Ukraine vs Russia III

Discussion in 'Politics & Current Events' started by argentine soccer fan, May 16, 2023.

  1. The Irish Rover

    The Irish Rover Member+

    Aug 1, 2010
    Dublin
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Ireland Republic
    That's the problem with "clear red lines" as opposed to "strategic ambiguity": the clear red lines strategy lets them know what won't attract reprisals, the strategic ambiguity strategy leaves it, well, ambiguous.

    Put it another way, the first is FA but the second is FAFO
     
  2. The Irish Rover

    The Irish Rover Member+

    Aug 1, 2010
    Dublin
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Ireland Republic
    #7827 The Irish Rover, Apr 18, 2024
    Last edited: Apr 18, 2024
    Was listening to Mriya Report just now.

    Their guest stated that retiring GOP congressman Mike Gallagher is postponing his resignation until at least Saturday so that he can vote to ensure new package passes.
     
  3. The Irish Rover

    The Irish Rover Member+

    Aug 1, 2010
    Dublin
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Ireland Republic
    From Phillips P. O'Brien, who's very optimistic about things on the Hill turning out all right in the end

    Being an O'Brien, he's Irish so if he's optimistic, @The Jitty Slitter can relax ;)
     
  4. Yoshou

    Yoshou Fan of the CCL Champ

    May 12, 2009
    Seattle
    Club:
    Seattle Sounders
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Has anyone seen a comparison between the Senate bill and the House Bills? The topline for the Ukraine bill seems about the same, but the topline for Israel is much larger.

    I’m on vacation this week, so haven’t been paying much attention.
     
    The Jitty Slitter repped this.
  5. spejic

    spejic Cautionary example

    Mar 1, 1999
    San Rafael, CA
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    A Russian Tu-22M3 bomber flying over Stavropol krai caught on fire and went into a flat spin before crashing. Likely to be friendly fire, given the location and the nature of the damage. But Ukraine is claiming it, so who knows.
     
  6. spejic

    spejic Cautionary example

    Mar 1, 1999
    San Rafael, CA
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Russian gasoline productions has shot back up as refineries are being repaired. This would be an excellent time to hit them again. Few things are as deflating as seeing something you just fixed get broken again.
     
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  7. The Jitty Slitter

    The Jitty Slitter Moderator
    Staff Member

    Bayern München
    Germany
    Jul 23, 2004
    Fascist Hellscape
    Club:
    FC Sankt Pauli
    Nat'l Team:
    Belgium
    Yes. And also, it's structured more like a loan obligation that can't be written off before the election.

    Plus of course, depending on what vote rule is in place, the bill might be linked to the other ones which makes this all more complicated
     
  8. The Jitty Slitter

    The Jitty Slitter Moderator
    Staff Member

    Bayern München
    Germany
    Jul 23, 2004
    Fascist Hellscape
    Club:
    FC Sankt Pauli
    Nat'l Team:
    Belgium
    So big news and it's positive!

    My understanding listening to some coverage in the last 12 hours is that it's complicated but there is a good chance. On the plus side, MAGA Mike is apparently prepared to let this go to the floor, and a good part of his caucus want it.

    On the negative side, he made it more complicated by hitching it to the other bills, and it was not clear whether this would be a standalone vote, or on all 4 - that depends on what rules come out of committee.

    As usual if this gets a vote it would pass because most of the dem caucus have said they will back it.

    The problem is getting it out of the rules committee - but it seems just in the last hours it made it out of rules!

    The House Rules Committee late Thursday night advanced a package of foreign aid bills — but only with help from Democrats who, in a rare move, supported the procedural vote amid opposition from a trio of hardline Republicans.

    The panel voted 9-3 to adopt the rule, which governs debate for the legislation, with Reps. Thomas Massie (R-Ky.), Chip Roy (R-Texas) and Ralph Norman (R-S.C.) opposing the effort.

    The successful vote allows the full House to vote on the rule and open debate on three foreign aid bills — sending assistance to Israel, Ukraine and allies in the Indo-Pacific — plus a fourth that includes other national security priorities, such as a TikTok ban.

    Rule votes — in committee and on the floor — are typically mundane, party-line occurrences, with the members from the majority party backing the rule and lawmakers in the minority party voting against it. But with conservatives voting against the rule out of opposition to Ukraine aid and the exclusion of border security measures, Democrats crossed the aisle to back the procedural vote.
     
  9. The Jitty Slitter

    The Jitty Slitter Moderator
    Staff Member

    Bayern München
    Germany
    Jul 23, 2004
    Fascist Hellscape
    Club:
    FC Sankt Pauli
    Nat'l Team:
    Belgium
    it seems this will be on all 4 bills. So that is what I mean about whether MAGA Mike designed this to fail - having the 4 things together makes it more complicated.

    But dems broke the impasse in the rules committee which is highly unusual.

    cross everything
     
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  10. The Irish Rover

    The Irish Rover Member+

    Aug 1, 2010
    Dublin
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Ireland Republic
    Far better than that: :thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbsup:
    [​IMG]
     
  11. The Irish Rover

    The Irish Rover Member+

    Aug 1, 2010
    Dublin
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Ireland Republic
    That's a 3-1 vote for among the GOP. MAGA took a real hit today.

