Top Ten Falsehoods of 2005

Discussion in 'Premier League: News and Analysis' started by Atlantic-Pearl, Dec 25, 2005.

  1. Atlantic-Pearl

    Atlantic-Pearl New Member

    Dec 2, 2005
    check this out, i found it very true:

    1 Jose Mourinho is a disgrace to football

    Whenever Mourinho does anything the caterwauling and hand wringing in the press would be enough to deafen you. Only last week his refusal to shake hands with Arsene Wenger was treated by the British media with the same kind of horror as if he'd exposed himself to the Queen before the FA Cup final.

    Being accused of betraying the ethos of professional football is a bit like being told you're letting down the mafia

    And we're not immune to it over here. During Chelsea's win over Bayern Munich in last year's Champions League, RTE's normally expert panel reckoned they'd seen a note being passed to the bench from somewhere in the stand where a suspended Mourinho was sitting. "If this is proved, then they have to be thrown out of the competition," said Bill O'Herlihy and everyone else agreed. Of course nothing happened at all about this famous note, if it ever existed.

    As for Jose's occasional sniping at fellow managers, when Alex Ferguson did the same thing he was lionised for his, "mind games," which were considered to be a machiavellian strategy of some magnificence.

    Apart from anything else, there's something deeply hilarious about someone being accused of betraying the ethos of professional football. It's a bit like being told you're letting down the mafia.

    2 Roy Keane is a big loss to Manchester United

    The extent to which Roy Keane has declined can be seen by his eventual port of anchor after Alex Ferguson set him adrift.

    In the days following Keane's departure from Old Trafford, clubs such as AC Milan, Juventus and Real Madrid were mentioned as eager to get him on board, something, we were assured by the man's camp followers, which showed the high esteem with which he was still regarded in European football. In the end he had to settle for a bad team playing bad football in a bad league.

    For all the talk of his love of the club, Celtic is the equivalent of the knacker's yard for Keane. None of the other clubs felt he could do a job for them any more. Why should they have? He hadn't done it for United for a long time.

    My favourite explanation of Keane's eventual miserable choice came from the reporter who said that Mayfield Man didn't go to Real Madrid because they didn't fit up to his high standards. Ah yes, they sit around the Bernabeu and wish they were as good as Celtic.

    3 Manchester United are finished

    They're finished in Europe, but personally I'm having a few quid on them for the Premiership. Not that I think they'll catch Chelsea but they're the only team who possibly might and it's worth having a bit of an interest as you while away your Sundays in front of Sky Sports.

    Take the Benfica match out of the equation and United have won six out of seven in the league and progressed to the League Cup in very impressive style. There's an ominous look about this kind of run and the fact remains that United have a lot of very good players in the side. For all the whingeing about Rio Ferdinand, he remains one of the best centre-backs in Europe, while those who dismiss Cristiano Ronaldo as a pampered ponce have forgotten his displays in the European Championship and in big games for United.

    There's a temptation to make a morality tale out of United in which the departure of Keane spells the end of an era, but football is rarely so simple. Watch out for them in the second half of the season.

    4 Wayne Rooney is one of the best players in the world

    This is kind of equivalent to the many occasions in the last couple of years when United beat someone like Charlton 4-1 and the losing manager says, "There's no disgrace for us, they're one of the best teams in the world."

    Rooney was conspicuous by his absence when United were coming a cropper against AC Milan, Lille and Benfica

    The fact that Rooney can look absolutely unstoppable against Newcastle or Birmingham does not make him the new Maradona. In the World Player of the Year poll he came seventeenth, which was about right.

    Frank Lampard, who came second, seemed to be hoisting Chelsea on his back and carrying the team at times in last season's Champions League; Rooney was conspicuous by his absence when United were coming a cropper against AC Milan, Lille and Benfica.

    There are many admirable things about Rooney, but building a player up to such a ridiculous extent does him no good in the long run. Ask Paul Gascoigne.

