscovites is bad news for stability in the furstenstadt but sweeping up the fags is fair game.

    Can't imagine it'll take too long to for the frontline troops to work out why Muscovites are suddenly showing up in their units, or for the dedovshchina to start. Usually translated as hazing, it's of an order of magnitude far beyond what Western armies would ever tolerate.

    Like the rest of the Russian newbies, they'll be dead within weeks. Unlike them, most will die without reaching the rear areas, never mind the frontline
     
  14. gatotkaca3

    gatotkaca3 Member

    Oct 23, 2010
    Club:
    Newcastle United FC
    Is that twitter poster a reliable source? There are still millions of military-age men that can be force-conscripted from many western russian cities. Why go straight for Moscow?
     
  15. spejic

    spejic Cautionary example

    Mar 1, 1999
    San Rafael, CA
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    News sites think it's more about the recent Russian push towards "family values". They have outlawed anyone speaking against having a family, which includes speaking in favor of being single, speaking in favor of gays, or talking about contraceptives.

    Getting more people for the front is a nice bonus, of course.
     
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  16. The Irish Rover

    The Irish Rover Member+

    Aug 1, 2010
    Dublin
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Ireland Republic
    He's completely worthless, but those reports are all over - DW, BBC, Al Jazeera, etc.

    Even with the jaw-dropping financial inducements, enlistment rates are nowhere near enough but another mobilization could be destabilizing and the labour market is creaking: 400k military industry workers are needed but aren't there, police stations are 20% undermanned on average and sometimes over 30%, etc.

    The impoverished provinces are all tapped out and the west-of-the-Urals cities are the crown jewels of the empire. Lose Ekatarinberg to insurrection and you crush it. Lose Moscow, St. Petersburg or Rostov and you lose Russia completely. That's why he's got 10k+ North Koreans and sizeable numbers of Yemeni slaves/human trafficking victims on the front lines.

    Russia is intensely homophobic so raiding gay clubs for "meat" can be sold as a form of "social cleansing", ridding the healthy body of the Rossiski narod from contaminants while giving Vladimir Vladimirovich Lilliputain some bodies to throw into "combat".

    I mean, if they're willing to put this guy on the frontline, they're truly desperate
     
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  17. spejic

    spejic Cautionary example

    Mar 1, 1999
    San Rafael, CA
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    It's not easy to figure out enlistment numbers (and Russia isn't likely to tell us), but this person came up with an estimate of around 700 per day, going by value of signing bonuses Russia is paying out as of last summer.

    https://bsky.app/profile/jakluge.de/post/3lc5zejpmus2u

    This is down from earlier, and is taking place at the same time as an uptick in casualties. When before they were signing up enough Russians to make up for losses, they are now roughly half that, likely worse.
     
  18. spejic

    spejic Cautionary example

    Mar 1, 1999
    San Rafael, CA
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    According to Reuters, Russia is doubling down on defending Assad, and will be sending new shipments of weapons in the next few days.

    Which makes them the second army that Russia is equipping, as the rebels have captured quite a collection of arms from the abandoned bases.
     
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  19. The Irish Rover

    The Irish Rover Member+

    Aug 1, 2010
    Dublin
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Ireland Republic
    If they do send weapons to Syria, it won't do any good.

    Assad had and has plenty of weapons. He needs officers with a clue and soldiers willing to fight.

    This is one captured base. That there have been dozens of others is an understatement.
     
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  20. Brilliant Oranje

    Ajax
    Netherlands
    Mar 4, 2023
    Amsterdam and Marbella
    Nat'l Team:
    Netherlands
  21. argentine soccer fan

    Staff Member

    Jan 18, 2001
    San Francisco Bay Area
    Club:
    CA Boca Juniors
    Nat'l Team:
    Argentina
    Give them Chernobyl.
     
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  22. deejay

    deejay Member+

    Feb 14, 2000
    Tarpon Springs, FL
    Club:
    Jorge Wilstermann
    Nat'l Team:
    Bolivia
    According to what I am reading, Putin has no choice but to support Syria since the give them the only warm water ports with direct access to the Mediterranean Sea. Black Sea ports are no good because Turkey controls the straits.
     
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  23. Cascarino's Pizzeria

    Apr 29, 2001
    New Jersey, USA
    In Russian puppet news, rebels are going through Assad's home

     
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  24. Cascarino's Pizzeria

    Apr 29, 2001
    New Jersey, USA
    Sergey's got a gun
    Sergey's got a gun
    His dog day's just begun
    Now off to war to have some fun

     
  25. The Jitty Slitter

    The Jitty Slitter Moderator
    Staff Member

    Bayern München
    Germany
    Jul 23, 2004
    Fascist Hellscape
    Club:
    FC Sankt Pauli
    Nat'l Team:
    Belgium
    Guys as a suggestion/request - Twitter embeds are totally broken on site (and around the interwebz). Also many more of us now left.

    So can i suggest posting a screen shot or pasting the content?

    Otherwise all i get on my phone especially is endless

    1863511285679501615 is not a valid tweet id
     
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