To people who'd leave the Crew to support Cleveland

Discussion in 'Columbus Crew SC' started by Eggy, Oct 4, 2003.

  1. Eggy

    Eggy New Member

    May 28, 1999
    CBUS
    That would be very unwise.
     
  2. Brook

    Brook BigSoccer Supporter

    Sep 13, 2001
    Cleveland
    Club:
    Chelsea FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Eggy, I certainly hope that you are not directly inferring me. I would never turn coat for the sake of saving a two hour drive and $30 in petrol money to support, what will probably end up being, a club owned by Wolstein. C'Mon you Blues (5 : 0)!
     
  3. Eggy

    Eggy New Member

    May 28, 1999
    CBUS
    Nope, I wasn't refering to you. Your scummy enough as it is supporting a team with a player who organizes parties where....

    We'll stop right there.
     
  4. Bill Archer

    Bill Archer BigSoccer Supporter

    Mar 19, 2002
    Washington, NC
    Club:
    Columbus Crew
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Eggy, I know you started this thread after a comment I made along these lines.

    In all honesty, when I said it I was so angry that I would have said or done a lot of things.

    But the sentiment is real: the management of this team has refused to do what needs to be done to get over the hurdle.

    Look, let's just lay it all out here, because we all avoid an ugly truth and it's time we turned on the lights and just called it what it is:

    The two worst teams in the league are owned by Hunt Sports. And only the odd collapse of LA, keeps KC from making it a clean sweep at the bottom of the rankings for HSG. Even New England has a better record.

    Conversely, the five best teams are owned by AEG.

    KC won the league one year in a stunning surprise; they were dead last the year before, and I believe they were dead last (or close to it) the year after.

    Aside from that freak occurrance, HSG teams have stunk up the league from the beginning.

    Put graphically, a single table (which we ought to have anyway) the league looks like this:

    1) Anschutz
    2) Anschutz
    3) Anschutz
    4) Anschutz
    5) Anschutz
    6) Kraft
    7) Hunt
    8) Anschutz
    9) Hunt
    10) Hunt

    (note: #9 CLB and #8 LA both have 32 pts; LA gets ranked higher on Goal Dif)

    I think this speaks volumes about the respective organizations and thier committment to winning. It is way too cut and dried to be mere coincidence.

    As a Crew fan, I own probably 12 or 15 jerseys as well as assorted other gear like scarves, etc. I spend a fortune on tickets every year, including back when, frankly, I really couldn't afford it. I have introduced upwards of 50 people over the years to their first Crew game. I drive two and a half hours each way, and put up with the absurd channeling of cars thriough the ghetto for 1/2 an hour every time before I am allowed to get on the freeway again.

    I could go on , but the point is this: I have nothing to prove to anybody in regard to my loyalty as a fan. Nothing.

    But where is THEIR loyalty to me, and the other fans? They have done, and are doing, nothing at all to try and save this season, except bringing in an old, slow English second Div castoff defender when our problem is that WE CAN'T SCORE GOALS.

    So now that the season is over (and it's over, guys) they're going to start in asking for my money for next year. Well screw them.

    If there's one thing I know for sure, it's that Bart Wolstein and partners, if they get a team, will fight and claw with their fingernails to win.

    And judging by the results, I just don't see HSG really caring all that much.
     
  5. diablodelsol

    diablodelsol Member+

    Jan 10, 2001
    North Ridgeville, OH
    Plus...getting that tat removed would be a bitch
     
  6. Ch(Elsey)

    Ch(Elsey) Member+

    Columbus Crew
    United States
    May 2, 2003
    Green, Ohio
    Club:
    Columbus Crew
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    If Cleveland gets a team, I'm going to hate them above all other teams. Even though Cleveland is a whole lot closer than Clb, the only time I'd go to a game would be to see the Crew play. That'd be the only positive to having a team in Cleveland. I already hate the idea of a team there. HATE HATE HATE. I hate Cleveland and their could-be team.
     
  7. Crew14

    Crew14 Member

    Apr 11, 2000
    Brunswick
    I'm actually hoping that Cleveland gets a team so we have the local rival who, if we ever get our act together, we can beat up on annually.

    C14
     
  8. Eggy

    Eggy New Member

    May 28, 1999
    CBUS
    Alot of people made comments.

    But I can imagine it turning very nasty. Crew supporters seeing ex-Crew supporters showing up in Columbus with Clevland tops on?

    Might as well paint a target on your chest and hand us a broadsword cause it will get messy.
     
  9. AndyMead

    AndyMead Homo Sapien

    Nov 2, 1999
    Seat 12A
    Club:
    Sporting Kansas City
    "Messy" - is that what happens when you "sort someone out?"
     
  10. myshap

    myshap Member

    Jun 19, 2002
    Club:
    Columbus Crew
    Fixed your table
     
  11. Sneever Flion

    Sneever Flion New Member

    Oct 29, 2002
    Detroit, MI
    That or you start "moving" people.
     
  12. Eggy

    Eggy New Member

    May 28, 1999
    CBUS
    Andy, it's what I'll do when I take that camera and beat you over the fcuking head with it you nonce.
     