    5 England can win the World Cup

    And Sligo can win the All-Ireland. In Hurling. England set off for every World Cup as favourites in their own mind and nobody else's.

    The team which barely stumbled through a qualifying group so weak that even Brian Kerr might have managed to successfully negotiate it are now talking up their chances of putting one over on Brazil. This is based, not on competitive games but on the fact that they won a friendly against Argentina (though they were pretty confident of success even before this.)

    But, as any Irish fan now knows, friendly matches don't mean a thing. Competitive games tell a tale and a 1-0 loss in Windsor Park suggests that this story is of the horror variety.

    England will fail once more and come home with another hard luck story to match the Hand of God in 1986, the penalty shoot-outs in 1990 and 1994 and the free-kick they, and nobody else, claim Ronaldinho mishit in 1998. Heh heh heh.

    6 United signed Ji-sung Park to sell jerseys

    This year's nastiest fiction, bordering on the libellous and securely in the heartland of racism. Park not only shone for South Korea in the last World Cup but went on to be absolutely outstanding for PSV Eindhoven.

    Don't these people remember him almost beating AC Milan on his own in last year's Champions League semi-final? United have made silly moves in the transfer market but, on the face of it, Park is a useful acquisition who hasn't done badly so far.

    The jersey selling thing gets trotted out by hacks who probably can't tell a Korean footballer from a Japanese one. What next? United bought Liam Miller to break into the crubeen market?

    7 Brian Kerr is a nice guy who was hard done by

    Of course he is. That must have been someone else who was on RTE last week blaming the previous management for our failure to qualify for the European Championship.

    They picked the wrong kind of hotel, said Brian in the kind of whine more normally heard from junkies talking to Paddy O'Gorman outside the methadone clinic. Did they pick the hotels for the next two years, did they?

    8 Robbie Keane is a failure

    One of the mysteries of Kerr's resignation was that the decent skins who backed him were willing to slag off any amount of players to get their man off the hook.

    Robbie Keane bore the brunt of this abuse. He was washed up, we were told. What could Brian do when his main striker couldn't even get a game at Spurs? At the moment Robbie is top scorer at Spurs and playing well in a team which will be fighting for a Champions League spot at the end of the season.

    Martin Jol's insistence on playing just one small striker means Robbie has to fight for his place with the excellent Jermaine Dafoe. He's not doing badly at all.

    9 Rafa Benitez has a lot to prove

    Naturally. A Champions League means nothing really, does it?

    10 Bolton Wanderers are a disgrace to the game

    If I see Peter Collins once more introduce Bolton highlights on the Premiership with the jaded air of a pimp advertising the attractions of his most clapped-out whores the television is going out the window. Jay Jay Okocha, El Haji Diouf, Kevin Nolan, yes it's all long ball with those lads, Pete a mhac.

    http://www.unison.ie/sportsdesk/football/stories.php3?ca=12&si=1533003
     
  2. Teso Dos Bichos

    Teso Dos Bichos Red Card

    Sep 2, 2004
    Purged by RvN
    1 Jose Mourinho is a disgrace to football

    Not a disgrace, just a bit over-rated. Although in saying that, his various antics towards the authorities haven't been the best thing he has ever done.

    2 Roy Keane is a big loss to Manchester United

    Of course he is a loss. Despite clearly not being at his best, he was still good enough in the EPL and was more of a match for his rivals. He could have played for any team for a good 2 seasons. His loss is in leadership, standards and defensive abilities. Going from one midfielder of that nature to Alan Smith is clearly a loss.

    3 Manchester United are finished

    In any season previous to the Chelsea aberration, we would be easily top and cruising. Whether anyone can match them over the course of a league is another question as injuries and suspensions don't hurt them as much due to their squad size. Going out of Europe is obviously a disappointment, but these things sometimes happen. However, why isn't all this bad press being directed towards Arsenal?

    4 Wayne Rooney is one of the best players in the world

    He clearly is and it's not even up for debate.

