The Ocho

Discussion in 'USA Men: News & Analysis' started by Patrick167, Jul 27, 2020.

  1. Pegasus

    Pegasus Member+

    Apr 20, 1999
    Club:
    FC Dallas
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    It's also very different and often very difficult for teams that are often underdogs who can counter attack to all of a sudden be favorites and face teams that bunker and counter against them.
     
  2. Ghost

    Ghost Member+

    Sep 5, 2001
    About the 1s:

    I kind of expect TnT to go on an upswing. Molino was fantastic this year. Jones is still high-side of MLS. Levi Garcia has 3 goals in 10 games for AEK. They had a few top guys in CanPL this year (The Island Games!) so they're the flagship of that league. Snagging Shaq Moore would help. I can see them putting together a decent 11.

    El Salvador looked helpless against us. But they've played well against everyone else recently. A bit of a team of mystery.

    It seems like Curacao's best players aren't playing as well as 2019. Cuco Martina is without a club. The Bacunas have dropped significantly in WhoScored. And the team hasn't played in a year. They do have a large Ringer Reserve. They may need it.

    Panama have done better than expected fighting a strategic retreat from the Golden Age. But that 6-2 was brutal, and shows there's a cliff there near player 13.
     
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  3. gogorath

    gogorath Member+

    None
    United States
    May 12, 2019
    Jones is pretty bad nowadays. He’s not top half of MLS anymore. He was a big reason Sounders lost MLS Cup.

    Molino always scares me - he’s not better than many of our players but I wish we had more guys like him.

    But T&T ... we were a bad iteration, on a swamped field, gave up an own goal and a long shot that should have been saved...
     
  4. Ghost

    Ghost Member+

    Sep 5, 2001
    #304 Ghost, Jan 26, 2021
    Last edited: Jan 26, 2021
    Dominican Republic, maxed out:

    GK
    Miguel Lloyd, Cibao
    Noam Baumann, FC Lugano (Switzerland)
    Rafael Diaz, Sacramento Republic

    D
    Junior Firpo, FC Barcelona (Spain)
    Christian Schoiseengeyr, Austria Vienna (Austria)
    Luiyi de Lucas, Haka (Finland)
    Juan Familia-Castillo FC Den Haag (Holland)

    Andrea Bosco, Pro Sesto (Italy - Serie C)
    Antonio Natalucci, Novara C (Italy - Serie C)
    Alejandro Balde, FC Barcelona B (Spain)


    MF
    Pablo Rosario, PSV Eindhoven (Holland)
    Carlos Julio Martinez, Mirandes (Spain - Segunda)
    Luis Coordes, FC Saint Pauli (Germany - B2)
    Luis Quezada, Cadiz (Spain)

    Heinz Morschel Dynamo Dresden (Germany - B3)
    Peter Gonzalez, Real Madrid Castilla (Spain)
    Kevin Paredes, DC United
    Ismael Diaz, Cibao

    FW
    Mariano Diaz, Real Madrid (Spain)
    Raul de Tomas, Espanyol (Spain)

    Gianluigi Sueva, Cosenza (Italy - Serie B)
    Nowend Lorenzo, Osasuna Youth (Spain)

    • The oldest player is 27.
    • Red equals recruiting.
    • Green means two players at gigantic clubs who played once years ago and haven't played since.
    • They have called in recently a bunch of players from the jillion teams in Segunda 2nd and Tercera levels of Spain.
    • They have eligible youth players at Real Madrid, Barcelona, Osasuna, Schalke, Nijmegen, Middlesbrough, plus Kevin Paredes. Plus a 17 year old Ft. Lauderdale player.
     
  5. Pegasus

    Pegasus Member+

    Apr 20, 1999
    Club:
    FC Dallas
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I thought it was more that they were playing him as a winger instead of an outside back like he used to play. Every year MLS gets a little better. So there's no way that a player who used to be an outside back is now winger quality a few years later.
     
