The Steroids Thread

Discussion in 'Baseball' started by 655321, Sep 28, 2004.

  1. soccernutter

    soccernutter Moderator
    Staff Member

    Tottenham Hotspur
    Aug 22, 2001
    Near the mountains.
    Club:
    Tottenham Hotspur FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Which is probably the main part of the hype of the media.
     
  2. ProfZodiac

    ProfZodiac Moderator
    Staff Member

    Jan 17, 2003
    Boston, MA
    Club:
    New England Revolution
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    That's my estimate. Based on those stats I showed you. Maybe I'm wrong, and he started them later. Sue me. Doesn't really matter anyway.

    Caminiti was a fraud, too. As bad as it's going to sound, the way he died was apt, given his steroid problems.
     
  3. ProfZodiac

    ProfZodiac Moderator
    Staff Member

    Jan 17, 2003
    Boston, MA
    Club:
    New England Revolution
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    He didn't escape it. He was vilified for the androstenedione (sp?) back when he took the record from Maris. He just got away with it because there wasn't a big scandal at the same time.
     
  4. ProfZodiac

    ProfZodiac Moderator
    Staff Member

    Jan 17, 2003
    Boston, MA
    Club:
    New England Revolution
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Hell it can turn a groundout into a shot up the middle.
     
  5. JMMUSA8

    JMMUSA8 New Member

    Nov 3, 2001
    Webster
    Club:
    New England Revolution
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I don't understand that if Bonds and Giambi both used steroids, how come Bonds is the same size and is putting up the same stats and Giambi is showing the true effects of steroids. If Bonds knew he was using steroids and knew they would be after him, he would stop using them (which is Giambi did). You could tell Giambi was using roids because you could see it in his eyes. He was an animal. He was scary. Now he's calm, and is smaller, and is sick. The same can't be said about Bonds. He was never a fiery character, his behavior never changed, he's the same size (there is such a thing as your metabolism slowing down and it is very possible he used legal substances to help build muscle) and he doesn't have any effects of using steroids. I'm sorry guys but I don't think he used steroids to the extent that Giambi did. Giambi knew, I don't think Bonds knew.
     
  6. SoccerScout

    SoccerScout Member

    Jan 3, 2001
    New Jersey, USA
    Club:
    Internacional Porto Alegre
    The Barry Bond believers will one day feel as stupid as the Pete Rose believers when Bonds finally decides its best to tell the truth.

     
  7. SoccerScout

    SoccerScout Member

    Jan 3, 2001
    New Jersey, USA
    Club:
    Internacional Porto Alegre

    Its amazing, the change in BONDS face from 98 to 99 is clearly evident (puffy, bloated) and so is the HR numbers. Suddendly he hit almost 50HRS.

    Again if you think Bonds is clean, you are very naive. I think its safe to say that Bonds hard roid usage started in 99.
     
  8. SoccerScout

    SoccerScout Member

    Jan 3, 2001
    New Jersey, USA
    Club:
    Internacional Porto Alegre
    Oh really?


    Bonds 1998
    [​IMG]

    Bonds 1999
    [​IMG]
     
  9. Metros#1

    Metros#1 New Member

    May 14, 2001
    NJ
    You cannot be serious. Without drugs Bonds was far from the top two or three hitters of all time. If those warning track fly balls did not turn into homers, he can be pitched to. Just think about the BA, OBP and power numbers of Bonds while he was in his prime (before 35). They were good but far from the best of all time.
     
  10. Metros#1

    Metros#1 New Member

    May 14, 2001
    NJ
    His arrogance was only part of it. The biggest thing was he’s been acting as if he was wrongly persecuted while he's indeed cheating the whole time. Many cheaters lied before they got caught, but he did it with such self-righteous aplomb, once it was exposed as fraud, it really rubs people the wrong way.

    In other words, he's the one to blame not only because he did cheat but also because of his attitude.
     
  11. JMMUSA8

    JMMUSA8 New Member

    Nov 3, 2001
    Webster
    Club:
    New England Revolution
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    and 2004
    [​IMG]

    If he stopped using steroids then it hasn't shown.
     
  12. hangthadj

    hangthadj Member+

    A.S. Roma
    Mar 27, 2001
    Zone 14
    Club:
    Columbus Crew

    The admission was to using a cream in 2003. Not 98. 99, or 04.

    But regardless, you can make a more powerful argument than posting pictures 6 years apart. People can get heavier as they get older and/or work out. It's actually quite common.
     
  13. otterulz

    otterulz Member

    Arsenal, Atleti
    South Korea
    Jun 20, 2002
    LIC, NY
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Very true. Sure there's a big difference in visible size, but hard work and training could bring results like that. At least I'd imagine.

    How come no one ever talks about a guy like Bret Boone? If I remember correctly, he was scrawny and nothing more than a role player batting near the bottom of the order. Then one season he comes in looking incredibly fit and having an unbelievable year with Seattle in 2001. Yeah, it could've been hard work and training as well. But does anyone ever think "Oh, he must be on steroids" when it comes to him?
     
  14. fiddlestick

    fiddlestick New Member

    Jul 17, 2001
    The 4 8 0
    His name has been bandied about a bunch too.
     
  15. fiddlestick

    fiddlestick New Member

    Jul 17, 2001
    The 4 8 0
    http://www.latimes.com/sports/baseb...441.story?coll=la-headlines-sports-mlb-dodger


    Steve Garvey pontificating on cheating. Ironic. And funny.
     