    5 England can win the World Cup

    Of course they can. This is perhaps their best overall squad ever, so they clearly have a very good chance.

    6 United signed Ji-sung Park to sell jerseys

    Of course not. Ignorance and racism is behind that statement.

    7 Brian Kerr is a nice guy who was hard done by

    He just wasn't good enough. Move along now.

    8 Robbie Keane is a failure

    His standards have slipped recently.

    9 Rafa Benitez has a lot to prove

    He more than proved himself for Valencia.

    10 Bolton Wanderers are a disgrace to the game

    Boring perhaps, but not a disgrace.
     
  3. Pazarius

    Pazarius New Member

    Jan 10, 2004
    England
    That's an exaggeration - he wasn't 'absent'. Rooney wasn't able to produce much in those games, but he was still there, working hard and fighting for the cause. Other players deservedly got far more criticism after those games.

    No player can be effective in every game single-handedly. Even Ronaldinho has had some games where it just didn't happen for him.

    So how high up do you have to be to qualify as 'one of the best players in the world'? Fifteenth? Tenth?

    The problem is of course that there is no definite answer to that question. Everyone usually means something slightly different by 'one of the best players in the world'. And so calling the statement a falsehood is an act of arrogance; you have to assume that everyone means the same thing you do by it, otherwise it just isn't a simple true/false matter.

    Erm, no this is just TRUE. Even if the chances of England winning the WC were about 1 in 10 billion, then it would still be completely TRUE to say they can win it. 'Can' means it is possible, not necessarily that it is likely to happen.

    England are favourites in their own minds only in the minds of others.

    Racism? Possibly a small amount. However if people's reasons for believing this are indeed irrational, cynicism and ignorance of non-Premiership football are far more likely culprits.

    Besides, all the writer has proved is that there exist valid footballing reasons to sign the player (especially at only £3.5m). It's extremely difficult to prove that financial considerations never played any part in the decision, which leaves a gap for people to fit their own beliefs in.
     
  4. sinner78

    sinner78 BigSoccer Supporter

    Sheffield Wednesday
    England
    Nov 7, 2001

    crap piece written by an irish manure fan.
    what a pile of sh1te.
    lol
     
  5. Prenn

    Prenn Member

    Apr 14, 2000
    Northern Ireland
    Club:
    Bolton Wanderers FC
    Nat'l Team:
    England
    I was going to tear this post apart but for some reason I feel as if point 10 made up for the few inaccuracies.
     
  6. theworm2345

    theworm2345 Member

    Jun 30, 2005
    Chicago, IL, USA
    Nat'l Team:
    Ireland Republic
    Haha good stuff, though I hope Cork will win the All-Ireland Hurling final this year.
    Keano is still great, Kerr isnt all that great, but wasnt terrble (0-1 at the French, in a game we could have won, not bad). Rooney=way over rated. Roy Keane still has it. Jose sucks. England has no chance in the World Cup (unfortunately, they have a better one than Ireland :( ). Rafa is fine. Bolton, well to me, Bolton just really doesnt exist. Man U, as much as I hate them, are not finished.
     
  7. RichardL

    RichardL BigSoccer Supporter

    May 2, 2001
    Berkshire
    Club:
    Reading FC
    Nat'l Team:
    England
    It would be a falsehood if it was widely believed. It isn't.

    Perhaps exaggerated, but they'd be better with him than without him.

    If Chelsea carry on their present form, then if even Man Utd win all 19 remaining matches, they won't win the title. I'm sure Cheslea will drop a few more points in the second half of the season, but I'm equally sure Man Utd aren't going to win those last 19 games either. Chelsea aren't the Newcastle of the mid 1990s.


    so you wouldn't say the 17th best player in the world was one of the best in the world then?

    England can win the world cup. They are probably around 5th or 6th favourites. I'm sorry if you find that painful, but it's true. People here don't think they are favourites, nor do the players. I know you enjoy refusing to believe that, but that's also true.

