Post-match: The Post Presidency :: Trump Faces The Music Thread

Discussion in 'Politics & Current Events' started by crazypete13, Jan 20, 2021.

  1. roby

    roby Member+

    SIRLOIN SALOON FC, PITTSFIELD MA
    Feb 27, 2005
    So Cal
    Do we got him now? :unsure:
     
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  2. Cascarino's Pizzeria

    Apr 29, 2001
    New Jersey, USA
    Jury's still out. No really - they're getting slices.
     
  3. xtomx

    xtomx Member+

    Chicago Fire
    Sep 6, 2001
    Northern Wisconsin, but not far from civilization
    Club:
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    That is her name.
    She has said publicly she prefers to be called that.
    In one interview I saw she said that only her mother uses her "birth" name Stephanie Gregory or her married name Stephanie Clifford .
     
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  4. charlie15

    charlie15 Member+

    Mar 9, 2000
    Bethesda, Md
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Josh at TPM has some interesting analysis on the De Santis / Trump situation with regard to the potential indictments. Let's just say Meatball Ron is not in a comfortable situation.

    Florida Gov. Ron DeSantis, under pressure from Trump allies, is taking his first stab at addressing the Trump indictment situation. It shows both his inevitable strategy and the inherent difficulty of the situation. He pleads little knowledge of how it works when you pay “hush money to a porn star to secure silence over some type of alleged affair. I just, I can’t speak to that.” But he also insists that Alvin Bragg is a “Soros-funded prosecutor and so he like other Soros funded prosecutors, they weaponize their office to impose a political agenda on society at the expense of the rule of law and public safety.” The approach isn’t surprising: Deep State/Soros yada and also did you hear he paid hush money to a porn star he had sex with?

    This is needless to say a hard balance to manage and involves quite a bit of cognitive dissonance. Trump’s supporters clearly think they can grind DeSantis up with this situation even as Trump is clearly hating life. And they may be right.
    https://talkingpointsmemo.com/edblog/first-look-at-the-desantis-trump-storm
     
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  5. NGV

    NGV Member+

    Sep 14, 1999
    It won't work. You're either fully committed to defending Trump or you're a traitor and a usurper; there's no middle ground.

    This is why I find it baffling that the GOP didn't convict Trump when he gave them their opportunity in Jan 2021.

    On the one hand, I get it; they're amoral cowards who thought they were taking the path of least resistance. But even so - why would you create a situation where Trump remains the party's most important leader, and where the de facto 2024 GOP platform consists of defending every horrible thing he's ever done or is currently doing? What's the scenario where that works out better than taking the short-term political hit, canceling Trump's future presidential prospects, and waiting for him to shrink into irrelevance?

    Ten more senators would have been sufficient. It's crazy that they voluntarily decided to subject themselves to years more of this.
     
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  6. roby

    roby Member+

    SIRLOIN SALOON FC, PITTSFIELD MA
    Feb 27, 2005
    So Cal
    Meh....anyone here that thinks that 75 million Magatroids are gonna abandon Donny Boy hasn't been paying attention! :(
     
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  7. The Jitty Slitter

    The Jitty Slitter Moderator
    Staff Member

    Bayern München
    Germany
    Jul 23, 2004
    Fascist Hellscape
    Club:
    FC Sankt Pauli
    Nat'l Team:
    Belgium
    part of the problem was the voters

    as we’ve seen round here trump voters don’t hold him accountable for his coup
     
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  8. NGV

    NGV Member+

    Sep 14, 1999
    That's precisely why Republican senators should have seized their fleeting chance to take the 2024 question out of the hands of their Trump-loving voters.

    If Door Number 1 is "Your personal reputation, political future, and day-to-day existence will depend on the whims and public image of an emotionally unstable narcissist with glaring moral and mental deficiencies" - you should probably go for Door Number 2, if you can.
     
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  9. Q*bert Jones III

    Q*bert Jones III The People's Poet

    Feb 12, 2005
    Woodstock, NY
    Club:
    DC United
    Surely, Republican leaders assumed in January 2021 that Trump was such a despised figure for having incited the insurrection that they wouldn't have to say anything and he would go away in shame. Once again, underestimating Republican voters is always a loser's bet.
     
  10. The Jitty Slitter

    The Jitty Slitter Moderator
    Staff Member

    Bayern München
    Germany
    Jul 23, 2004
    Fascist Hellscape
    Club:
    FC Sankt Pauli
    Nat'l Team:
    Belgium
    well yeah

    iIRC those two journalists have a really good book about those fateful days.

    IIRC they had interviews with turtle etc. I don’t remember the thinking now.

    They may have thought trump would be indicted.
     
  11. The Jitty Slitter

    The Jitty Slitter Moderator
    Staff Member

    Bayern München
    Germany
    Jul 23, 2004
    Fascist Hellscape
    Club:
    FC Sankt Pauli
    Nat'l Team:
    Belgium
    i remember these kind of calculations. They always see it as someone else’s job to deal with him.
     
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  12. ceezmad

    ceezmad Member+

    Mar 4, 2010
    Chicago
    Club:
    Chicago Red Stars
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    Talk about facing the music.

    Donald J. Trump and J6 Prison Choir’s “Justice for All” enters Billboard’s #DigitalSongSales chart (dated March 25) at No. 1.

    #Notacult

     
  13. NGV

    NGV Member+

    Sep 14, 1999
    Agreed, but I'd call it overestimating (rather than underestimating) Republican voters.

