The Red Baron: Josh Sargent at Werder Bremen

Discussion in 'Yanks Abroad' started by Dave Marino-Nachison, Oct 11, 2016.

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  1. Gacm32

    Gacm32 Member+

    Chelsea FC
    Switzerland
    Nov 28, 2010
    Geneva
    Club:
    Los Angeles Galaxy
    Nat'l Team:
    Switzerland
    I don’t think I agree with that take. None of those players are definitively Bundesliga-level. Morris could possibly contribute, but from a tactical perspective, I’m not sure I see it. Lletget could be an interesting option for some teams, but doesn’t have enough goal contributions consistently to play as an attacker at that level. As an 8, he isn’t physically able to keep pace in a box to box role. The rest are still young, so the jury is out. Caden Clark looks like he has potential to be a star in a Top 5 league.
     
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  2. DrunkOffPunch

    DrunkOffPunch Member

    United States
    Jul 14, 2020
    This. Had plenty of time and space to get a good shot off too but squandered it. A little later he had a similar pass to the opposite side but the guy who received it had no help and instead of holding up for any runs decided to take on the defender. It was comical because he took it pretty much diagonally away from any teammates until being escorted out by the corner. Should’ve been a really good opportunity.
     
  3. Eleven Bravo

    Eleven Bravo Member+

    Atlanta United
    United States
    Jul 3, 2004
    SC
    Club:
    Atlanta Silverbacks
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Sebastian Lletget would be a good match for Werder Bremen, and Bremen would benefit from him because he’s a very classy, creative midfielder. I believe he could be the missing link to Bremen’s problems. And I have every confidence that he’s good enough to do well in the Bundesliga. If Bremen was looking for someone at the moment, he would be the guy. And I doubt he would break Bremen’s bank account.

    Cole Bassett is the most polished of the youngsters I mentioned, and even though he might need some time to adjust to be an impact player; I believe he is good enough to be with the first team this year and start breaking through as an important player by next season.

    Jesus Ferreira was hot last year, but had a slump this year. I don’t think he would walk into Bremen’s XI right away, but he would be one of Bremen’s more promising home grown talents. His problem is that he’s a little too versatile in that he’s a Jack of all trades, and a master of none. He needs someone to help hone that and help him develop where he is meant to grow. If it were me, I would not break the bank for him, but if I could get him for a good deal, he could really make a difference for Bremen in the years to come.

    Caden Clark is still very young and raw, so that might go against him for a team that’s desperate for someone now. But he has the most upside on this list. I could see him playing for Bremen in a year or two timeframe, and I believe he would be a very important player. Either way, you can bet that he’ll be in Europe soon and he projects to be very successful. If it were me, he would be worth the investment.

    Gianluca Busio will be hit or miss. There are some things to like and not like about his game. For him, it will come down to how he physically develops and how a club can nurture his development. That said, I fear Busio could end up being a career MLS player, but he still has the ability to be one of our best players. It’s too soon to tell. Nonetheless, if I were in Bremen’s shoes, I would look to loan him from Sporting Kansas City with a right to purchase if he shows he can excel. My bet is that Werder Bremen don’t have a player his age that’s better than him.
     
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  4. gruenweiss87

    gruenweiss87 Member

    Werder Bremen
    Germany
    Sep 9, 2018
    Thanks for the analysis. I agree that some players you list might become valuable in the next couple years but I’m very careful predicting careers of the 17-20 age group. I’m only really following Bremen but I’ve seen so many highly talented youngsters not make it in the Bundesliga (Aycicek, Manneh, Trinks, Käuper, etc.) and many who became top players despite people predicting they would not make it (Rolfes, Kruse, Füllkrug).
    Right now, I think current Bremen players Dinkci, Woltemade, Schmid, Mbom, Agu, Mina, Nawrocki, and Sargent all have potential to really lift this team in the future but for that to happen we need to survive this season.
     
  5. comoesa

    comoesa Member+

    Aug 13, 2010
    Christen Press's armpit
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    ????
    Have you seen what is on the field for Bremen? Morris is faster than anyone on Bremen and gives them an immediate legit counter threat. Lleget is better than all of their middies in possession.
     
