U20s vs. Italy, Oct. 9, 2025 (Pre-/PBP/Post-Match Thread)

I think we forget Miller and Gozo are 2 years younger than our oldest on this team. And I am so confused why a legit starter in MLS like Beavers who earned a solid move to Brondby isn't starting over an obviously shaky, Beaudry.

 

VAR has corrected so many egregious errors and obvious goal/non-goals over the yrs. A low scoring game like soccer should never just say oh well to such a great way to correct them. System improvement can always happen

 

Yep, Morocco thrives on transition. That's the second big challenge for the style this team plays. The first challenge was to dominate possession against European midfields. They've done that twice now. We're as dominant a midfield as any here. Now, let's handle the fast break kings who don't care about possession.

 

Soon to be a US Soccer chant.

 

Tsakiris and Cremaschi were the top players on the field easily. Neither Italian was even close. Tsakiris is actually very fast and quite strong, Cremaschi is very strong and quite fast. Who from previous teams had better talent except for Pulisic? Unless you go back to 2007 to pull Jozy out.

 

It was tough to tell if he just got lucky, but there were a few attacks that started from a smart and/or ballsy Beaudry pass. Feels like the mandate from on high is to prioritize ball playing keepers over shot stoppers, but this is my first time really watching Beaudry, so I might be reading too much into it... but I agree that he often feels a bit shaky.

 

Another thing the Italian commentators were lamenting is how few professional games their players have under their belts compared to the Americans. The Serie A is so full of foreign players these days that it has become extremely difficult for young Italians to break through.

 

You must have missed the New Caledonia game. I could be wrong but all Beaudry passes seemed pretty standard. No one would consider Beaudry as a GK with good feet.

 

The last goal is one reason why. Beaudry has a good leg on him and they tried that GK play twice in the final minutes.

 

Gozo definitely looks like he belongs, Miller is for the next cycle. Also confused about the keepers choices, but maybe Beaudry has much better feet?

 

Absolutely. These guys are just solid. They remind of a well-drilled NCAA basketball that can go deep in the Tournament, even though they lack high first round draft prospects.

My only complaint with this group is the lack of decision making in transition. Too often the final ball to get a good shot on goal did not come.

 

They must rate MLS pretty highly.

 

well let em come here.

 

Also Miller is playing out of position as a LW when he's really a left back, and that is where he starts for NE and where his future lies with his skill set.

 

Not after what I just saw.

 

Funny thing is, there are certain posters who say that young Americans can't get games in MLS because there are too many foreign players here.

 

I'm probably in the doomer group, but I've made a point of suggesting that this group will provide a lot of depth to the senior team, if not the stars and starters the '17, '19, and '21 provided (would have provided if '21 wasn't cancelled). I don't see starters coming out of this group other than Kochen, but I see plenty of guys that look like they have the potential to be top 15-50 in the pool between '26-'38 and that's valuable too. We just need to start producing starters again as the '23, and '25 cycles haven't been at that level, on the positive side, it definitely seems like players from the '27 and '29 groups appear likely to produce starters again. And again, if we pull 3-4+ if not more that are USMNT relevant, historically, that's a win, for pretty much any nation, and I am pretty sure I see at least 2-3, and possibly 3-5 guys that could be relevant.

I will point out that our results in the stretch between November '24 and September '25 were more impressive than beating this Italy that I believe had only 3 of the guys from their U19 Championships squad, France I think was even worse. So these wins, I'll take them, but it seems like beating Morocco 4-1, and drawing them, a month before Morocco looked like the best team from the group stage before resting players is definitely more impressive, same with beating a good Norway, tying a good Japan, beating a good Colombia, all of those sides are at bare minimum top 8 in the tournament, and I believe (though I could be wrong) featured the bulk of their A team, or at worst, a good mix, rather than these depleted sides from France and Italy we played the past week.

Again, I'm impressed with the results, and in general with the performances (South Africa was a rotated squad that didn't need a result, so I don't view it as material).

I'm happy with them. It would be amazing to break the QF curse that stretches back to 1989 (YES, we made a run to the semi's 36 years ago (Steve Snow grabbed 3 goals, but our results weren't hugely impressive: we beat East Germany, tied Mali, lost to Brazil, beat Iraq in the Quarters, before losing to Nigeria in extra time in the semi's and then Brazil again in the 3rd place game). Snow and Troy Dayak were are goal scorers during the tourney (scoring 5 of our 6 goals). Famous graduates from that squad to the senior team beyond the inimitable "could have been" classic Steve Snow included Kasey Keller, Mike Burns, the aforementioned MLSer Troy Dayak, and Chris Henderson, and the late Arena assistant Curt Anolfo.

For those curious about the particulars of the painful run from hell:

2003: They give up an equalizer to Argentina in literally the final second of the game (the day before my birthday) and lose in extra time. Otherwise a wonderful assist from 13 year old Ada to a streaking Bobby Convey would have sent us to the semifinals against Brazil (our nemesis in quite a few U20 WC's in the late eighties and nineties).

2007: I still don't know how we could beat Brazil, and Uruguay, and lose to freaking Austria, other than the fact that it was raining, our GK was injured, and we were playing on crap astroturf. It was the easiest matchup imaginable after somehow escaping South Korea, Brazil, and Uruguay, and I have to chalk it up to assuming we would win (we did jump out to a 1-0 lead before giving up some idiotic goals in the rain, the winner in extra time).

