Translation needed (PSV and Justin Mapp)

Discussion in 'Yanks Abroad' started by voros, Jul 13, 2005.

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  1. uniteo

    uniteo Member+

    Sep 2, 2000
    Rockville, MD
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    That's really funny, because that's the argument I've been making about Convey for 2 years...that his off the ball work, defensive coverage, ability to hold the ball and maintain possession, willingness to make runs that stretch the defense despite not getting the ball...that he was a player who forced opposing teams to adjust their game and all these things were strengths of his that helped his team but weren't reflected in goals and assists....

    The almost universal reaction has been one of a) scorn, b) derision, c) pointing to stats and saying how he sucked

    The hypocrisy here is amazing

    Look I haven't really seen Mapp this year, but I hear he's playing really well.

    As to the argument that Mapp's teams are winning...well that's a valid point, but how much can a single player impact the winning/losing equation (especially in the cases of Adu and Convey, where they were essentially played out of position in favor of older players); Mapp's presence did not keep DCU form sucking; this season is only half over; and who has more rings, Adu or Convey?
     
  2. appoo

    appoo Member+

    Jul 30, 2001
    USA
    First of all, at this point in time, I'd agree your post fix. At least until Convey can figure out how to hold down a 1st team spot with his club and show that he's better than Mapp. If it came down to choosing between the two at LM, I'd pick Mapp.

    2nd, I should have said his play at the end of matches. He's getting better, and may have fixed that issue permanently, It was my one knock his game.

    Seriously, I'm a fan of Mapp. I've been pimping this kid for the National team for over a year now.
     
  3. Nutmeg

    Nutmeg Member+

    Aug 24, 1999
    Yeah, it is. But you're replying to a guy who charted a few Convey games with the US team to make people reconsider their initial impressions. A lot of people wanted to toss him off the team from day one. I am probably one of the very few left who would have absolutely no problems with Convey starting as our left back in the next qualifier.

    Please stop attributing Convey or Adu bashing to me. I'm not that guy.

    But I do think Mapp is better, right now, then both.
     
  4. appoo

    appoo Member+

    Jul 30, 2001
    USA
    key point right there. you need to watch his matches

    around these parts I'm known as the #1 Convey-Lover. But no way was Convey EVER as effective for United as Mapp is right now for Chicago. Right now, Mapp is playing VERY welll. And I understand Convey's off-the-ball value just as welll as you do. I started a thread a few years ago to start a conversation about it
     
  5. uniteo

    uniteo Member+

    Sep 2, 2000
    Rockville, MD
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Yeah, not ^^him^^

    Uh, and you'll notice, I never said Mapp wasn't playing well/deserving of the attention. I just noted that his goals and assists were not that high. Y'all are the ones who took that as a big criticism.

    I just found it interesting that for Convey the whole issue of PRODUCTION in terms of goals (especially) and assists is such a big issue, but Mapp doesn't seem to be held to the same standard around here. But I like Convey's game so I must know nothing.
     
  6. appoo

    appoo Member+

    Jul 30, 2001
    USA
    my appreciation of Convey's game is a big reason why I like Mapp's game also. they are not all that dissimilar
     
  7. Wahoo

    Wahoo New Member

    Aug 15, 2001
    Seattle, USA
    It's amazing how even a thread about Justin Mapp who may or may not be being watched by a team in Holland degrades into a war of words on how good Convey is.

    I'm wondering if there is any possible thread on YA that won't be turned to Convey... because I'd like to see that thread.
     
  8. voros

    voros Member

    Jun 7, 2002
    Parts Unknown
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    The thing is with the Fire right now is, yes they are winning, but also their attack right now often consists of:

    a) Justin Mapp running down the center
    b) Justin Mapp running down the right
    c) Justin Mapp running down the left

    So it's not so much that they're winning, they're winning and he is such a key part of their offense. While most teams have to worry about stringing passes to get it into the final third, the Fire give it to Mapp and he just runs it into the final third and the attack begins. When he struggles to get involved, they struggle to create chances. When he's all over the field, the Fire create lots of chances. I agree, he has the ability to be better than even this, but Mapp at 60% efficiency is quite a player in his own right.

    There's nothing quite like a player who runs right at defenders and beats them He ruins all of your defensive planning.

    Check out the moves he busts on Franchino and Dorman at the 33:00 mark in the last game. {shakes head} To think we've got youth coaches who'd scream at him for not passing out of that double team.
     
  9. DrBobC

    DrBobC Member

    Feb 28, 2004
    Burton upon Trent
    Club:
    Chicago Fire
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    you stole my thunder.
     
  10. swilso01

    swilso01 Member

    Feb 25, 2004
    Philly
    The people on the "Armas Sucks" train seem pretty focused.
     
  11. DrBobC

    DrBobC Member

    Feb 28, 2004
    Burton upon Trent
    Club:
    Chicago Fire
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I would tend to disagree. DMB didn't suddenly turn it on. Soccer is a funny game. When you play with mediocre talent or against mediocre talent it tends to bring your game down to the lower level. DMB could not grow his game in the MLS. PSV gave him the opportunity to play with highly skilled players and bring his game to the next level. Look how much better DMB looks when he plays with LD vs. Josh Wolfe.
     
  12. bing1985

    bing1985 Member

    Jun 14, 2004
    Near West ChiSuburbs
    This is making me sick.