  6. gruenweiss87

    gruenweiss87 Member

    Werder Bremen
    Germany
    Sep 9, 2018
    Füllkrug and Sargent are actually among the faster forwards in the league. Toprak and Agu are the fastest on the team I think. Eggestein leads the league in distance covered per game.

    I think generally it doesn’t make sense to try to guess how someone in the MLS would do in the Bundesliga. The styles and speed of the game are so different that it’s like comparing apples to oranges.
     
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  7. Jazzy Altidore

    Jazzy Altidore Member+

    Sep 2, 2009
    Club:
    Los Angeles Galaxy
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Lletget? No way. He’s too slow and can’t play defense.

    Morris is arguable but I’m not sure how well his pure power and speed game would translate. I’d like to see it happen.
     
  8. The Irish Rover

    The Irish Rover Member+

    Aug 1, 2010
    Dublin
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Ireland Republic
    I would but, according to my students, I'm ineligible.

    They say I have no soul. :p
     
  9. Eleven Bravo

    Eleven Bravo Member+

    Atlanta United
    United States
    Jul 3, 2004
    SC
    Club:
    Atlanta Silverbacks
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    #6609 Eleven Bravo, Jan 10, 2021
    Last edited: Jan 10, 2021
    Another guy I should have mentioned is Jackson Yuiell. *if he Bremen could play with a deep-lying playmaker and needed someone to pick out long passes, that’s Yuiell’s game all day long. He’s a bit of a specialist, and that might not work in a league that probably requires you to be a more well-rounded player.

    But if Bremen needed a creative midfielder now, again, I would put my money on Lletget. Some say he’s slow, and he’s not the fastest player on earth, but he gets by. He’s a very strong player. I think his problem for the Galaxy has been consistency and he sort of gets pulled out of position by the manager. Yet, he consistently performs at a high level for the USMNT and does well if you put him in the #10 spot.

    What I see missing from Bremen is someone who will try things and add that creative spark. There are good players but the team just seems disjointed and there’s no effective transition from defense to offense. Too many forwards have to drop back and play defense, and this pulls them out of position in the attack.
     
  10. The Irish Rover

    The Irish Rover Member+

    Aug 1, 2010
    Dublin
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Ireland Republic
    FYP
     
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  11. Pegasus

    Pegasus Member+

    Apr 20, 1999
    Club:
    FC Dallas
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I think Morris would give teams tons of headaches. Those who don't know him don't realize how fast and strong he is. Yes, he's not the most technical guy but he's not terrible either and I've watched a bunch of teams with worse wing forwards than him. If any one thinks Sargent and Fulkrug are anywhere near Morris's speed they haven't watched him at all. Does anyone have an accurate measure of his speed and the top players in the Bundesliga for comparison. Yesterday in the Dortmund / RBL match the announcers wished to see Haaland and Upemecano race each other.
     
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  12. The Irish Rover

    The Irish Rover Member+

    Aug 1, 2010
    Dublin
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Ireland Republic
    He should be begging them to sign Hoppe at the end of the season. He's out of contract so he'll be on a freebie.
     
  13. The Irish Rover

    The Irish Rover Member+

    Aug 1, 2010
    Dublin
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Ireland Republic
    Lletget to BL1? Are you serious? He couldn't get off the bench at West Ham, not even for League Cup games. Hell, he couldn't even get onto the West Ham bench most of the time. He's done well at the Galaxy, and good for him, but he's far from being a key player for them. If he was, he wouldn't have had 11 others paid better than he was in 2019. That included Perry Kitchen, who wasn't good enough for a mid-table mediocrity in the SPL.

    I know he got a big pay rise at the end of last season. That pay rise brought him to the $500-550k region, which is upper BL2 starter/lower BL1 depth territory. If he's BL1 quality, he'd have demanded BL1 money from the Galaxy and got it.
     
  14. The Irish Rover

    The Irish Rover Member+

    Aug 1, 2010
    Dublin
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Ireland Republic
    They're hideous at the best of times and yesterday was not the best of times.

    They also got a point yesterday, against a top three side in a game they were widely expected to lose. That point keeps them 5 points clear of the relegation playoff place as well as 8 points and 8 goals ahead of second-bottom.

    As far as Bremen are concerned, it was a good day at the office.
     