  6. gogorath

    gogorath Member+

    None
    United States
    May 12, 2019
    He was playing winger, but man, he was terrible. He was always an offensive-minded fullback, and when people move older fullbacks to wingers, it's often because they can't get up and down anymore.

    If he's bad in attack and he's aging ... I'm not really scared of Joevin Jones the fullback. Could he pass? Sure. But I don't think he's an asset.

    We didn't lose to Molino and Jones last time. Their talent may rise, but it's not going to keep up with the US. On a quality field, we win in 2017. On a quality field, this US A team blitzes them even on the road, IMO, unless they just bunker, bunker, bunker.
     
  7. Kingston-King

    Kingston-King Member

    Aug 31, 2008
    Jamaica
    Club:
    Liverpool FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Jamaica

    I have news for you friend. The Surinamese players you said are not allowed due to FIFA rule which had to do with their age,WILL be admitted! Mitchell Donald and Miquel Nelom have now been included in their national team. Diego Biseswar, Kelvin Leerdam, Warner Hahn, Florian Jozefzoon will also be admitted according to their reports.

    This was due to a Moroccan Dutch player El Haddadi who first was not allowed to play for the Moroccan national team because of that FIFA 21 years rule. He is now allowed to!The Moroccan Football Association had heavily contested this case at CAS and now this absurd rule is being revised.

    You are going to have problems with the Surinamese team!
    You will not get off easily!
     
  8. Ghost

    Ghost Member+

    Sep 5, 2001
    Right now, the player having the best year in the Confederation is ...... Leon Bailey. Possibly followed by John Brooks. Then with maybe Navas, Davies, and ARob, plus possibly Eustaquio in Portugal, depending on how you rate that league.

    EDIT: I forgot Chucky and the Mexican players. Whoops.
     
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  9. hoys

    hoys Member

    Jan 2, 2017
    Virginia
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Will be interesting to see if these pre-Ocho March qualifiers are going to all happen. Seeing many in Asia are being pushed to June. There is essentially no room on the calendar if CONCACAF qualifying can't get started next month. There's a good rundown of the challenges and paths forward in Jon Arnold's newsletter.
     
  10. gogorath

    gogorath Member+

    None
    United States
    May 12, 2019
    #310 gogorath, Feb 21, 2021
    Last edited: Feb 21, 2021
    And Weston McKennie. And I’m sure a slew of others. Maybe you just want to start over?
     
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  11. Robert Borden

    Robert Borden Member+

    Chelsea
    Canada
    Apr 19, 2017
    Toronto, Ontario
    Nat'l Team:
    Canada
    Portugal is easily #6
     
  12. Robert Borden

    Robert Borden Member+

    Chelsea
    Canada
    Apr 19, 2017
    Toronto, Ontario
    Nat'l Team:
    Canada
    Also forgot about Cyle Larin in Turkey, 15 G - 3A this season with Premier League clubs wanting to acquire him
     
  13. hoys

    hoys Member

    Jan 2, 2017
    Virginia
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    West Ham's Antonio to play for Jamaica. Reggae Boys making moves.
     
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  14. gogorath

    gogorath Member+

    None
    United States
    May 12, 2019
    The Ocho just got spicier.
     
  15. Sebsasour

    Sebsasour Member+

    New Mexico United
    May 26, 2012
    Albuquerque NM
    Club:
    Philadelphia Union
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I'm high on Jamaica every WC cycle and am always burned by it.

    I'm gonna make the same mistake again, but I really think they're 3rd in the region
     
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  16. RefIADad

    RefIADad Member+

    United States
    Aug 18, 2017
    Des Moines, IA
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    They have a guy who knows how to score goals and a goalkeeper who is good at stopping shots. You have those two things, and you're dangerous.
     
