The "Thoughts That Don't Require Their Own Thread" Thread VI

At least you got to Frozen Four and have won Hockey East in last 2 decades

 

That's true, but it's a different discussion. This was about whether the management was allowed to spend more money. I believe they are, but haven't been able to close an appropriate deal.

I believe they do it, when they have done it, to maintain the flexibility to make moves during the season. I think if they find someone they think will make an impact, they'll add them, but otherwise they aren't going to fill a roster spot with someone they don't think has a future with the team.

That's where MLS and the NFL rule differences do make a difference. The NFL is at the extreme end of pro sports with the ease and ability to dump players. And Belichick takes advantage of those rules more than anyone (ask Marquise Cole, Austin Collie or Kyle Arrington!). The extreme number of long-term and season ending injuries in the NFL plays a role also. And, NFL teams actually use virtually every player on the active roster in almost every game. That's much, much different from MLS, where just about every team will have players who never touch the field all season.

 

What about Steve Nicol's infamous list of "20 South Americans" he wanted, and every single one of them was turned down? The only thing I can think of is one of two things: They told him "go find some players," without having much of an idea of what a major player would cost, and then they balked at the list, or, it was a total, miserable disconnect where they had a certain price point in mind, and Nicol had a higher level in mind, but that was never communicated. Either way, it must have been an incredibly frustrating experience.

At the end of the day, nothing happened. If you've got 20 "possibilities" shouldn't you close the deal on one of them?

Hey, Beanpot finals this year, baby!

 

It is actually not with ease NFL players are dropped. Everytime a NFL player is dropped after week 1 their salaries are on the cap and dead money appears. And Kyle Arrington has never been released once by the New England Patriots.

Say the Pats wanted to cut/trade Tom Brady anytime this season. His current cap number is 14.8M if they drop him it becomes 32.8M. A lot of NFL players get cut but their signing bonus and and guaranteed salary become right on the cap. Can some players be cut with ease sure, but a lot of players have bonuses that prevent them from being released or traded.

Pats have a $7.5 million dollar cap hit for the man in jail.

 

No, that was James Busch Orthwein.

 

I have a problem with leaving roster spots or cap space after the deadlines. This isn't the NFL where you can carry un-used cap space to the next year to get an adjusted cap. Even it is a player who can just be practice body to help save veterans in terms of energy and rest is a decent signing and cap use in my book.

 

Can I direct you guys to BigAmateurIceHockey.com?

 

A few years ago it was understandable that people would focus on the permission side of "they can spend..." But all those arguments are fatiguing at this point. Let's assume you and all those others you cite are right and they can (as in: have permission) sign big DPs or even spend in other ways. I'd say the multi-year evidence is that the CAN'T do it. In this case can't equals unable, incapable. What good is, "they may spend," if either their criteria are so constrained there are only a handful of candidates on the planet (gainfully employed elsewhere) or some other, unknown constraint makes them incapable?

Sadly, I'm going to be buried in "examples" that largely prove my point. Bengston, SJ and Caraglio, for instance, are not shining examples of FO big-spending capability in my book.

 

I think you'll have to admit that after Twellman went down, Raslton retired et al the Rev roster became one of the weakest in MLS. If the core roster isn't solid bringing in a DP doesn't do much and is a waste of money. Thats why I'm not surprised the Revs have not pulled the trigger on any big signings in the past few years and have only nibbled a bit with the names you mention.

Over the past two years Heaps has put together a young, exciting core and hopefully the new additions he's cherry picked in the draft and low cost "professionals" he's unearthed from elsewhere will make the 2014 a strong balanced base upon which to add game changing level talent. Heaps has been very clear what he's looking to sign a forward and DMF both of which are likely to be high cost talent and may be DP(s).

I know its getting closer and closer to opening day and we have yet to hear anything about candidates for either position. Does Burns have reasonable confidence they have found what Heaps is looking for and are confident they can be signed ????? TBD. If they don't I will loudly declare this offseason rebooting a failure and renew my campaign to get rid of Blooter Burns.

 

STOP
I agreed up to there. The rest I can't support because it is just more of a multi-year excuse making that has gone on. If I were to agree with you I just support perpetuating the myth (unproven certitude?) that they are allowed to spend. We'll never know if they can spend money if we (and more importantly they) always have an excuse for them not to do it. I think an argument could be made that the period you describe was exactly when they needed to spend.

Well, there's plenty of wiggle room there but I'm betting on "get rid of Blooter." BTW, I'm not insisting on a DP but the people brought in have not knocked me off my seat.

 

Can't be true because we all know the Krafts are cheap and don't care about soccer

 

The patriots would also play on said turf.

 

The Patriots could care less. They won't even notice that Kraft put in a new improved turf field. In fact Bill B would rather play in a mud bog that we had before they put in Turf. This change in the truf is happen for soccer and nothing else.