    I bet Ireland wish they could stumble to 25 points from 10 games now and then, rather than finishing 4th behind giants of the world game, such as Israel.

    there's nothing racist about it at all. The same things were said about Real Madrid signing david beckham. How is that not racist, if the accusation is exactly the same?

    The implication (in both cases) was that a player wasn't really good enough for the team, but he'd help shift a few shirts. You can call the statement(s) ignorant, but only someone looking to go on a bit of points scoring would try and drag racism into it.



    couldn't give a toss.

    Maybe now that Dave Basset & Dennis Wise are out of work the FAI should call them up and help recreate those Big Jack long ball glory days.


    He is? This is believed where exactly?


    were Liverpool worthy champions, with a real claim to be the best team in Europe, or were they a tad lucky? People are still waiting to see which Liverpool is the real one.

    Bolton are the classic case of a club that the journalists hate, a (comparitively) small club not knowing their place in the game, and sticking around towards the top long after they've run out of patronising plaudits for them.

    But again, I've no idea where this feeling of "disgrace" comes from, because it isn't here.
     
  8. Teso Dos Bichos

    Teso Dos Bichos Red Card

    Sep 2, 2004
    Purged by RvN
    The Beckham comments were to do with his overall quality and whether he would be good for Real Madrid in a playing sense. The Park comments were mainly due to his nationality and the belief that he was bought to increase the club profile and sell shirts in that region. Racism? Make your own mind up.
     
  9. RichardL

    RichardL BigSoccer Supporter

    May 2, 2001
    Berkshire
    Club:
    Reading FC
    Nat'l Team:
    England
    No. They were outright suggestions that he was being signed for his marketing potential, exactly the same as Park.

    the Beckham shirts were also going to be sold in that region. Where's the difference?

    The only reason racism was raised is because it invloves a guy who isn't white. It may be a suggestion of exploiting a market, but that isn't racism.

    I think the writer's probably deeply prejudiced himself, and is just overcompensating by going on a little misguided crusade to lesson his own guilt.
     
  10. Crest_of_the_stars

    Crest_of_the_stars New Member

    Dec 7, 2005
    He's not a 'disgrace' and no one (whos important, or the media actually) has portrayed him as. What he is, is a bit of a nutter and fairly childish. Anything vaguely negative said about him or anything to do with him will result in some ultra venemous over-the-top statement in the press. ie. wenger is a voyeur and all that bollocks.

    I remember Ranieiri making some very very mild comment and Mourinho going off his rocker and insulting the amount of trophies he had won. Very bizzare.

    Personally I dont mind him, he's a character and when he sticks it to the press sometimes like when they were constantly mithering and insinuating about his player selection he makes me laugh. But he's still a nut.


    At the end of the day, he was still better than Smith. He was a loss, how big is debatable. He couldnt do it all season, but in the big games even in his mid-30's he'd still always get the better of Vieira, Gerrard, Alonso and all the other pretenders.

    No, he is one of the worlds best players. Anyone claiming otherwise is ignorant or in denial.

    The fact you can actually count his bad games and came up with 3 where he didnt dominate says it all. He is held up to ridiculous standards.
    Quite frankly players like Lampard and Gerrard have loads of games a season where it doesnt happen for them and they dont influence the game. Ronaldinho early in the season and Barca as a whole were doing crap in La Liga.

    Every time Rooney doesnt completely destroy, it is held up because its unusual. Its very silly.

    I could name a dozen top games against Arsenal, Chelsea, Liverpool where he has been sheer class. He regularly completely shows up every one in an England shirt. How times games have Lampard, Gerrard, Beckham, Owen, Terry played as good as Rooney for England? Even the Northern Ireland game he was merely as terrible as everyone else.

    They are 3rd favourites in the German bookies and you'll find similar stories everywhere. They could win it, there's only 3 or 4 teams with players as good on paper. Simple as that.




    He has a lot to prove in the Premiership....



