MAGAs get offended when a liberal calls their orange king names, so they immediately throw out the TDS. Meanwhile, they're the ones who buy his merchandise that's made in China, erecting shrines for him and buying his bible. talk about the mentally ill.
I also saw that. But are you saying there are no gifts from foreign entities donated to presidential libraries? Democrats are wasting their time expending emotional energy on this.
he's admitting its a gift. bribery much? Imagine if this was Biden, Obama or Clinton that got this gift from an Arab country?
And if Congress voted to approve the transfer of the jet, it suddenly wouldn’t be bribery? I guess France was bribing us with the Statue of Liberty.
The national security implications alone are outrageous. That's not even considering the ethical issues or the bribery elements. I hope Iran stuff that plane with plastic explosives and all the tracking equipment they can find.
Not exactly. He can fly it if he wants to. It’s a gift to the man, not the office. Anyone who can explain how this isn’t an emolument is living in an alternate reality. What phase of a Trump scandal is this? Stage 1 is he didn’t do it. Stage 2 is an explanation for why it’s ok. I guess now that we know the library is a smokescreen, the MAGAe are going to move to stage 3…so what if he did.
Was the statue a luxurious mode of transportation that only one President (the sitting one) was going to get to enjoy? I know you don't like to argue in good faith, but surely you can at least why is this is very ethically dubious right?
Air Force One is used by lots of administration officials, congressional members and media. It’s a government plane. Of all the things Trump does, this is not one worth exerting emotional energy over. Sometimes I wonder if people would lead happier lives if they didn’t watch cable news so religiously and react to every news story.
A government plane that's going to be used for only his term lol. This isn't a permanent upgrade, this is a gift to a single administration. Also I'm curious about the end of your first paragraph. What do you think Liberals would be justified in having outrage about? You seem to be implying there's some things, yet you come to his defense on every issue. Do you think I watch cable news and don't just eye roll at some of the shit Trump does lol? This is one of your sadder attempts to dodge the issue and point at Liberals. Have you ever thought to look inwards and wonder if your attempt to defend every thing this stupid man does is more pathetic than Liberals who get mad at him for the things he does?
A gift to a single administration? Or a gift to the US government because Boeing has been significantly delayed in delivering the promised new Air Force One to DoD? You do realize I disagree with Trump on some things right? No politician I’ll agree with 100% of the time, and I didn’t even support him in the 2024 primary. While I’m not a fan of Qatar (and several Gulf states to be fair), this is not something I’m overly concerned about. The national security issues I’m more concerned with are shoring up border security, deterring illegal immigration with demonstrable punitive actions, improving the US industrial base, negotiating with China over its fentanyl products, and projecting power in the Indo-Pacific.
A few MAGA fans are not happy about this, but maybe they have not yet come around the talking points like Germanica has. And to be fair, those that are unhappy are about it being from Qatar who they consider a sponsor of terrorism, if the plane was a bribe from China or Russia, they probably would be ok with that.
If it was a gift to the government as a whole and one administration it wouldn't expire at the end of Trumps term. Like you just keep brushing that fact aside Cool, so tell me what Trump has done that I would be justified in having outrage towards?
I’m sorry, what? You want me to list out things that you should be outraged about? Why do you care what I think? To satisfy your internal rage over why 77 million Americans voted Democrats out of the White House? I think Trump is too beholden to flattery and it’s his vanity that has led him to make some questionable personnel decisions. I loved the Rubio and Bondi picks however and agreed with his decision to keep various Biden era military personnel in charge, so like with anything, it’s not a simplistic good/bad binary opinion.
Lol I'll take it since you moved on from the plane topic you now understand how disingenuous it was to frame this plane as simply a "gift to the government" "Of all the things Trump does, this is not one worth exerting emotional energy over." was a statement you decided to bring up on your own. I'm just curious what you feel we should be expending energy on. Otherwise this is a bullshit empty statement meant to just deflect from a scandal (gasp, you guys would never). In response I've gotten a very muted and vague line about not liking some of his appointments and 2 paragraphs about how awesome he is. See I think you're smart enough to look at the true diehard red hat wearing, election denying, Qanon believing Trump cultists and know that you don't want to be labeled as being part of that group. You'll make statements like "look, I don't love everything Trump does" in order to give yourself some plausible deniability. Yet when the consequences of electing a morally bankrupt charlatan start to rear their ugly head, you'll quickly jump to defense of everything he does
You want to keep discussing the plane? I can keep discussing the plane. I personally tend not to think it overly important in the grand scheme of things, but I'll oblige if it means that much to you. Again, expend emotional energy on whatever you want, it doesn't matter to me either way, as I was simply pointing out how easily Dems get "look, squirrel'd" by Trump. If you disagree with his trade or immigration policy, that's *actually* worth expending emotional energy over. I think the cultist aspect of a lot of Trump support is offputting and I'm concerned about the turn the Republican party has taken since Trump came about. But I do appreciate how he's turned many blue collar Americans into registered R's. And while I'm certainly not one of the bumper sticker hat-wearing diehards, I do enjoy seeing how much the red hats trigger liberals. Remember the unhinged liberal lady on the NY subway who fell flat on her face after trying to pull the kid's hat off and chasing him? So entertaining and a good caricature of most of the liberals on this forum. I'm hoping post-Trump some of the cultist behavior subsides, and the party can get back into the suburbs a bit, while continuing to take advantage of bleeding support for Dems among various minority groups. You've seen this with more moderates like Glenn Youngkin and Brian Kemp and nominating Mike Rogers in Michigan, so it's certainly possible.