  16. 655321

    655321 New Member

    Jul 21, 2002
    The Mission, SF
    Look, what we know (yea, yea, "so far") is that Bonds, a man who is dedicated to his personal fitness (ask anyone who's been a Giant how often this guy is in the gym and about his strict dieting) has admitted that he "unknowlingly applied a cream" for a season or so (perhaps less) and...that's it. Bonds increase in size isn't tremendously larger than someone who dedicates their life to fitness and weight training, remember we're going on nearly ten years now of Bonds size increase, and it's not as if he's walking around in a roid rage with veins popping out of his neck. The man is waaay more layed back than he's ever been in his life. All this, and he's never had the constant freak injuries that long-term steroid use causes, nor the sudden decrease in size that occurs when you stop using steroids.

    While it's clear that something is amiss, I think this knee-jerking and "complete fraud", "lifelong cheat" allegations is a bit sudden and unfair.
     
  17. Metros#1

    Metros#1 New Member

    May 14, 2001
    NJ
    Look, do you agree it’s tougher and tougher for Bonds apologists like you to proclaim his innocence?

    Now why is that? If Bonds has been truthful to public all along, how come everything becoming public (including his own testimony) inevitably suggest otherwise. Is it because despite all his efforts to conceal and deceive, the truth would come out (or leak out), not all at once but slowly and eventually?

    Keep your head in the sand all you want, but eventually ALL the truth would come out, and it will not be pretty for Bonds.


    P.S. 1999 - 2004 are 5 years, not 10.
     
  18. Val1

    Val1 Member+

    Arsenal
    Mar 12, 2004
    MD's Eastern Shore
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    I met Barry Bonds way back when he was with the Pirates, and I'll paraphrase Michael Wilbon on The Washington Post who can say this better than I, but Bonds is one of the most narcissicistic or people. He knows exactly what he eats, how many calories, grams of fat, he can tell you what he's lifting, his exact heart rate, etc, etc, etc. This bit about not knowing what cream he put on does not fit with the Barry who has worked so hard in his life. I think he's lying about that. And if he's lying here, he's probably lying about the rest.

    And to label my bias, I am a Pirates fan. We had three great years, couldn't get past Atlanta, and Bonds, Bonilla and Drabek all left, for free. I've hated all three ever since, but only Bonds has any success since leaving, so my bitterness for him is greater.
     
  19. soccernutter

    soccernutter Moderator
    Staff Member

    Tottenham Hotspur
    Aug 22, 2001
    Near the mountains.
    Club:
    Tottenham Hotspur FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    So you think that those of us who think Bonds is using sterioid thinks that just because of the steroids, Bonds has gotten bigger? So, in essence, if I sit here on BS all day and take steroids, I could look just like Bonds? What the hell am I waiting for? :rolleyes:


    I agree with that. Personally, I don't think he started to use steroids in ernest until sometime in the mid 90s. Also, anybody got his injury stats from the last 10 years or so? Wasn't Bonds getting injured on a regular basis, and then, starting about 4 years ago, he has not had a major injury?

    This is pretty much what Shef said in that article in SI.
     
  20. ThreeApples

    ThreeApples Member+

    Jul 28, 1999
    Smurf Village
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    He's only been on the disabled list twice in his career. I think the only time with the Giants was in 1999 when he had elbow and wrist problems cause by being hit by pitches. After that he started wearing that arm guard.

    One reason I can lean toward believing Bonds' story about being duped into using that cream is that it pretty much matches Sheffield's story. Both say they were told it was some kind of balm to soothe muscle and joint pain. And given that they aren't friends anymore and that Bonds told his story in a secret proceeding months before Sheffield went public, I doubt they conspired to make their stories match.

    Also, Bonds' story about the "flaxseed oil" matches what Kelli White has said. She's the sprinter who had to reliquish her world championship medals and is serving a 2-year international ban. She says that Victor Conte gave her the clear stuff and told her it was flaxseed oil, and then later on after she had been using it, she was informed that it was a steroid.
     
  21. fiddlestick

    fiddlestick New Member

    Jul 17, 2001
    The 4 8 0
    Wow. I can't imagine that separate people involved in a steroid ring would all give the same answer that they didn't know what it was they were taking.
     
  22. DoctorJones24

    DoctorJones24 Member

    Aug 26, 1999
    OH
    Bonds apologists are beginning to remind me of those idiot families that parade outside the courtroom with their kids when Michael Jackson is being interrogated for child moletstation.
     
  23. 655321

    655321 New Member

    Jul 21, 2002
    The Mission, SF
    :rolleyes:

    I've responded to your petty hatred already. Find something else to worry about...
     
  24. Matt in the Hat

    Matt in the Hat Moderator
    Staff Member

    Sep 21, 2002
    Brooklyn
    Club:
    New York Red Bulls
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Here is my sick and twisted dream about Bonds. He steps up an cracks a 2-2 fastball into McCovey cove for his 755 home run. Unknown to him at the time he was served with federal narcotics charges with arrest instructions labled "as soon as possible". He rounds first and second to thunderous applause and scattered boos (mostly the Aaron family) as he turns for home, 6 ATF agents go Rodney King on his ass, breaking his right arm in two places and effectively ending his career. He is hauled away with the confidence that he has at least tied the record and announces his retirement from baseball at his arrainment. Five years later, baseball comissioner George W Bush declares that Bonds' final home run is invalid since he did not run all of the bases. Following the news, Bonds goes on a drug bindge that would make Darryl Strawberry blush. He takes his millions, builds a rocket, and leaves the planet.

    The End.

    My beef now with Bonds and actually more with MLB is that I am more than convinced that Darryl Strawberry would have broken Aaron's record by now if he had not been busted for Coke, you know the drug that DOESN'T effect the output of your game.

    I also think that because of Shefield and Giambi, the Yankees should just have to close shop and give every other team their WS trophies. I want 2000.
     
  25. fiddlestick

    fiddlestick New Member

    Jul 17, 2001
    The 4 8 0

    You'd have a better shot if either of those guys played for them then.
     

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