Well, that's your speculation. But PSV have pretty much been on the same level as AC Milan over the past couple of seasons. They'd win the MFL with their eyes closed (provided the title is decided fairly and not on some crap-shoot playoff format that the wannabe Americans dream-up ) . Even AZ have several Dutch internationals on their squad. Well, the future is uncertain. But until that happens (ie. until Mexican teams stop getting beat like a drum by Argentine and Brasilian clubs), the Mexican league should not be rated as high as you rate it.
A little biased, no? Mexico teams vs Argentine teams in Copa Libertadores... 1998 America 1-1 River Plate America 0-1 River Plate 2000 Atlas 1-1 River Plate Atlas 2-3 River Plate America 1-4 Boca Juniors America 3-1 Boca Juniors 2001 Cruz Azul 0-1 Boca Juniors Cruz Azul 1-0 Boca Juniors Cruz Azul 2-0 Rosario Central Cruz Azul 3-3 Rosario Central Cruz Azul 0-0 River Plate Cruz Azul 3-0 River Plate 2002 Morelia 0-0 Velez Sarsfield Morelia 3-2 Velez Sarsfield America 2-0 Talleres America 1-0 River Plate America 0-0 River Plate America 1-0 Talleres 2004 Santos 0-1 River Plate Santos 2-1 River Plate 2005 Pachuca 3-1 Boca Juniors Pachuca 0-4 Boca Juniors Chivas 0-0 San Lorenzo Chivas 2-1 San Lorenzo Tigres 3-0 Banfield Tigres 2-2 Banfield Chivas 4-0 Boca Juniors Summary: Mexican teams vs Argentine teams 27 Played 27 13 Won 6 8 Tied 8 6 Lost 13
Weren't you not listening? Didn't I not say that Yorke was averaging 15-20 goals per season playing for Aston Villa before his Man U move in 1998? Who did Villa have in their midfield at that point? Yorke average at 25 yrs old?You need to stop taking metamphetamine. McBride at Fulham has NEVER come close to 20 goals per season in his career. When McBride wins prem titles and Champions League medal, and continually scores against the best sides like Yorke did consistently against Chelsea and Arsenal back in his prime then we could put McBride in Yorke's class. As of now, he will always be an average player in the prem. he's on the same level as peter crouch.... nothing special
Since you are a fellow Trini I'll wait until after the match on Saturday to respond to you in depth. I don't want any bad Karma etc. Before you call my claim ignorant and uneducated and irresponsible, please explain why I should have to respond to an empty defense. I said those accounts were in their media. If I am not telling the truth then let them document their defense until then I'll not respond to them. I hope we can celebrate together Saturday.
Ah, you are Trinidadian? Well... in that case, I definitely take it back. But I think that if one accuses another institution of racism, they should at least provide examples of it - you cannot blame the people from that institution for being put-off by it and demanding proof if they're accused of it. Oh well. No way I can throw crap to someone from Trinidad. Good luck Saturday!
That's not the way it works genius. You made the accusations and I challenged you to prove it. Until you do it will remain complete and utter fiction. Your completely skewed sense of logic is like me saying "Elephants the size of pigeons exist, but they're invisible". It's not up to you to disprove the rather ridiculous statement it's up to me to prove it. Your "I said those accounts were in their media" argument holds no water when there's nothing to back it up. It's complete crap and you know it hence your whole squirming and dodging the issue. Now put up or shut up.
I know you aren't listening. McBride and Yorke are about the same age. At this point in their careers Yorke is washed up and McBride is a serviceable EPL forward. Yorke hasn't been good in years and McBride has a decent goals per 90 minutes average over the last 3 years. Just because McBride didn't play in the EPL in his prime doesn't mean Yorke is better. That is about the dumbest thing I have ever heard. Compare McBride to Yorke today and we see that McBride is clearly the better player. Go back 6 years and give McBride the *chance* to do what Yorke was doing and I have no doubt that he would perform. McBride is very strong in the air and many EPL sides would have loved to have someone up top like him. It is a real easy argument for you to say that McBride never scored 20 EPL goals when he was on the downside of his career by the time he got to the EPL. And for the record, McBride's game is not all about scoring goals either.
