Separate names with a comma.
Discussion in 'Columbus Crew SC' started by Eggy, Oct 4, 2003.
That would be very unwise.
Eggy, I certainly hope that you are not directly inferring me. I would never turn coat for the sake of saving a two hour drive and $30 in petrol money to support, what will probably end up being, a club owned by Wolstein. C'Mon you Blues (5 : 0)!
Nope, I wasn't refering to you. Your scummy enough as it is supporting a team with a player who organizes parties where....
We'll stop right there.
Eggy, I know you started this thread after a comment I made along these lines.
In all honesty, when I said it I was so angry that I would have said or done a lot of things.
But the sentiment is real: the management of this team has refused to do what needs to be done to get over the hurdle.
Look, let's just lay it all out here, because we all avoid an ugly truth and it's time we turned on the lights and just called it what it is:
The two worst teams in the league are owned by Hunt Sports. And only the odd collapse of LA, keeps KC from making it a clean sweep at the bottom of the rankings for HSG. Even New England has a better record.
Conversely, the five best teams are owned by AEG.
KC won the league one year in a stunning surprise; they were dead last the year before, and I believe they were dead last (or close to it) the year after.
Aside from that freak occurrance, HSG teams have stunk up the league from the beginning.
Put graphically, a single table (which we ought to have anyway) the league looks like this:
(note: #9 CLB and #8 LA both have 32 pts; LA gets ranked higher on Goal Dif)
I think this speaks volumes about the respective organizations and thier committment to winning. It is way too cut and dried to be mere coincidence.
As a Crew fan, I own probably 12 or 15 jerseys as well as assorted other gear like scarves, etc. I spend a fortune on tickets every year, including back when, frankly, I really couldn't afford it. I have introduced upwards of 50 people over the years to their first Crew game. I drive two and a half hours each way, and put up with the absurd channeling of cars thriough the ghetto for 1/2 an hour every time before I am allowed to get on the freeway again.
I could go on , but the point is this: I have nothing to prove to anybody in regard to my loyalty as a fan. Nothing.
But where is THEIR loyalty to me, and the other fans? They have done, and are doing, nothing at all to try and save this season, except bringing in an old, slow English second Div castoff defender when our problem is that WE CAN'T SCORE GOALS.
So now that the season is over (and it's over, guys) they're going to start in asking for my money for next year. Well screw them.
If there's one thing I know for sure, it's that Bart Wolstein and partners, if they get a team, will fight and claw with their fingernails to win.
And judging by the results, I just don't see HSG really caring all that much.
Plus...getting that tat removed would be a bitch
If Cleveland gets a team, I'm going to hate them above all other teams. Even though Cleveland is a whole lot closer than Clb, the only time I'd go to a game would be to see the Crew play. That'd be the only positive to having a team in Cleveland. I already hate the idea of a team there. HATE HATE HATE. I hate Cleveland and their could-be team.
I'm actually hoping that Cleveland gets a team so we have the local rival who, if we ever get our act together, we can beat up on annually.
Alot of people made comments.
But I can imagine it turning very nasty. Crew supporters seeing ex-Crew supporters showing up in Columbus with Clevland tops on?
Might as well paint a target on your chest and hand us a broadsword cause it will get messy.
"Messy" - is that what happens when you "sort someone out?"
Fixed your table
That or you start "moving" people.
Andy, it's what I'll do when I take that camera and beat you over the fcuking head with it you nonce.
That's a nice theory and all, but what are specific examples that show that Anschutz teams are more deadicated to winning?
True, but that was so recent that it is still really an Anschutz product on and off the field.
Well, it seems that Anschutz teams always have more clout when it comes to getting their "discovery" and "allocation" types. Then again, with an owner throwing that kind of cash around, you really expect that.
But who? Yeah, Metros have got Guevara, Colorado consistently brings in 30 something year olds, Kraft's NE has brougt in Cancela.
Then look at the HSG Crew...after last season didn't we all think that Garcia was gonna be one the stars in this league? It diodn't work out, but surely you can't blame HSG for Garcia's indifference on the field this season.
The Crew are full of promising disappointments:
Duhaney (rookie of the year?)
Arguably, this his injury this season, Martino?
Look at how many goalkeepers have come in, were brilliant then disappeared...
Alright, I did a little research. The following list of players shows the versatile movements from one AEG club to another. If you've followed MLS for some time, I think all of these names should be familiar to you. Some are still key players. Granted, I've included SJ and the Florida teams to a degree. Now TB was league owned, so you might as well say AEG. SJ has bounced around a lot, so by default, the ups of the league would have a good say there, so once again default AEG. Enjoy and discuss:
Junior Agogo - Fire-Rapids-SJ
Jeff Agoos - DC-SJ
Chris Albright - DC-LA
Chris Armas - LA-Fire
Khodadad Azizi - Allocated to SJ
Marcelo Balboa - Rapids-NY
Paul Bravo - SJ-Rapids
Jorge Campos - LA-Fire
Chris Carrieri - Rapids-SJ-Rapids
Brian Ching - LA-SJ
Ramiro Corrales - SJ-NY-Miami-Metro-SJ
Joey DiGiamarino - Rapids-NY
Landon Donovan - Allocated to SJ
Robin Fraser - LA-Rapids
Paul Grafer - Rapids-NY
Carlos Hermosillo - Allocated to LA
Luis Hernandes - Allocated to LA
Steve Jolley - LA-NY
Dema Kovalenko - Fire-DC
David Kramer - LA-SJ-Rapids
Manny Lagos - NY-Fire-TB-SJ
Jesse Marsch - DC-Fire
Clint Mathis - LA-NY
Orlando Perez - NY-DC-Fire
Mike Petke - NY-DC
Eddie Pope - DC-NY
Ante Razov - LA-Fire
Mark Semioli - LA-NY
Hristo Stoitchkov - Fire-DC
Zach Thornton - NY-Fire
David Vaudreuil - DC-Miami-Rapids-Fire
Peter Villegas - NY-DC
Craig Waibel - Rapids-LA-SJ
Ritchie Williams - DC-NY-DC-NY
Craig Ziadie - DC-NY
Boy, talk about opening Pandora's Box - Grouchy's list, taken individually, has sufficient fodder to keep the boards alive all Winter.