  13. hangthadj

    hangthadj BigSoccer Yellow Card

    A.S. Roma
    Mar 27, 2001
    Beacon, NY
    Club:
    Columbus Crew

    That's a nice theory and all, but what are specific examples that show that Anschutz teams are more deadicated to winning?
     
  14. kaiser kraut

    kaiser kraut New Member

    Jun 26, 2001
    Indianapolis
    Club:
    Columbus Crew
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    True, but that was so recent that it is still really an Anschutz product on and off the field.
     
  15. kaiser kraut

    kaiser kraut New Member

    Jun 26, 2001
    Indianapolis
    Club:
    Columbus Crew
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Well, it seems that Anschutz teams always have more clout when it comes to getting their "discovery" and "allocation" types. Then again, with an owner throwing that kind of cash around, you really expect that.
     
  16. hangthadj

    hangthadj BigSoccer Yellow Card

    A.S. Roma
    Mar 27, 2001
    Beacon, NY
    Club:
    Columbus Crew
    But who? Yeah, Metros have got Guevara, Colorado consistently brings in 30 something year olds, Kraft's NE has brougt in Cancela.

    Then look at the HSG Crew...after last season didn't we all think that Garcia was gonna be one the stars in this league? It diodn't work out, but surely you can't blame HSG for Garcia's indifference on the field this season.
     
  17. Grouchy

    Grouchy Member+

    turkey bacon with swiss
    Apr 18, 1999
    Canal Winchester
    Club:
    Columbus Crew
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    And Martino...

    The Crew are full of promising disappointments:

    Khumalo
    Williams, Andy
    Perez
    Torres
    Garcia
    ?
    Duhaney (rookie of the year?)
    ?
    Arguably, this his injury this season, Martino?
    Arguably, Cunningham?
    ?
    Williams, Mark?
    ?
    Look at how many goalkeepers have come in, were brilliant then disappeared...
    Sommer
    Dougherty
    Presthus
     
  18. kaiser kraut

    kaiser kraut New Member

    Jun 26, 2001
    Indianapolis
    Club:
    Columbus Crew
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Alright, I did a little research. The following list of players shows the versatile movements from one AEG club to another. If you've followed MLS for some time, I think all of these names should be familiar to you. Some are still key players. Granted, I've included SJ and the Florida teams to a degree. Now TB was league owned, so you might as well say AEG. SJ has bounced around a lot, so by default, the ups of the league would have a good say there, so once again default AEG. Enjoy and discuss:

    Junior Agogo - Fire-Rapids-SJ

    Jeff Agoos - DC-SJ

    Chris Albright - DC-LA

    Chris Armas - LA-Fire

    Khodadad Azizi - Allocated to SJ

    Marcelo Balboa - Rapids-NY

    Paul Bravo - SJ-Rapids

    Jorge Campos - LA-Fire

    Chris Carrieri - Rapids-SJ-Rapids

    Brian Ching - LA-SJ

    Ramiro Corrales - SJ-NY-Miami-Metro-SJ

    Joey DiGiamarino - Rapids-NY

    Landon Donovan - Allocated to SJ

    Robin Fraser - LA-Rapids

    Paul Grafer - Rapids-NY

    Carlos Hermosillo - Allocated to LA

    Luis Hernandes - Allocated to LA

    Steve Jolley - LA-NY

    Dema Kovalenko - Fire-DC

    David Kramer - LA-SJ-Rapids

    Manny Lagos - NY-Fire-TB-SJ

    Jesse Marsch - DC-Fire

    Clint Mathis - LA-NY

    Orlando Perez - NY-DC-Fire

    Mike Petke - NY-DC

    Eddie Pope - DC-NY

    Ante Razov - LA-Fire

    Mark Semioli - LA-NY

    Hristo Stoitchkov - Fire-DC

    Zach Thornton - NY-Fire

    David Vaudreuil - DC-Miami-Rapids-Fire

    Peter Villegas - NY-DC

    Craig Waibel - Rapids-LA-SJ

    Ritchie Williams - DC-NY-DC-NY

    Craig Ziadie - DC-NY
     
  19. Bill Archer

    Bill Archer BigSoccer Supporter

    Mar 19, 2002
    Washington, NC
    Club:
    Columbus Crew
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Boy, talk about opening Pandora's Box - Grouchy's list, taken individually, has sufficient fodder to keep the boards alive all Winter.

    (edit: kk posted his while I was writing this)

    And in a couple weeks, we're gonna need it.

    Let's take the very first name on your list: Dr. Khumalo.

    Every team in MLS was awarded a "Marquee Allocation" .

    Some teams got US Stars from the WC:

    LA: Cobi Jones
    COL: Marcelo Balboa
    DC: John Harkes
    NY: Tab Ramos
    NE: Alexi Lalas
    SJ: Eric Wynalda

    A couple teams, for demographic reasons, got foreign WC stars:

    TB: Carlos Valderamma
    DA: Hugo Sanchez

    And then we come to the Hunt teams:

    CLB: Doctor Khumalo
    KC: Frank Klopas

    Now somebody want to tell me who got the dregs here? Klopas was already over 30 and had sat the bench in the WC. He was foisted off on the Fire after less than two years and even wore a Crew uni for a bit before retiring.