  15. Eleven Bravo

    Eleven Bravo Member+

    Atlanta United
    United States
    Jul 3, 2004
    SC
    Club:
    Atlanta Silverbacks
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    That’s a little unfair to bring up a player struggling at ONE club six years ago when he was still a pup. That same player has gone on to have a good career at the Galaxy, and he has been EXCELLENT when he played for the USMNT. He’s clearly an international level player, and I don’t see how that same player could be deemed to be clearly not good enough for the Bundesliga. Now, does that mean things could not work out for him? Sure. They certainly don’t seem like they’re working out for Werner at Chelsea this year (who we all know is a class above him). And who would say Werner is not a class player? Sometimes players get caught in the wrong club situation.
     
  16. gruenweiss87

    gruenweiss87 Member

    Werder Bremen
    Germany
    Sep 9, 2018
    I respectfully disagree with this because it doesn't reflect what I see as the root cause of the poor offense this season. Bremen's passing accuracy is at 81,47% which is 9th in the league. However, of all teams only Hoffenheim loses more 1-on-1s and that's not because of Bremen's defenders, who have been mostly solid this year. (Stats source)

    To me, it's very clear that we have never been able to really replace Bargfrede in his #6 role with a guy who can win defensive 1-on-1s and make 2-5 major steals per game. Bargfrede has been so injury prone throughout his career but he always seemed to be the man winning the important battles that led to offense plays when he was on the field.

    Why is this role and player type so important? Players in the Bundesliga just have so much less time on the ball compared to other leagues - such as MLS but also Premiera Division for example. Most BL teams just build their entire game plan around pressing the opponent's midfielders. That doesn't mean the Bundesliga is better than any other league (it might actually be a sign of lack of individual quality) but it does mean that you have to be able to counter the pressing and win those 1-on-1s in order to get in a position to make a dangerous vertical pass or get a shot on goal from a distance (Eggestein and Möhwald have both a pretty lethal shot) in the first place.

    Last season after the winter break we had Kevin Vogt who was sort of able to fill this gap but we couldn't sign him for this season and weren't able to afford someone else - rumor has it that we were close to signing Nzonzi but that would only have worked financially if we had sold Rashica. Groß isn't the guy we need for this role (though he was able to neutralize Lewandowski against Bayern) and Mbom doesn't yet have these skills either.

    Right now, Kohfeldt's approach is a double-6, pairing either Groß or Mbom with Eggestein or Möhwald. I think the latter two are above average midfielders who can keep us in the league if they stay healthy (M was injured all of last season by the way) but the problem with this is that they're playing out of position and, more importantly, we basically lose one who can regularly support the attack because he has to be more defense-oriented. I think this is also the main reason for why Sargent has to work so much against the ball at the moment.

    Baumann, Bode, and Kohfeldt have all confirmed that the plan right now is to tighten up the defense to keep games close and collect enough points to survive this season. If we do, I think we'll be in a position again to be more aggressive on the transfer market and if that happens I'm confident that we can get back to having more possession and playing the type of offense-oriented game that made us successful in the past (e.g. the 18/19 season).

    By the way, here is a good recent article on how Covid and the last season has shaped the current strategy. (sorry, it's in German but I thought I'd share it anyway).
     
  17. comoesa

    comoesa Member+

    Aug 13, 2010
    Christen Press's armpit
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    It's not about bundesliga level, it's about it's about just beating out whoever is in the Bremen squad at the moment. And Morris is a world apart in speed from anyone on Bremen.
     
  18. dspence2311

    dspence2311 Member+

    Oct 14, 2007
    FIFA rates him as fast
     
  19. Eleven Bravo

    Eleven Bravo Member+

    Atlanta United
    United States
    Jul 3, 2004
    SC
    Club:
    Atlanta Silverbacks
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    That’s very fair analysis...

    The US prospects who could contend for a 6 role at a club the level of Bremen would be (outside of McKennie, Musah, and Adams):
    • Johnny Cardoso, Internacional (Brazil)
    • Owen Otasowie, Wolverhampton
    Those would be the best two for that role that we have. Cardoso and Otasowie are ball-winner types, who are starting to break out for their respective clubs. And both have excellent potential. Otasowie is more of a big physical, aggressive ‘I’ll bully everyone on the field’ type. And Johnny is calmer and tidier. Whichever - I believe both are ready now, with great upside, players who fit your description, and I imagine both would be enticed to move to Bremen.