    They can't ************ing have him. They can't. We must rise up and fight, I say - rise up. Crap on a cracker.

    General bitch: We developed Boca and DMB and shipped them off for - what - nothing, really. If the league doesn't fight to save Mapp, I'll freaking go off, I swear it. They sure stood up and said no to big piles of cash for EJ. At some point the league has to worry about allowing teams to recoup their investments - either on the field or with a fair transfer. Mapp is quickly becoming a marque player on a team drawing poorly due, in large part, to a lack of marque.

    :mad: :mad: :mad:

    p.s. - oops - almost forgot.
    Convey blah blah Convey blah blah Landon blah Adu, blah blah Convey.
     
  13. jri

    jri Red Card

    Sep 28, 2000
    boca
    Repped. 95% of US soccer fans just don't get this point, and are too enamored with the station-2-station buildup which is most likely a whole bunch of nothing.

    Concepts US soccer fans/players NEED to learn NOW: (1) Change of pace (2) Ability to break down 1v1 GOLDEN (3) Ability to do spectacular (earn PK, score, assist out of nothing) WORTH 5x vs. 'hard work', 'station-2-station', inside-of-foot square balls, etc. (atlhough a team needs both to succeed- we got the latter in spades)
     
  14. smock7

    smock7 Member

    Aug 4, 2004
    New York City
    Exactly.

    PSV has a well-known reputation around Europe for constantly unearthing unknown talent and shipping it off to bigger teams. There are a countless number of superstars who began there. Ronaldo, Stam, Van Bommel just to name a few. That is why I was so psyched to see Beas go there.

    For the Fire, look at Boca, Beasley, and maybe wink a bit at Thornton (new team, so forgive me a bit).

    Now look at Mapp, Chris Rolfe, Lubos Reiter, Gonzalo Segares and hopefully more in the future Chad Barrett and Will Johnson.

    Mapp, by the way, is the real deal. I don't really know anyone who could discount him, especially with his play the last few months.
     
  15. jri

    jri Red Card

    Sep 28, 2000
    boca
    Rolfe is very interesting too. Nice soccer IQ...does some thing very well that could translate to a good Euro league (speed, quickness of thought, creativity, ability to score differently, 1v1 skills)...

    I think he's a outside right mid in reality..but I guess we'll see.
     
  16. owendylan

    owendylan Member

    May 30, 2001
    Virginia
    Club:
    DC United
    One of the worst trades DCU ever did was getting rid of Mapp after 1 season. He has turned into a truly exceptional player.
     
  17. BrianJames

    BrianJames Member

    Jul 30, 2000
    Chicago
    Don't forget Damani Ralph

    Um, by Reiter you mean Nate Jaqua?
     
  18. E Diddy

    E Diddy Member

    Jul 1, 2003
    Hutto, TX
    Club:
    FC Dallas
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Apoo.....

    I'm not sure you could have come up with anything less appealing than that description....well done..

    E Diddy
     
  19. freisland

    freisland Member+

    Jan 31, 2001
    by moving to PSV bease:

    1) went from a (in the last year or so anyway) a two-way or even defensive minded LM/WB position to part of an attacking three - usually left, sometimes right or even center.

    2) went from being one of the best, most dangerous and most heavily marked player on the team to being one of a half dozen dangerous players.

    3) went from being a 90 minutes all the time guy to a second half spike of crystal meth against a hopefully tiring D.

    4) went from being one of the better passers with vision on the team to a team with at least a half dozen good passers with decent vision.

    All of these moves play to DMB's strengths.

    Sometimes, there is personal benefit in having to stretch yourself on the field (Arena's amid experiment) and develop some additional skills, but sometimes it's really nice to be placed in a position fairly perfectly suited for you skill set.
     
  20. dabes2

    dabes2 Member

    Jun 1, 2003
    Chicago
    I thought he was just hot for Frankie.
     
  21. panicfc

    panicfc Member+

    Dec 22, 2000
    In my chair, typing
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Justin Mapp continued to dominate tonighta against Western Mass. WM is not a bad team, and no doubt they would have beaten RSL, Chivas and maybe the Rapids on their day.

    Mapp put in a cross for Will John, goal.
    Mapp put in a cross, Will John headed it back to Reiter for a sensational goal
    Mapp, tapped it to Will John for a goal.

    Mapp destroyed WM all night long, change of pace, beating anyone, crossing, flicks, tricks, and riding off challenges like a man possessed.

    A big thing for Mapp this year is he is allowed to be the focal point, and rising to the occassion. If not PSV, someone is going to make that call and bring him over.
     
  22. afgrijselijkheid

    Dec 29, 2002
    mokum
    Club:
    AFC Ajax

    none of those players started at psv, and neither did robben or kezman
     
  23. Parmigiano

    Parmigiano Member

    Jun 20, 2003
    It's a pity Bruce couldn't call this kid in. Seems like he's earned a shot more than Quaranta.

    Seems like the US could use that kind of skill and pace down the right side come Germany.
     
  24. scaryice

    scaryice Member

    Jan 25, 2001
    hence the word "unearthed"
     
  25. afgrijselijkheid

    Dec 29, 2002
    mokum
    Club:
    AFC Ajax
    i was responding to the "began there" part, guess i coulda put it in bold

    EDIT: besides, they hardly "unearthed" ronaldo
     

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