    A big "No" vote among Dems too. The Squad isn't that big. Be interesting to see who they are & why
     
  12. The Irish Rover

    The Irish Rover Member+

    Aug 1, 2010
    Dublin
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Ireland Republic
    #7837 The Irish Rover, Apr 19, 2024
    Last edited: Apr 19, 2024
    The post above was the shot. Now for the chaser:


    That's a TU-22 strategic bomber. The first confirmed kill of the conflict

    Rest In Pieces
     
  13. goliath74

    goliath74 Member

    May 24, 2006
    Hollywood, FL, United States
    Club:
    FC Dynamo Kyiv
    Nat'l Team:
    Ukraine
    Ukraine is claiming a hit on the TU-22M using a modified S-200 missile. According to some of the Russian military bloggers, it was Ukrainian AA fire. Even on Solovyov's program an expert said it was a possibility.
     
  14. Brilliant Oranje

    Ajax
    Netherlands
    Mar 4, 2023
    Amsterdam and Marbella
    Nat'l Team:
    Netherlands
    Ukraine aid bill passes the House, just like I said it would

     
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  15. spejic

    spejic Cautionary example

    Mar 1, 1999
    San Rafael, CA
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Sounds like Russia really screwed up. That aircraft must have been flying that same pattern very frequently for the Ukrainians to pick up on it and then move this system in range and get it ready just at the right time. It probably took days, maybe weeks to set up this kill.
     
  16. DoyleG

    DoyleG Member+

    CanPL
    Canada
    Jan 11, 2002
    YEG-->YYJ-->YWG-->YYB
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  17. Yoshou

    Yoshou Fan of the CCL Champ

    May 12, 2009
    Seattle
    Club:
    Seattle Sounders
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    5 months after Biden warned Congress that funding was running low and 2 months after the Senate passed a virtually identical bill. Not to mention the thousands of Ukrainian lives that died defending Avdiivka with little to no artillery, months of Russia obliterating Ukrainian energy network due to a lack of air defenses…

    But sure.. just like you said.
     
  18. The Jitty Slitter

    The Jitty Slitter Moderator
    Staff Member

    Bayern München
    Germany
    Jul 23, 2004
    Fascist Hellscape
    Club:
    FC Sankt Pauli
    Nat'l Team:
    Belgium
    and needing dems to pass it out of rules and underwrite MAGA Mikes speakership because his own party was blocking it and threatening to oust him.
     
  19. waitforit

    waitforit Member+

    Dec 3, 2010
    Valcea
    Club:
    FC Steaua Bucuresti
    Nat'l Team:
    Romania
    Even so it passed eventually

    It passed about 6 weeks later than I personally thought but it passed
     
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  20. Brilliant Oranje

    Ajax
    Netherlands
    Mar 4, 2023
    Amsterdam and Marbella
    Nat'l Team:
    Netherlands
    Thank you for admitting I was right
     
  21. Brilliant Oranje

    Ajax
    Netherlands
    Mar 4, 2023
    Amsterdam and Marbella
    Nat'l Team:
    Netherlands
    It wouldve passed a lot sooner if senile old Biden hadnt dragged his feet on border security.
    Finally he relented and the bill went through. If he had just agreed to the stipulations the bill wouldve passed in February already.

    Here's what Biden finally agreed to: https://www.speaker.gov/wp-content/...Sheet_National-Security-Supplemental.docx.pdf


    THE END THE BORDER CATASTROPHE ACT

    President Biden and his administration created the worst border crisis this country has ever seen. To crack down on the flow of illegal immigrants and drugs across our southern border, the End the Border Catastrophe Act implements reforms that will secure the border and protect the
    American people.

    • Forces the Biden Administration to restart construction of the border wall
    • Ends catch and release
    • Ends abuse of parole
    • Implements Remain in Mexico
    • Deploys technology to the southern and northern border
    • Increases the number of Border Patrol agents and provide bonus pay
    • Requires transparency regarding illegal crossings from the Department of Homeland
    Security
    • Strengthens current law to protect unaccompanied children from human trafficking
    • Strengthens and streamline the asylum process
    • Imposes additional penalties for overstaying a visa
    • Reimburses states for costs incurred while securing the border
     
  22. The Jitty Slitter

    The Jitty Slitter Moderator
    Staff Member

    Bayern München
    Germany
    Jul 23, 2004
    Fascist Hellscape
    Club:
    FC Sankt Pauli
    Nat'l Team:
    Belgium
  23. ElNaranja

    ElNaranja Member+

    Houston Dynamo
    United States
    Jul 16, 2017
    That border bill is bull**** and should have been sent to the shredder instead of anyone with a pulse of empathy signing it.
     
  24. superdave

    superdave Member+

    Jul 14, 1999
    VB, VA
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I thought you were brilliant
     
  25. Brilliant Oranje

    Ajax
    Netherlands
    Mar 4, 2023
    Amsterdam and Marbella
    Nat'l Team:
    Netherlands
    If anyone wouldnt be able to spot brilliance, it would be you :D
     

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