The only things that have kept Mexican teams from winning the South American trophies have been national team call ups for Confed Cup and ties decided by penalties. And I am not so sure that this year's PSV would win the Mexican championship. Its a good team, but it is not near as good as last year. Again, the Ajax team that almost made the CL semifinal was very, very good, but Ajax isn't near that good anymore. Mexico has had some amazing club sides as well though. Maybe people forget that it was a Mexican side that beat Man U in the original World Club Championship in Brazil. *actually, it appears it was a draw* That Man U side was better than any team in Holland this year. Mexico ends up with very good players that you just never hear of in Europe. Alex Aguinaga was an excellent midfielder and he played on the Necaxa side that finished 3rd in the World Club Championship. He's not from Mexico, but he played in Mexico and in the twilight of his career was able to get his national side Ecuador into the World Cup in 02. It is a shame that some of the very skilled and exciting players like that get no respect because they are not playing in Europe.
Thanks for putting this up. One point to add is that when Mexican teams have played anyone apart from River or Boca, they have 6 wins, 4 draws, and 0 losses. Top to bottom, the Mexican League is clearly a lot stronger.
How is it possible to find accounts in the media if they don't exist? All it is possible to do is try and find accounts that back up your claim. I didn't find any. Perhaps we could use this story... http://uk.sports.yahoo.com/041122/2/7o39.html ... where it says he got abuse from two fans. It doesn't exactly imply a huge problem, nor could I find any quote from Yorke saying it was. I also could find nothing from Yorke (or anyone else) saying he, or anyone else, felt racism in any way had any impact on their desire to leave the game here. Now you seem convinced it is a widespread problem. Please show something which indicates it to be so. Even if you can't prove it, at least give some insight into why you believe it to be so. But you also claimed England invented racism. Clearly, racism existed long before England was even a country, so that is false, but could you at least try to explain why you believed it to be true?
Don't get me wrong, I'm certainly no fan of Argentina. but in that same time frame, how many total Libertadores have Argentines won vs. Mexicans?
Mexico - 0 Argentina, apart from Boca/River - 0 But you've also got to look at what Mexican teams end up in Libertadores. Take this year, for example ... Chivas -- 10th in Mexican League, failed to reach playoffs Group winner & semifinalist in Libertadores, knocked out Boca Tigres -- 9th in Mexican League, lost in first round of playoffs Group winner & quarterfinalist in Libertadores, knocked out defending champs, lost to eventual winners Sao Paulo Pachuca -- 14th in Mexican League, failed to reach playoffs second in Libertadores group (to Boca), lost in second round to Chivas In Mexican League play, these teams were all mediocre, yet two of them did very well in Libertadores, while the other was eliminated by a Mexican opponent.
Oh man, that is just poetic dumbness. Shakespeare and Bukovski on dope couldn't have come up with some better shite than that. You should be proud, you have just managed to set back 10 years of good work in 10 minutes. You have been torn to shreds by fellow posters, so maybe you should re-read what you put and realise you are wrong, you were an idiot, and maybe you need to re-educate yourself on the matter... I love the fact we as a country invented a human concept. lmao.
While I agree that McBride has scored more often at this point, On a technical level Yorke is still the better player, and overall has been far more dominant in his career, and has been more successful period. Your point about " because McBride didn't play in the EPL doesn't mean Yorke is better" is quite foolish. Ask yourself this question. Why didn't McBride get courted by a top European team when he was in his prime? Let me answer for you.....He was not GOOD enough for the premiership or any top league in Europe for that matter. I could easily say that Yorke if he played for Columbus Crew (where MCBride spent most of his life) would've scored 20+ goals per season also but that is hypothetical at this point in time. MCBride and Peter Crouch is the same type of player just that the latter is a bit taller. He is as overrated as they come. He will NEVER be as good as a Yorke was in his prime and that's already been proven. I'll say it again until he plays Champs League Football which he never will as Fulham is crap, and until he scores 15-20 goals this season he will be considered average.