2015: We needed a miracle to make the quarters (Steffen to save a penalty against Colombia so our 1-0 lead would hold up) and we got it, but after that, our lack of attacking mien, caught up to us, we had unreleased guys and a pile of guys got hurt plus the only senior team relevant talent was all defense and goalkeeping other than Arriola, so position the eventual champions to penalties was a great accomplishment.

2017: That Venezuela team was really, really impressive. We were erratic all tournament, with a huge win over Senegal, an inexplicable draw with the Saudi's and an opening draw with a final seconds equalizer from LDLT. We had an open gate knockout round appointment with favorite punching bag New Zealand in the R16's, but then met up with a fantastic Venezuela team that had handled Mexico, Germany and Japan earlier, and somehow got pushed to extra time by us, in a game eerily reminiscent of our R16 loss to Belgium at the WC 3 years earlier, we somehow pushed the game to extra time, and actually came close to tying it and forcing penalties late before falling 1-2, but Venezuela was MUCH BETTER, and would lose its first game all tournament only in the Final to England, which dominated all youth levels that cycle.

2019: This is the famous heartbreaker, we play the eventual champs even up beyond a bonehead Dest misplayed header in the opener, thrash Nigeria, beat Qatar I think in the finale, then shock France in the R16's, but fell to a seemingly offsides, but not offsides goal to Ecuador in a game I think a bunch of people agree with me, was marred by a poor starting lineup a la WC '10 defeat to Ghana style, where Ramos subbed out the studs from the win over France, for the Group Stage not good enough duo of defensive matadors in Durkin and Mendez, who teamed up to surrender a wonder foal from distance w/poor defending early. A good Ecuador team that finished I believe 3rd in the tourney.

2023: A good performance and good run that ran into a powerhouse Uruguay side that would win the match and later the tournament, the heartbreaker was off and on Cowell, who like Luna would hit the crossbar and posts numerous times, would fire home a potential equalizer (I think it would have tied it, can't remember) only to have teammate R. Pukstas (maybe it just would have made it 1-2, I can't remember) inadvertently block it from going into the corner netting.

For me anyway, I view '03 as just of a piece with the heartbreaking loss to Germany a year earlier, but every other defeat was probably deserved other than '07.

So '03 and '07 are hugely unlucky to me, '19 was a toss up that we lost at least in part due to the coaches poor lineup decisions, but '15, '17, and '23 were all to better teams period, and we were always unlikely to win any of the 3, and did well to keep them as close as we did scoreline wise.

 

almost every single player on Italy has ZERO first team minutes. Meanwhile almost every single player on the US has a ton of first team minutes.

that is an ENORMOUS advantage for this team....it really cannot be overstated

MLS isnt as good as the top 5 leagues, but its miles better than euro reserve ball. i mean, obviously.

"italy" and "france" jerseys have that aura.....but players who havent been playing first division football should really have no chance against players that have....and thats exactly what we've seen (if only by the ends of the games)

countries like italy arent giving enough of a chance to their young players in serie a....and thats why theyve fallen off.....italy should start sending their players to MLS for more minutes haha

 

None of their top options were there, right?

I just don't think we have an elite striker prospect, period, from this collection of players ('06's and '05's primarily) other than maybe Keyrol, who's working his way back. Sometimes we don't ('05, '09-'13, '23 to the present, other times we do (we had GAM in '03, Altidore in '07, that dude who wasn't released and played for Reading in '15 before moving to Italy, Sargent in '17, Soto in '19, Pepi and AOC were the next guys, but AOC flamed out and Pepi was fast tracked like Sargent, and then '21 was cancelled. That's part of the reason Balo and Pepi (and Sargent, a could have been) have been so important. We just don't look like we have any stud strikers coming up from the '04, '05, and '06 groups, '07 too I think, so having Balo and Pepi so young, so cover up for a down turn for a while, especially if Keyrol doesn't hit.

 

You are right, but here comes our specific issue: if I'm a good youth striker 6'0", but 150 lbs, or just 5'9" but my dad is tall should I go play in USA 3rd devision, or let's say take full scholarship at Stanford. Even Dike chosen the second path.The same with keepers who don't have Tim Howard's body.

 

I'm curious, I think I already know the answer, but I know a team over the weekend asked for a red card review, ref gave the yellow. I think they then lost a review for their trouble, to me though, if they ask for a red, and the ref changes his decision (from no card to a yellow) they should retain their challenge, at least to me anyway, and I'm pretty sure they lost it, which, honestly, doesn't really make sense to me, considering they ended up being right (there should have been a card) just not by the degree they wanted. Weird.

 

Plenty of guys, but I don't want to debate. This group is doing its own thing.

 

He won't. I'm personally higher on Delgado than on him. Delgado will have MLS career at least. Supposedely we have great prospects in much younger groups, and than there is 2007 Ellis who is as attypical striker you can find, but I feel he could have been on this team.

 

My only quibble is with how VAR handles offsides. I do not believe, AT ALL, offsides was ever intended to be called in the way it has been called according to VAR (a unclipped freaking toenail can basically make you offsides at this point). To me the point was always about advantage gained, and freaking toes, and pinky fingernails are not advantages, it should have been broken down to a foot, or a full torso or something, but maybe that's just me (except I know when I watch and it shows the decisions based on those computerized laser images, people always grown "WTF?!?!" when a goal is overturned off of that bull----).

I like VAR too, I just don't like some of the ways its been used, and like the NFL, sometimes they just seem to get it wrong too (consider the absurd handball on El Tri, uncalled, with VAR in the Gold Cup Final, if that's not a handball, all VAR equipment in Concacrap should be tossed off the balcony's of the feds operating headquarters).