Ukraine vs Russia III

Discussion in 'Politics & Current Events' started by argentine soccer fan, May 16, 2023.

  1. Yoshou

    Yoshou Fan of the CCL Champ

    May 12, 2009
    Seattle
    Club:
    Seattle Sounders
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    The fire at Proletarsk has been pretty much put out after 13 days. There was still smoke rising from the tanks in the latest satellite imagery, but we now have a clear view of the damage done. Somewhere between 20 and 30 of the tanks have been damaged in the fire. The degree of damage is not clear.

     
  2. Yoshou

    Yoshou Fan of the CCL Champ

    May 12, 2009
    Seattle
    Club:
    Seattle Sounders
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    It looks like Xi has ordered Chinese banks to at least partially stop doing business with Russia. I’m not clear on exactky what is covered, but large enough that Russian companies were going through UAE banks to purchase from Chinese companies. That UAE pipeline has been shutdown as well, so having Chinese banks rejecting 80% of payments from Russian companies is huge.

    https://www.yahoo.com/news/chinese-banks-stopping-transactions-russia-070338354.html
     
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  3. Paul Berry

    Paul Berry Member+

    Notts County and NYCFC
    United States
    Apr 18, 2015
    Nr Kingston NY
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Not sure if it's anything to do with Xi or just based on commercial decisions.
     
  4. Yoshou

    Yoshou Fan of the CCL Champ

    May 12, 2009
    Seattle
    Club:
    Seattle Sounders
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Nothing like this happens in China without Xi signing off on it.
     
  5. spejic

    spejic Cautionary example

    Mar 1, 1999
    San Rafael, CA
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Reportedly Russia is now shipping physical gold to Hong Kong where it is sold and deposited in local banks in order to fund transactions. This is really slow and expensive, of course.
     
  6. Paul Berry

    Paul Berry Member+

    Notts County and NYCFC
    United States
    Apr 18, 2015
    Nr Kingston NY
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I think the banks would make the same decision on purely commercial grounds.
     
  7. Yoshou

    Yoshou Fan of the CCL Champ

    May 12, 2009
    Seattle
    Club:
    Seattle Sounders
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Chinese banks are not private entities.
     
  8. Paul Berry

    Paul Berry Member+

    Notts County and NYCFC
    United States
    Apr 18, 2015
    Nr Kingston NY
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Correct. Several large banks are government or partially government owned. Well done.
     
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  9. Yoshou

    Yoshou Fan of the CCL Champ

    May 12, 2009
    Seattle
    Club:
    Seattle Sounders
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    It’s not several, the decision to reject Russian payments is not market driven, and nothing of this scale happens without Xi signing off on it personally. One of the reasons China has gotten into the predicament it is currently in is because Xi has a habit of literally killing the messenger and purging anyone that shows initiative. It has gotten so bad that they don’t tell Xi when something bad happens and they definitely don’t make decisions that could have an impact on the Chinese economy.
     
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  10. The Irish Rover

    The Irish Rover Member+

    Aug 1, 2010
    Dublin
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Ireland Republic
    You can't keep something like that a secret, even in Russia and Ukraine isn't Russia.

    It doesn't want to be either. That's what the war is about
     
  11. Paul Berry

    Paul Berry Member+

    Notts County and NYCFC
    United States
    Apr 18, 2015
    Nr Kingston NY
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Not lending money to Russia that will never be repaid is good for the banks and therefore the economy. It's a good commercial decision, whether or not it's sanctioned by leadership.

    Suggesting it's ordered by Xi is a major assumption. I think it's more likely the government would be leaning in the opposite direction but we're less than a decade from the real estate crash which put huge pressure on the economy.
     
  12. The Irish Rover

    The Irish Rover Member+

    Aug 1, 2010
    Dublin
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Ireland Republic
    If Xi had any problems with China's banks systematically severing links with Russia, any problems at all, he'd have ordered the setting up of state-sponsored - maybe even state-guaranteed - workarounds. Maybe even let that be made public.

    He hasn't and given the way Xi's China operates, that can only mean "trade with America and the West is the absolute priority. Act accordingly".
     
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  13. Paul Berry

    Paul Berry Member+

    Notts County and NYCFC
    United States
    Apr 18, 2015
    Nr Kingston NY
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I agree. I disagree with the idea that Xi ordered the banks to stop lending to Russia.
     