Your are right. I think this article sums it up well. I do have the latest 2004 CRE reports on Instituional racism in the EPL and artlcles on how pervasive racism is in football on all levels in the UK. Do you wonder why they have all of those programs and campaigns over there. Red Card Racism, Kick Racism out of Football etc. Its because they need them. http://www.le.ac.uk/so/css/resources/factsheets/fs6.html I really want to focus on this region and why we should take advantage of the MLS to develop our own players regionally. So for the folks who are interested in this topic and how the MLS has the foresight to address even these issues I'll be happy to continue.
a lot of stuff about the 1970s and 1980s and before. Not much, hardly anything at all in fact, relating to anything since then. Jeez, it also parrots out the old myth about there being a strong link between right-wing organisations and football violence, with the stereotype hooligan being a nazi-saluting skinhead, probably unemployed, doing it through hatred of foreigners. Such thinking has been dismissed for about 20 years now, ever since people actually looked into it properly, rather than trying to find data that fitted in with their preconcieved ideas. I used to know a guy who was a fanzine editor, and said he was regularly sent questionnaires by lazy sociology students, where the questions were invariably asked to try and prove the student's theory, rather than to actually gain an insight. That reports attemp to link the Heysel disaster with racism is a joke. It stated there was 'some' right-wing leaflets found around the ground, but despite being unable to think of any link betwen hating blacks and attacking Italians, it still sees fit to state it as being a contributory factor. I also don't think you understand what institutional racism is. It has nothing at all to do with racist chants from the stands, more to do with the lack of an ethnic mix in the upper echelons of the game. How many black coaches are there in MLS? How many black owners? oh, and why do you believe England invented racism?
You have to be $hitting me - how on earth does that link support the wildly ignorant and hyperbolic claims you've made on here about racism in English football? Lets review shall we..... The link provides no support on this claim whatsoever. Care to clarify how many "fans" were involved in the monkey noises? Every report I've seen restricts the number to one who was given a lifetime ban within a week having been identified by fellow fans who found his behaviour offensive. Which "other players of African decent" have received similar abuse in the EPL? LMAO - you do realise that the link you provided completely disproves this insane statement? Hmm - the link doesn't seem to support this either. How bizarre So..... we're still waiting for all these reports in the English media which support the claims you've made. S'funny how you appear to be struggling to find any
No I posted this link because it addresses every question raised by you apologist. The other links are too volatile. They give examples of the actual racist chants, and discuss the verbal abuse of kids in your leagues. This report is properly foot noted and is even more specific than the articles in the press. This link is your CRE report from last year this should enlighten you on institutional racism in the EPLhttp://www.cre.gov.uk/Default.aspx.locID-0hgnew00n.htm Here's another link to how racisim affects every level of football in the UK http://www.carf.demon.co.uk/feat13.html
Does racism exist in English football? Yes. Is it a huge problem? No. Is there anything at all to back up your claim that Yorke quite English football because of it? Not that I can see. You do realise that the "Terry Dannie of Gillingham" isn't a reference to Gillingham FC, but of a pub league in Gillingham? I'm not sure how he can be facing a life ban, as there is no rule anywhere that said says a player should be banned for life, even if, as he was, sent off five games in a row. The only occasion I've heard of players being banned for life is for assaulting a referee. if he did that, than he has no defence, and no grounds for blaming it on racism. Oh, and you appear to have forgotten to answer, why do you believe England invented racism?
I think we can agree that Renegade is a fool, a proud fool, for not just holding his hands up and admitting he dribbled bullshit. Still a fool though. The most offensive claim I've seen being made on this thread though (Renegade's pales in comparison), is that Yorke in his prime was not as good as the Tranny AKA Drogba. How bloody dare you? You're half right right though. Yorke was not as good as Drogba - he was much much better. He helped form one of the deadliest strike partnerships in Europe. Granted the service was sublime but the interplay between the two was exquisite. Renegade I feel sorry for, but you, you disgust me!
If the best you can do is posting a link to study based on what happened in the 1970's and 1980s then you are in serious trouble mate. ROFL... keep looking.