The Refried Presidency: Trump Hateful Machine/Fossil Fuel Boogaloo or Whatever Continuation

Discussion in 'Politics & Current Events' started by argentine soccer fan, May 6, 2025.

  1. roadkit

    roadkit Greetings from the Fringe of Obscurity

    Club: San Diego FC
    Jul 2, 2003
    Fornax Cluster
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    This is so predictable from you.

    She just needs to be im peached and removed form office along with hegseth. They are so incompetent.
     
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  2. Potowmack

    Potowmack Member+

    Apr 2, 2010
    Washington, DC
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    The choices here are (a) she's lying, or (b) she's incompetent and unprepared.

    You'd think a Press Secretary would be good at remembering names and faces.
     
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  3. Dr. Wankler

    Dr. Wankler Member+

    May 2, 2001
    The Electric City
    Club:
    Chicago Fire
    I don't think it's a choice. It's pretty obviously both (a) and (b).
     
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  4. yossarian

    yossarian Moderator
    Staff Member

    Jun 16, 1999
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Yes, the emergency petition will go to the Justice assigned to that circuit, who can choose to handle (deny) the petition unilaterally. But if they do (I'm pretty sure this is right) the petitioner can renew the petition and submit it to another justice who can do the same or recommend it be reviewed by the whole Court. The ability to of the petitioner to continue to renew the petition until a majority denies it is why the first Justice will usually just recommend en banc review for controversial issues. IOW, it's going to happen anway. The stuff handled unilaterally and that's that is usually like requests for extensions of time to file, etc., etc.
     
  5. Germerica

    Germerica Member+

    May 2, 2012
    SoCal burbs
    Club:
    Los Angeles
    Even we are to assume she knew who he was, it’s obvious his sole intent was to show up and be disruptive. So it’s hard to feel sorry for him. He got a nice viral clip out of it, which is what he wanted.
     
  6. Pittsburgh Ref

    Pittsburgh Ref Member+

    Oct 7, 2014
    da 'Burgh
    #1956 Pittsburgh Ref, Jun 13, 2025
    Last edited: Jun 13, 2025
    I feel like there's an Ennio Morricone theme playing here. Maybe it's just me.

    [​IMG]
     
  7. diablodelsol

    diablodelsol Member+

    Jan 10, 2001
    New Jersey
    Got it. Follow up….if Kagan doesn’t recommend and instead denies…but doesn’t stay her denial for the inevitable what is the affect on the parties. If there is no longer an active stay pending appeal (assuming the 9th would stay the implementation of their denial to give DOJ the chance to take their shot with SCOTUS). Trying to understand the practical affect of her denying.
     
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  8. taosjohn

    taosjohn Member+

    Dec 23, 2004
    taos,nm
    I got that once here a few months back-- but it was just some kind of a glitch, and it went away when I logged off and back on. I just figured the Muskpuppies had screwed up the internet again.
     
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  9. yossarian

    yossarian Moderator
    Staff Member

    Jun 16, 1999
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    If I understand your question (and correct me if I don't), if Kagan denies DOJ's request to stay the district court, then the district court's order (the TRO) goes into effect at noon PST, IIRC, and the guard would be returned to the control of the Governor. But DOJ can keep asking other Justices and if they decided to stay the TRO pending a decision on the merits, the current status quo (fed control) would remain in place.
     
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  10. soccernutter

    soccernutter Moderator
    Staff Member

    Tottenham Hotspur
    Aug 22, 2001
    Near the mountains.
    Club:
    Tottenham Hotspur FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Can the DOJ pick which Justice after Kagan?
     
  11. diablodelsol

    diablodelsol Member+

    Jan 10, 2001
    New Jersey
    Kind of yes. Except the minute the district court ruling goes into affect…and Gavin immediately issues orders to the NG to send everyone home…fed control won’t be the status quo by the time the shopped justice issues the tro. The horse would be through the gate at that point,
     
  12. soccernutter

    soccernutter Moderator
    Staff Member

    Tottenham Hotspur
    Aug 22, 2001
    Near the mountains.
    Club:
    Tottenham Hotspur FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    This is a dangerous argument, and one we had in 2016 with the nuclear Football.
    You are saying that the military should be making a judgement on the legality of an action. But in this case, we have Trump saying one thing, and Newsom contradicting. And you are saying that the military must decide what is the law here. That is a very dangerous precedent if military (even if it is the National Guard in this case) does make the decision.
     
  13. soccernutter

    soccernutter Moderator
    Staff Member

    Tottenham Hotspur
    Aug 22, 2001
    Near the mountains.
    Club:
    Tottenham Hotspur FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Might rain on Trump's parade tomorrow. Might even thunder and lightening, which will get it postponed or cancelled.
     
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  14. yossarian

    yossarian Moderator
    Staff Member

    Jun 16, 1999
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    My understanding is yes.
     
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  15. diablodelsol

    diablodelsol Member+

    Jan 10, 2001
    New Jersey
    #1965 diablodelsol, Jun 13, 2025
    Last edited: Jun 13, 2025
    Ok. Let’s follow your logic.