    The rest I agree with, although quite why he went off on one about Park I have no idea. Who has said he was signed to sell shirts except a few snipes on an internet board when he first signed? Nobody really thinks that.
     
  11. Alan_V

    Alan_V Member

    Apr 22, 2003
    Anaheim, CA via NJ
    Club:
    Blackburn Rovers FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Have to agree with teso here. What hasn't been mentioned is what it will take for Brazil or Argentina to fail. Example: Brazil will fail if Ronaldo and Ronaldinho are hurt. If only one of them is missing, or they'll struggle. They're not as deep as England.
     
  12. Pazarius

    Pazarius New Member

    Jan 10, 2004
    England
    Huh? England can put out a very good first eleven, but they have barely any depth at all in a lot of key positions. Losing Rooney would immediately cripple us, and we'd struggle to cope without any one of Robinson, Owen, G. Neville, A. Cole (with Bridge showing no sign of regaining his form).

    If Brazil lose both Ronaldo and Ronaldinho, they've still got Adriano, Kaka and Robinho.
     
  13. Eliezar

    Eliezar Member+

    Jan 27, 2002
    Houston
    Club:
    12 de Octubre
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I guess 94 was suppose to be 96 and 98 was suppose to be 02...or something.
     
  14. Teso Dos Bichos

    Teso Dos Bichos Red Card

    Sep 2, 2004
    Purged by RvN
    I have not denied that his marketing potential was a factor, but he was clearly a great player and their concerns were mainly down to what role he would play in the side and if he was required. When Park was linked the immediate suggestion was that he was been targeted because he was South Korean. No mention of nationality was made with Beckham. Therefore racism clearly played a part.
     
  15. Crest_of_the_stars

    Crest_of_the_stars New Member

    Dec 7, 2005
    Because the implication was he'd sell shirts in Asia...
     
  16. RichardL

    RichardL BigSoccer Supporter

    May 2, 2001
    Berkshire
    Club:
    Reading FC
    Nat'l Team:
    England
    Assuming, however wrongly, that a player isn't good enough because he comes from a certain country, isn't racism, it's ignorance. His race played no part in that assumption. It was far more to do with Man Utd being seen as possibly even more corporate and exploitative following the Glazer takeover.

    If Man Utd had signed an American player, with suggestions that he was signed with an eye on cracking the american merchandising market, would that be racism too, because that'd be exactly the same situation?


    An no, the complaints weren't about beckham not fitting in with the team, it was outright that he wasn't anywhere near good enougn for the team and was purely there to sell shirts, because, as the experts on here put it, all he can do is take free-kicks.
     
  17. Colm

    Colm Member

    Aug 17, 2004
    UK
    Club:
    Tottenham Hotspur FC
    Nat'l Team:
    --other--
    That has to be one of the worst posts ever.
     
  18. The Jitty Slitter

    The Jitty Slitter Moderator
    Staff Member

    Bayern München
    Germany
    Jul 23, 2004
    Karo Viertel
    Club:
    FC Sankt Pauli
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    the media reaction to mourinho is scarecely surprising, ever since he set himself as the "special one" in his superbly arrogant initial press conference in the UK

    like all celebs, they have built him up, and when the opportunities arise, they will tear him down.

    English tabloid media thrives on building up the tall poppy to such high levels, before cutting them at the knees, as is occuring with SGE and Beckham since euro 2004, and Utd and SAF

    Rooney and Andrew Flintoff the cricketer are in the ascent - but their turns will come

    Jose knows this, has played for it, and will not be at all surprised or alarmed by the treatment he gets.

    He set his stall out as the biggest celeb in the team from day 1.
     
  19. leg_breaker

    leg_breaker Member

    Dec 23, 2005
    They're Irish, they have massive chips on their shoulders.
     
  20. Grim_Reaper

    Grim_Reaper New Member

    Dec 5, 2004
    - Definition of a Well Balanced Irishman? ..A guy with a chip on both shoulders..
     

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