    Also, there’s...
    • Jackson Yuiell, San Jose Earthquakes
    • Darlington Nagbe, Columbus Crew
    • Tanner Tessman, FC Dallas
    • Andres Perea, Orlando City
    Yuiell is more of a deep-lying playmaker. But he’s such a specialist that I worry that he would not do well in a top 5 league. Nagbe won’t leave home - which is unfortunate because he would be a rock star. Meanwhile, Tessman and Perea are two who should grow into B1 level important players. Both have very high ceilings, but both would need some time to grow to that potential. I think Tessman would fit into Bremen like Sargent has - but y’all would have to give him some time to mature into that role. Perea is a little more ready now, but Tessman’s ceiling is higher, in my opinion.

    Then, there are these guys...
    • Alfredo Morales, Fortuna Dusseldorf
    • Chris Durkin, Sint Truiden
    • Frankie Amaya, FC Cincinnati
    • Eryk Williamson, Portland Timbers
    • Kelyn Acosta, Colorado Rapids
    • James Sands, New York City {Injured}
    • Paxton Pomykal, FC Dallas {Injured}
    It’s unfortunate that Sands and Pomykal are so injury prone because they’re skilled enough to become B1 players. Honestly, I doubt Acosta, Williamson, Amaya, and Durkin would ever be important players in the B1. I could be wrong. But I think their ceiling would be rotational players in B1 and important players in B2. You already know what you’d get from Fredo Morales. I think he’s decent, but he’s not going to single handedly keep Werder Bremen in the B1 either.
     
  20. Suyuntuy

    Suyuntuy Member+

    Jul 16, 2007
    Vancouver, Canada
    Bremen's midfield plays every game as if it were the first time they are playing together, and that's on the coach.
     
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  21. mace

    mace Member+

    Indy 11
    United States
    Jun 5, 2004
    USA
    Club:
    Chicago Fire
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Sarge with a 4.5 Kicker rating against Leverkusen. Second lowest on Bremen (Chong was worse). I still think he's better than this, I guess that's why I keep following him, which is becoming more and more painful.
     
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  22. wixson7

    wixson7 Member+

    May 12, 2009
    boulder
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  23. Pegasus

    Pegasus Member+

    Apr 20, 1999
    Club:
    FC Dallas
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I sort of automatically subtract one to any kicker ratings of Americans.
     
  24. DrunkOffPunch

    DrunkOffPunch Member

    United States
    Jul 14, 2020
    I wouldn’t worry about the rating. Bremen were bunkering and leaving Sargent on an island. Anytime the ball got out of the back line there was an immediate trap and then turnover. It looked like some lower tier minnow playing a good top flight team. I genuinely thought Sargent was pretty good considering what he had to work with. Good holdup, wasn’t wasteful with the ball, was able to get a couple fouls when he was played into a trap, and was one of the few who were able to move the ball into the attacking third. By no means was he great, but that was a pitiful game to watch. I’m sure Bremen fans are over the moon they got a point out of it.
     
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  25. mace

    mace Member+

    Indy 11
    United States
    Jun 5, 2004
    USA
    Club:
    Chicago Fire
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Kohfeldt mentioning Selke and/or Füllkrug are capable to start and not just sub. Rashica should also be back this weekend. Pretty sure Sarge will still start, but man some actual goals/assists would be nice from a striker!

    Looking back several months when the pressure was on Sarge because of all the other injuries I’d have to say that he didn’t make a great use of his shot. Yes, he’s a fine player and helps all around, yes he gets no service, but Sarge has not shown he can make things happen on his own and be a difference maker. He has not been clutch (ie, look at Bartels against Bayern yesterday, or that last minute header by Dinkcis or whatever his name is)). I’m not saying Sarge never will, I think he has the goods and he is still young. I was just hoping against hope he’d have a few clutch moments in these past months since he was given a LOT of playing time.

    Still looking forward to the Rückrunde...he has to make the breakthrough at some point, he’s too good IMHO not too
     
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