    Trump/Hegseth order the marines or the national guard to open up on the protesters with mounted 50 cal machine guns. By this logic….it is dangerous for officers within the chain of command to refuse to obey that order….but rather…we have to have the people down range of the 50 cal call a time out….hope the military honors time outs….run to court…get a court to declare the order illegal and issue a TRO….call time in and tell the commanding officer of the guys on the trigger…excuse me sir….but you need to read this…judge what’s his name just clarified that cutting us to pieces with 50 caliber bullets is actually illegal.

    Oh….and what happens if the judge automatically stays that ruling pending appeal. Do those down range have to call time out again? After each round of appeal? And if we can’t rely on our military officers to make judgement calls about the legality of orders….can we at least count on them to honor the rules of time outs? Or is that a separate issue that needs to be adjudicated?

    And finally…given this process….exactly what is the point of having them swear an oath to the constitution and the laws of this country? Would seem simpler if the oath merely stated “I do solemnly swear that I will follow every order given to me, without thought, until federal judge tells me to stop following it.”

    Edit: and one more thing…if we really don’t want officers to make that determination in their own….the military actually has military lawyers who can advise those officers on the legality of an order…or the person giving it is legally authorized to do so. It took me 10 seconds to find the number for the California Military Department of the Staff Judge Advocate. They can be reached at 916-854-3505. They’re open Monday through Friday 8-5pm….though I imagine someone might pick up the phone after hours for an inquiry from the Commandant.
     
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  16. Pittsburgh Ref

    Pittsburgh Ref Member+

    Oct 7, 2014
    da 'Burgh
    I like heroes who don't get rained out
     
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  17. soccernutter

    soccernutter Moderator
    Staff Member

    Tottenham Hotspur
    Aug 22, 2001
    Near the mountains.
    Club:
    Tottenham Hotspur FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    You are going extreme here. And, as I understand, there are clear rules for engagement that the military has to follow, President or governor instructions aside. This bit from Lawfare gets into it a bit, granted it is mostly mostly looking at it from the position of reasons for a civilian rule.
    What about something like the National Guard being told not go into a certain neighborhood or area when otherwise deployed in that geographic area? Such as in Miami, where Desantis tells the NG not to go into Little Haiti when on hurricane cleanup, despite the clear need.
    Or a grey area. What if Trump says to somebody like Pritzker "The National Guard would be great" in helping suppress some kind of civil unrest in Chicago. Pritzker says, "I don't think they necessary at this time." Did Trump consult with Pritzker about the National Guard? Did Pritzker actually turn down the suggestion? What if Trump deploys the National Guard 3 or 4 days after that phone call (it being the only phone call)?

    Of course, let's flip this. What if there is a group in Washington state that is in open defiance of Washington state laws, and says they will only follow directives from Trump. What if Ferguson deploys the National Guard and orders them to shoot that defiant group despite no other obvious threat other than rock throwing. Is that acceptable? And then, what happens if Hegseth deploys Marines to contain the National Guard?
     
  18. Dr. Wankler

    Dr. Wankler Member+

    May 2, 2001
    The Electric City
    Club:
    Chicago Fire
    Won't happen.

    But if it does, expect massive firings at NOAA.
     
  19. soccernutter

    soccernutter Moderator
    Staff Member

    Tottenham Hotspur
    Aug 22, 2001
    Near the mountains.
    Club:
    Tottenham Hotspur FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    And if it does [insert inappropriate antisemitic joke here]
     
  20. Potowmack

    Potowmack Member+

    Apr 2, 2010
    Washington, DC
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    My understanding is that, under the Uniform Code of Military Justice, there are some orders that would be illegal for anyone in the chain of command, from a Lieutenant fresh out of training up to the President, to give. I'm hopeful that an order to massacre unarmed protestors would not be followed, if for no other reason than that the Lieutenant or Sargent on the ground doesn't want to face murder charges.

    Whether the National Guard was properly called up by the President is a different, and more complex, legal question that probably can't be determined by the soldiers on the ground. So long as they're only asked to follow otherwise legal orders during their current deployment, there's nothing wrong with them continuing to do what they're doing.
     
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  21. Val1

    Val1 Moderator
    Staff Member

    Arsenal
    Mar 12, 2004
    MD's Eastern Shore
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    If you're responding to our DEI poster, you have to remember that MAGAts are Duning Kruger writ large. This guy thinks you are as stupid and unserious as he is.

    Oh my... I'm going to have go back and start reading this guy's drivel. It has been so very nice to just not see it, but it looks like I'm going to become a mod here. That downside looms a little larger today...
     
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  22. song219

    song219 BigSoccer Supporter

    Apr 5, 2004
    La Norte
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    Vanuatu
    #1972 song219, Jun 13, 2025
    Last edited: Jun 13, 2025
    The Soccer in the USA mods get sent sweet SUM cash for squelching pro/rel talk but there are no benefits for modding here.
     
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  23. yossarian

    yossarian Moderator
    Staff Member

    Jun 16, 1999
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Welcome stupidface!
    :D
     
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  24. Quakes05

    Quakes05 Member+

    Oct 1, 2005
    birthplace of MLS
    thanks in advance for your service!

    now, is it too soon to drop the ban hammer on a certain germ-infested toxicity that has infected this fine forum?
     
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  25. diablodelsol

    diablodelsol Member+

    Jan 10, 2001
    New Jersey
    There is an alternative to this. Given you’re not a mod here yet you can’t use mod stupidfaceness as an excuse for your current stupidfaceness.
     
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