    I think that Republican elites are reluctant to face the actual reality of their core electorate, in large part because it would hurt their egos. They've gotten accustomed to defending their base against accusations of bigotry, paranoia and stupidity; those defenses are efforts to work the media refs, but also are a way to convince themselves that there's something respectable about their undertakings. Even seven years after Trump bullied his way to the GOP nomination, the delusion persists.
     
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  14. Sounders78

    Sounders78 Member+

    Apr 20, 2009
    Olympia
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    We need to accept that Republicans are not rational actors and that a majority Republicans, including many (if not most) of the ones in Congress, want Trump.

    Look at who is the Speaker of the House.

    Look at who they have placed at the head of committees.

    Look at how they consistently sabotage efforts to hold Trump accountable.

    They are part of the cult.

    They are not rational actors.
     
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  15. song219

    song219 BigSoccer Supporter

    Apr 5, 2004
    La Norte
    Club:
    DC United
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    Vanuatu
    They are rational. These actions fulfill their needs of defending those with capital, white supremacy, Christian supremacy, homophobia and misogyny.
    The thing that they are not is moral.
     
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  16. NGV

    NGV Member+

    Sep 14, 1999
    There's an increasing number and increasing influence of true believers, especially in the House. But I suspect that all but a few Republican senators secretly hate Trump, for reasons similar to those expressed by Tucker Carlson. The current situation is not where Marco Rubio or Ted Cruz wanted to be at this point in their political career. And every single senator (except maybe the idiot Tuberville) understands why the GOP blew their chance at a Senate majority in 2022.

    Among some of Trump's most prominent supporters - people like Stefanik, McCarthy, Vance - it's more a calculation that they can use him and his loyalists to their individual political advantage. That's actually worked out well for some of their personal ambitions, at least for now; hasn't worked so well for their party as a whole.
     
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  17. soccernutter

    soccernutter Moderator
    Staff Member

    Tottenham Hotspur
    Aug 22, 2001
    Near the mountains.
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    Na. He'll end up in Saudi Arabia.
     
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  18. The Jitty Slitter

    The Jitty Slitter Moderator
    Staff Member

    Bayern München
    Germany
    Jul 23, 2004
    Fascist Hellscape
    Club:
    FC Sankt Pauli
    Nat'l Team:
    Belgium
    I've come to the view that it is all fanfic

    Most of them know it's all nonsense but it's a collective fantasy they all live in, and the incentives mean they all play along. Our mistake has been to ever take it the semi-fascists at their word.

    In recent weeks the apex media channel was revealed to be total fake news and nothing has changed.

    it doesn't matter to the semi-fascists that its all lies
     
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  19. soccernutter

    soccernutter Moderator
    Staff Member

    Tottenham Hotspur
    Aug 22, 2001
    Near the mountains.
    Club:
    Tottenham Hotspur FC
    Nat'l Team:
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    You mean by her acting name? The one everybody knows her by?
    You know the media talks about Amala Ratna Zandile Dlamini, yes?
    Or Joaquin Rafael Bottom?
    And there's Elizabeth Woolridge Grant.
    As well as Neta-Lee Hershlag.

    You get the point.
     
  20. soccernutter

    soccernutter Moderator
    Staff Member

    Tottenham Hotspur
    Aug 22, 2001
    Near the mountains.
    Club:
    Tottenham Hotspur FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I was listening to Hidden Brain over the weekend, and the episode was about a person's world view, and how they get them. In short, why is one person a pessimist and another person an optimist. And, can those views fundamentally change?

    But most of the discussion was in how people view the world, and their interpretation of events. Two specific example he gave were of a dentist for US soldiers during and post WWII. His response was akin to "Life sucks and then we die." Opposing that was a girl who was the only person in her family to survive Auschwitz (litterally at Auschwitz). But she had the view that fortune favored her and kept her alive.

    I looked at that in the context of how we see politics. At a base, general level, are pessimistic about life, or at least about politics. They would say that government prevents them from doing what they want to do, and is causing harm to their lives. And they will work to those ends. Democrats, OTOH, believe that government is, greater rather than less, for the benefit of all people. It is pessimism v. optimism in the view of government.

    Translate that to how the Republicans behave, and their Blame of government, particularly Democratic government, is bad and needs to be dismantled. Chaos is just an means to that end. So, as I am applying that, it is quite rational for them to want Trump or DeSantis, and to want the chaos, and to fight these culture wars. It is not logical, for much of it hurts themselves. But as a pessimist, as a reactionary, "yesterday" was always better.
     
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  21. rslfanboy

    rslfanboy Member+

    Jul 24, 2007
    Section 26
    Man, I really want to like Hidden Brain, but Shankar Vedantam asks great questions and answers them poorly, at a high school level.
     
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  22. BocaFan

    BocaFan Member+

    Aug 18, 2003
    Queens, NY
    Yes, I mean her "acting name". :barefoot:

    Relax. Have a beer. :thumbsup:
     
  23. The Jitty Slitter

    The Jitty Slitter Moderator
    Staff Member

    Bayern München
    Germany
    Jul 23, 2004
    Fascist Hellscape
    Club:
    FC Sankt Pauli
    Nat'l Team:
    Belgium
    You have to laugh

     
  24. superdave

    superdave Member+

    Jul 14, 1999
    VB, VA
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    DC United
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    United States
    Yes! Yes!
     
  25. soccernutter

    soccernutter Moderator
    Staff Member

    Tottenham Hotspur
    Aug 22, 2001
    Near the mountains.
    Club:
    Tottenham Hotspur FC
    Nat'l Team:
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    His answers, I agree with, particularly when the episodes are not with psychologists.
     

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