  14. Yoshou

    Yoshou Fan of the CCL Champ

    May 12, 2009
    Seattle
    Club:
    Seattle Sounders
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Yes.. In a government managed economy, it is inconceivable that the person that, quite literally, makes and/or approves the decisions of this scale. Lol.
     
  15. American Brummie

    Jun 19, 2009
    There Be Dragons Here
    Club:
    Birmingham City FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I don't have a dog in this fight.

    https://fairbank.fas.harvard.edu/news/how-the-party-is-increasing-control-of-chinas-banks/

    But it is weird how the facts do cleanly line up with @Yoshou.

    Anyway, carry on
     
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  16. Yoshou

    Yoshou Fan of the CCL Champ

    May 12, 2009
    Seattle
    Club:
    Seattle Sounders
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Anywho… back to the Ukraine War… something is going on with Russia’s vehicles and artillery. Despite the number of attacks increasing in the last few months, the number of tanks, apcs, and artillery losses is down. Also, people that track such things are noting that the smaller equipment storage locations are now empty, or the only equipment left are in such bad shape they are only good for scavenging parts off of, or scrap.

    1829867459299651678 is not a valid tweet id


    How are Russians able to advance so much in the Donbas area? Drones, meat assaults, and issues with Ukrainian defenses.
     
  17. Paul Berry

    Paul Berry Member+

    Notts County and NYCFC
    United States
    Apr 18, 2015
    Nr Kingston NY
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Correct.

    Xi signs off every overdraft for China's six biggest banks as well as running the country. He's a very busy man.

    Pulling out of Russia is a good commercial decision for the banks.

    The banks will have made this decision. The government will have approved.

    Obviously if Xi and the government didn't approve it, it wouldn't happen.

    But it's probably not a case of Xi picking up the phone and telling the banks to pull out. It's the banks making a proposal which is best for them and best for the country, then getting political approval.
     
  18. Yoshou

    Yoshou Fan of the CCL Champ

    May 12, 2009
    Seattle
    Club:
    Seattle Sounders
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Just keep digging. You’ll get there!

    I’ll give you a hint. Stop applying normal capitalist rules to China.
     
  19. The Irish Rover

    The Irish Rover Member+

    Aug 1, 2010
    Dublin
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Ireland Republic
    In a Western country, a political figure/top businessman is exposed for corruption/criminality, then loses his power and is arrested.

    In a communist/bolshevik country, a political figure/top businessman loses his power, is exposed for corruption/criminality power and is arrested.
     
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  20. rslfanboy

    rslfanboy Member+

    Jul 24, 2007
    Section 26
    Your Yakov Smirnoff impression needs work.
     
  21. spejic

    spejic Cautionary example

    Mar 1, 1999
    San Rafael, CA
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
  22. spejic

    spejic Cautionary example

    Mar 1, 1999
    San Rafael, CA
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Two power stations in the Moscow area (Kashisrkiy power station and Konakovo power station) have been attacked by Ukrainian drones. They were hit and there is fire, don't know how bad.
     
  23. Paul Berry

    Paul Berry Member+

    Notts County and NYCFC
    United States
    Apr 18, 2015
    Nr Kingston NY
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    #9548 Paul Berry, Sep 1, 2024
    Last edited: Sep 1, 2024
    I normally like your posts but stop being a condescending shit. You're better than this.
     
  24. spejic

    spejic Cautionary example

    Mar 1, 1999
    San Rafael, CA
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    This attack also included attacks on the Konakovo gas distribution station and the Moscow oil refinery. Russia claims to have shot down 158 drones that night.

    I wonder when Putin invaded if he thought that in a few years Russia would be celebrating shooting down 158 drones launched from Ukraine. Probably not.
     
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  25. Yoshou

    Yoshou Fan of the CCL Champ

    May 12, 2009
    Seattle
    Club:
    Seattle Sounders
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Considering the number of targets that got hit, it seems like Russia used buildings to shoot down some of those drones…

    One of the comments I saw is that it seemed like Ukraine exhausted the Russia’s supply of missiles last night. Not permanently, just the supply they had on hand. Question is, how many of missiles does Russia have and can Ukraine exhaust them?
     

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