Yes I'd like to keep talking about the plane and why you think it's okay. I don't give a shit about where you rank it in terms of importance, I'm asking if you think that's a normal and ethical thing for a president to do? You don't think there's been outrage expended on Trump's immigration and Trade Policy? I would argue those have been the top 2 through 100+ days So does corruption just not matter to you at all? If Trump came out and said "yeah I'm gonna take a free jet in exchange for some political favors" it would in theory not matter much in the grand scheme of things. So is it okay? Is there a red line anywhere for you? Or is it always going to be "Trump can do what he wants if he's better for the economy and immigration"? So do you think there's any potential for that cult like behavior to turn into something more nefarious and authoritarian? Also you act as if you're incredibly gifted at seeing the big picture and not focusing on anecdotes yet are willing to laugh off the cult like behavior because a woman fell on her face. where does "owning the libs" rank among your most important political issues facing America? What if that behavior doesn't subside post Trump?
I'm not overly bothered by the plane because it's supposed to be a temporary holdover until Boeing delivers the new Air Force One. As far the ethics of it, of course it's a bit of a grey area. We certainly shouldn't be doing any favors for Qatar that jeopardize our national interest. Looking towards the future, no I do not think most of the MAGA support is going to turn into something nefarious or authoritarian. I know a lot of these people personally and they are overwhelmingly kind hearted, well meaning people. Of course you'll vehemently disagree, but I can only speak from personal experience. Now as a general principle, I don't like cult like behavior because it inherently has the potential to spiral, but I don't see that here. Could I be wrong? Maybe. Steve Bannon? Absolutely. But if it's Vance or Kemp or Rubio or Stefanik (my pick) or whomever taking over, I just don't see it.
It’s yet another manifestation of the one crucial thing Trump ALWAYS does, which is to ignore the Constitution. That’s something that conservatives used to claim to care about. Now we know it’s bullshit (I mean we knew anyway, but now it’s even more obvious). And I would bet very few people here pay any attention to cable news.
A "temporary holdover" from a foreign government that expires at the end of his term. That seems pretty dark grey Do you think there should be penalties for putting national interests in jeopardy for a plane? Just hypothetically, or would it still not matter in the grand scheme of things? Have you asked these kind-hearted well meaning people how they feel about gay people, immigrants, or Muslims? Im sure if I jumped back in time to 1950s Alabama I'd encounter plenty of sweet and friendly people who would hold the door open for me at the store, wave to me on the street, and invite me to their barbecues, but if I ask them their thoughts about Martin Luther King or how'd they feel about their child sharing a class room with a black student, things will get dark pretty quickly. You act as if I work at UC Berkley lol and don't encounter Trump supporters daily. The janitor at my work is one of the friendliest and most upbeat people you'll ever meet, but I've also overheard him ranting about toys and modern movies turning our kids gay when he's around coworkers he feels comfortable speaking freely around.
Well that's a very broad hypothetical, and I'm not sure what kind of penalties you have in mind. What national interests were compromised? Who authorized it? Racism and anti-LGBTQ sentiment will always exist in parts (it's hard to eradicate that altogether), but you expect me to answer as if it is a monolithic group, that is every diehard MAGA hates gay people, immigrants, and Muslims. What about the gay people, immigrants, and Muslims who support Trump? And while I don't wear a red hat, I certainly don't hate any of those groups. But it's easier for the human brain to process a worldview through a simplistic binary equation whereby "this is good", "this is bad", "all are good", "all are bad". But while that's easier, that's lazy. "If you wear a red hat and support Trump, you are automatically a racist" is pure laziness and only serves to satisfy one's rage for a politician and group of people they hate. I get along fine with Democrats in my workplace, I don't think they are bad people. I have family members who are Democrats, and I love them dearly. Some people act like politics is the be and end all of whether you can be friendly to another person or not. That is a sad existence.
A gift which reverts to the person when he leaves office. He’s a fascist. Fascists can’t be reasoned with. They must be metaphorically, and occasionally literally, punched in the face. You’re talking to an enemy, yes, an enemy, of democracy and freedom and modernity. It’s futile.
He does not. He regurgitates what the hive mind tells him to regurgitate. Why do you think he thinks we all watch cable news?