 

100% not true. Patriots players have commented on how terrible a surface it is. The NFL was pissed at how during rain games this year the field did not drain properly. In fact I heard about the change on a Patriots message board 2 months ago. I am 100% sure the change is NFL related. Gillette was rated one of the worst fields by the nflpa.

 

I can assure you that the players, especially running backs, receiver and corners, hated the old turf.

 

What is the current pulse in RevsNation if they had not rented Agudelo last season? That rental was known to be a rental from minute one. That should have been used to "buy time" for the real signing to join the young core for a few seasons. It was not. This team refuses to look forward from a personnel perspective regarding building and sustaining a roster.

If the Revs upgrade the turf it might be the best this season and next season. Today's best turf is tomorrow's worst turf. In the end it is turf. It will, at best, have a limited time period of acceptability and then will be criticized. Turf is a band aid that can be reapplied every few years, but will only succeed in postponing what everybody knows is the right solution.

Final thought before I post a picture of Twellman I saw on a youth goal at Dick's Sporting Goods today in Apex, NC, is that I believe that the Revs might think they are making competitive offers to internationals. The truth is that the Revs just have no clue. Like the gawky teenager asking out the prom queen and being shocked when she says no. I was this close to dating the prom queen, but instead I decided to stay with my long distance girl friend from the Niagra Falls area. They just have no idea about the the greater soccer world and their current place in it. They need to add some people to the staff who do and who know how things work in the greater soccer universe. Belicheck knows the football universe inside and out. There is nobody in the Revs organization who even understands youth soccer in MA, much less professional soccer around the globe.

 

It's not the players with large bonuses and guaranteed contracts that generally get cut, but there are certainly enough that don't to give the teams great flexibility in changing their roster during the season.

I could be wrong, but I seem to remember Arrington being one of those on the roster bubble in past years, getting cut and re-signed seemingly on a weekly basis. Maybe I'm thinking of someone else, but Belichick always has guys like that.

I can see the logic in that, but I don't think Nicol or Heaps agree.

For one thing, with minimum salaries so low, I don't think they want to encourage players who they think don't have a realistic opportunity to "make it". And, I think they don't relish the idea of signing players to be placeholders, just to be cut when they find someone better. Some coaches won't give a crap, but I think it's out of respect for the players and the sacrifices they must make to be on the back end of MLS rosters. Cutting a marginal player in mid-season leaves a kid with very few options for hooking on with someone else, going back to school or whatever.

I had a friend who tried out for the Revs as well as Minnesota and a couple of other teams. It was pretty clear that getting into training camp was critical for having a chance to make the team. Getting cut at the end of camp or during the season really limits their options. I think Nicol was always aware of this (because he was willing to release marginal players who had better prospects elsewhere; i.e., Luke Vercollone).

I don't generally believe in absolutes, but I'd agree that they "have a lot of trouble doing it".

And, I think Bengtson supports that. They signed a valuable player - they accomplished that. And, they also did so with Badilla. The failure was/has been in incorporating them and getting the best out of them.

I still think Bengtson is (and will be) a goal-scorer. The challenge is getting him to do that here.

Ah, the old theory that they're a bunch of idiots and incompetents. And that guy Nicol didn't know anything about the soccer world.

Mike Burns has been in a position of full authority over personnel for 28 months now. In that time span, the team has gone from a moribund position to one that most of MLS sees as a young, exciting, up and coming team. He gets a ton of criticism, but I think they have been doing a great job in remaking/rebuilding the team in that time span.

 

No, Mike Burns is not an idiot, but he is not a genius, either. If the Revs let him go today, how many MLS teams would be clamoring for his services?

The Revs are young and exciting, but not up and coming. They are the same as last year at defense and midfield, and weaker at GK and striker. They upset their captain and most important player by breaking promises they made to him. If they go into the season with the players they have now, I predict they won't make the playoffs.

 

Marketing, communications, whatever you want to call it.....it's just not clicking...

1. Gillette Stadium ‏@GilletteStadium Feb 7
   You know the drill, give us a #FF to enter to win the fan pack of your choice! #pats #revs #summerconcerts
   
   
   
2. Fran Harrington ‏@franharrington 3m
   @GilletteStadium yo, that’s #NEREVS not #REVS

 

The person doing the account doesn't even have the Patriots hash tag right either

 

It's not absolute. Some fundamental change can always take place. They have not ventured into that territory often and, as you cite, they haven't suceeded with incorporation. And you are right, just signing isn't enough. So how do they learn to suceed? Certainly not by limiting themselves to journeymen trialists.

 

If Mike Burns repeated his 2012-2013 offseason again this year, other teams would start talking about him as a man to consider in their futures. There are always changes (draft, exits) but 2013-2014 is starting to look more or less like an offseason where he took a mental vacation outside the draft. That's not to say he did take a vacation but just that the results aren't there (yet) this year.