    And Khumalo was the only one of these "Marquee Allocations" that hadn't been to the WC at all. Never. So was he sent here to attract the huge South African population of Franklin County? Both of them?

    And as for this absurd "Michael Jordan of South Africa" nonsense, horsechips. hang could probably be the "Babe Ruth of Botswana" too, but that doesn't mean we should build the Yankees around him.

    Of the others, Sanchez was something less than stellar, but he was there to attract the Mexicans. The rest of the guys have been prominent in the league and most are either still playing or recently retired.

    The bummer from the leagues point of view was that we drew the first draft pick and chose that kid with the bad haircut from St Louis.
     
  20. hangthadj

    hangthadj BigSoccer Yellow Card

    A.S. Roma
    Mar 27, 2001
    Beacon, NY
    Club:
    Columbus Crew
    Just to play devils advocate, only these player from the whole list really dramatically improved the teams chances at winning

    Granted, that's quite a bit. Slightly over half the list. So slightly over half the trades/aquisitions have improved AEG teams. Frankly I am too swamped at work to do as thorough a job as KK did here, but I would think there would be a similar percentage for HSG teams.

    However, there also is some truth to HSG turning their backs on the teams a bit. I would venture Dallas fans believe that they were put in a no-win situation at Dragon Stadium this year. I think that much of HSG's energy that was put into MLS over the past two years has been the whole Dallas stadium situation, so we may have got the short end there. But when you look at how last year the bottom two teams were NY and DC (both AEG teams) and that DC had been miserable for 3 years I think its fair to say this thing goes in cycles.

    Over and over again this season Bill and others have stated that our team was put in a position to win, we had/have the talent. The Coach didn't get the job done. HSG rolls the dice hoping possibly for a New England type turnaround in the final few months, and a run to the Cup. It backfired like hell, but it's more the fault of Greg and staff than HSG.
     
  21. Bill Archer

    Bill Archer BigSoccer Supporter

    Mar 19, 2002
    Washington, NC
    Club:
    Columbus Crew
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    So can we expect the announcement of Andrulis' firing today or tomorrow?

    Unlike a lot of guys, rightly or wrongly, I think Jim Smith did all he could to put us in a position to make a run.

    Andrulis is a dead mouse on the kitchen floor, but Smith can't fire the guy on his own. Wagner and Clark Hunt have to give him the green light.

    I strongly believe that it would have been possible to make that end-of-season run, but with Greg as the coach it was pretty obvious it wasn't going to happen. And I don't blame Jim SMith, I blame HSG.
     
  22. Eggy

    Eggy New Member

    May 28, 1999
    CBUS
    Someone get joey-info in here to find out the exact date Andrulis will be fired.
     
  23. hangthadj

    hangthadj BigSoccer Yellow Card

    A.S. Roma
    Mar 27, 2001
    Beacon, NY
    Club:
    Columbus Crew
    I see your point clearly. But if HSG thought Andrulis could make an end of season run, they weren't alone. During Buddle's streak when we were playing some good ball even national writers like Connolly (in a featured piece on MLSnet) pointed out that the Crew might finally be getting it all together now that everyone is healthy. Then it all turned to shite again, quickly. In retrospect they should have pulled the trigger, and I agree that they definately should still do so today or tomorrow. But there was a glimmer of hope for a bit and HSG may have gambled on that and lost. Or you may just be right that they don't care.
     
  24. Zak

    Zak Member

    Feb 18, 2002
    Massive Club
    As I stated earlier in the morning over on the V-Army mailing list, I believe that if we drop the result on Friday, Greg will hold a press conference on Monday morning, where it will be announced he will not have his contract renewed but will remain as coach for the remainder of the year. This will allow him to exit gracefully, and eliminate the need for flooding inboxes and/or holding a protest the last game of the season. I'd be willing to allow him to exit gracefully if there were indications that his contract was not going to be renewed. I think we owe him a graceful exit, he brought us our first trophy, albeit not the trophy we wanted. The more and more I think about it, this is the scenario that I envision. They did it with Cunty, they didn't want a massive and very public row, and now you can see, quietly, there are signs that Andrulis is being shown directions to the door. I mean has a single soul heard anything about contract negotiations? You would think thirty days before it goes up, we would've heard something. I know if I were working and I hadn't been offered a new contract thirty days till it's expiration, the writing would be on the wall.
     
  25. Zak

    Zak Member

    Feb 18, 2002
    Massive Club
    Furthermore, how can anyone question whether or not Jim Smith has put enough talent on the field? The players that continue to dog us down, are all Rootes players. Smith is responsible for Martino, Buddle, Busch, Paule, this is a very talented team. The only two gaffes he's made with personnel, albeit big ones, is trading Dunseth and Bonseu. Especially when you consider that Perez left the following year which would've given the roster space and the cash to keep him. Either way, there's no concievable way this team should've missed the playoffs, beit soccer gods anger, injury, call up, or otherwise. The talent is there, the tactics obviously arent.
     

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