(edit: kk posted his while I was writing this)
And in a couple weeks, we're gonna need it.
Let's take the very first name on your list: Dr. Khumalo.
Every team in MLS was awarded a "Marquee Allocation" .
Some teams got US Stars from the WC:
LA: Cobi Jones
COL: Marcelo Balboa
DC: John Harkes
NY: Tab Ramos
NE: Alexi Lalas
SJ: Eric Wynalda
A couple teams, for demographic reasons, got foreign WC stars:
TB: Carlos Valderamma
DA: Hugo Sanchez
And then we come to the Hunt teams:
CLB: Doctor Khumalo
KC: Frank Klopas
Now somebody want to tell me who got the dregs here? Klopas was already over 30 and had sat the bench in the WC. He was foisted off on the Fire after less than two years and even wore a Crew uni for a bit before retiring.
And Khumalo was the only one of these "Marquee Allocations" that hadn't been to the WC at all. Never. So was he sent here to attract the huge South African population of Franklin County? Both of them?
And as for this absurd "Michael Jordan of South Africa" nonsense, horsechips. hang could probably be the "Babe Ruth of Botswana" too, but that doesn't mean we should build the Yankees around him.
Of the others, Sanchez was something less than stellar, but he was there to attract the Mexicans. The rest of the guys have been prominent in the league and most are either still playing or recently retired.
The bummer from the leagues point of view was that we drew the first draft pick and chose that kid with the bad haircut from St Louis.
Just to play devils advocate, only these player from the whole list really dramatically improved the teams chances at winning
Granted, that's quite a bit. Slightly over half the list. So slightly over half the trades/aquisitions have improved AEG teams. Frankly I am too swamped at work to do as thorough a job as KK did here, but I would think there would be a similar percentage for HSG teams.
However, there also is some truth to HSG turning their backs on the teams a bit. I would venture Dallas fans believe that they were put in a no-win situation at Dragon Stadium this year. I think that much of HSG's energy that was put into MLS over the past two years has been the whole Dallas stadium situation, so we may have got the short end there. But when you look at how last year the bottom two teams were NY and DC (both AEG teams) and that DC had been miserable for 3 years I think its fair to say this thing goes in cycles.
Over and over again this season Bill and others have stated that our team was put in a position to win, we had/have the talent. The Coach didn't get the job done. HSG rolls the dice hoping possibly for a New England type turnaround in the final few months, and a run to the Cup. It backfired like hell, but it's more the fault of Greg and staff than HSG.
So can we expect the announcement of Andrulis' firing today or tomorrow?
Unlike a lot of guys, rightly or wrongly, I think Jim Smith did all he could to put us in a position to make a run.
Andrulis is a dead mouse on the kitchen floor, but Smith can't fire the guy on his own. Wagner and Clark Hunt have to give him the green light.
I strongly believe that it would have been possible to make that end-of-season run, but with Greg as the coach it was pretty obvious it wasn't going to happen. And I don't blame Jim SMith, I blame HSG.
Someone get joey-info in here to find out the exact date Andrulis will be fired.
I see your point clearly. But if HSG thought Andrulis could make an end of season run, they weren't alone. During Buddle's streak when we were playing some good ball even national writers like Connolly (in a featured piece on MLSnet) pointed out that the Crew might finally be getting it all together now that everyone is healthy. Then it all turned to shite again, quickly. In retrospect they should have pulled the trigger, and I agree that they definately should still do so today or tomorrow. But there was a glimmer of hope for a bit and HSG may have gambled on that and lost. Or you may just be right that they don't care.
As I stated earlier in the morning over on the V-Army mailing list, I believe that if we drop the result on Friday, Greg will hold a press conference on Monday morning, where it will be announced he will not have his contract renewed but will remain as coach for the remainder of the year. This will allow him to exit gracefully, and eliminate the need for flooding inboxes and/or holding a protest the last game of the season. I'd be willing to allow him to exit gracefully if there were indications that his contract was not going to be renewed. I think we owe him a graceful exit, he brought us our first trophy, albeit not the trophy we wanted. The more and more I think about it, this is the scenario that I envision. They did it with Cunty, they didn't want a massive and very public row, and now you can see, quietly, there are signs that Andrulis is being shown directions to the door. I mean has a single soul heard anything about contract negotiations? You would think thirty days before it goes up, we would've heard something. I know if I were working and I hadn't been offered a new contract thirty days till it's expiration, the writing would be on the wall.
Furthermore, how can anyone question whether or not Jim Smith has put enough talent on the field? The players that continue to dog us down, are all Rootes players. Smith is responsible for Martino, Buddle, Busch, Paule, this is a very talented team. The only two gaffes he's made with personnel, albeit big ones, is trading Dunseth and Bonseu. Especially when you consider that Perez left the following year which would've given the roster space and the cash to keep him. Either way, there's no concievable way this team should've missed the playoffs, beit soccer gods anger, injury, call up, or otherwise. The talent is there, the tactics obviously arent.