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  17. dlokteff

    dlokteff Member+

    Jan 22, 2002
    San Francisco, CA
    Stay off the Ganja
     
  18. Athlone

    Athlone Member+

    Feb 2, 2013
    Nat'l Team:
    Jamaica
    As has already been noted as the big news of the day, Michail Antonio has committed.

    Additionally, there have been two other commitments.

    First comes from Blair Turgott, a former West Ham academy player who won about 27 caps for England at the youth levels. He was released and had to find his footing in the English lower tiers but has now moved to Sweden and is reviving his career there now at age 26.

    Next, Kido Taylor-Hart, one of Arsenals more promising young players and a former England U17 international, has started his passport process. His interest in Jamaica has been public for a few months now.

    Additionally, Chey Dunkley, who has been committed for a while, is finally believed to have commenced his passport process (as noted before, the pandemic has made all of this process a bit slower and more haphazard). I assume the same is true of Amari'i Bell but cannot confirm for sure.

    The JFF is still talking to Isaac Hayden and Ivan Toney. Hayden says he wants to keep Newcastle up and needs time to make a decision. Toney talks are stagnant. Both are clearly waiting for England and as of now I do not expect either to play for us in 2021.

    So, here's the list of English-Jamaican players you can realistically expect to be available for Jamaica in 2021:

    1. Andre Gray - Watford (Passport Process started)
    2. Chey Dunkley - Sheffield Wednesday (Passport Process Started)
    3. Kemar Roofe - Rangers (Passport Process started)
    4. Amari'i Bell - Blackburn (Committed, status of passport process unclear but probably on it's way)
    5. Rolando Aarons - Sheffield Wednesday (Passport secured, ready to be called)
    6. Djavan Anderson - Lazio (Passport Process started)
    7. Blair Turgott - Ostersunds (Passport Process started)
    8. Kido Taylor-Hart - Arsenal (Passport Process started)
    9. Liam Moore - Reading (Passport Process ongoing)
    10. Michail Antonio (Committed, passport process not yet started)

    And below is the "don't hold your breath" group:

    11. Isaac Hayden - Newcastle (Has started talks with the JFF)
    12. Ivan Toney - Brentford (Has started talks with the JFF)

    Jamaica fans are really agitating for Toney and Hayden. I get it, but genuinely believe we're all set at this point. Toney is a great goal-getter but we have plenty of firepower up front already. Hayden would enhance the player pool a lot more given our thin D-Mid lineup, but we can make do there without him and have secured plenty of reinforcements at every other position.

    So as far as I'm concerned the pool is fine as is, but we will see if there are any updates in the coming months leading into summer. It wouldn't surprise me to hear another name or two added to the player pool, and said name may be high profile (I didn't see Antonio coming at all, wrote him off long ago, so I guess anything can happen).
     
  19. 50/50 Ball

    50/50 Ball Member+

    Sep 6, 2006
    USA
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Has anyone tried to recruit Mark McKenzie? I don't think he'd switch but if I were Jamaica, I'd make him say no.
     
  20. Athlone

    Athlone Member+

    Feb 2, 2013
    Nat'l Team:
    Jamaica
    Recently, not that I know of. I'm sure some discussions were had during his U17 USYNT days through his father who played for one of the biggest high school teams in Jamaica and is well known there, but I don't think there was any serious chance that he (or Weah, or Goslin, who were also in that U17 side) was going to switch. Don't think he's really on the radar.
     
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  21. IndividualEleven

    Mar 16, 2006
    @Athlone Among the players who have not yet committed to Jamaica, who would be your dream recruit at this point?
     
  22. Athlone

    Athlone Member+

    Feb 2, 2013
    Nat'l Team:
    Jamaica
    If you limited me to at least SOMEWHAT realistic names (guys who have at least like a 10-20% chance of committing - going to exclude players like Mason Greenwood or Reece James who, while technically, eligible to switch still, are surefire England guys and have never expressed any interest and are basically at 0%), this would be my top 10 in no particular order:

    1. Isaac Hayden
    2. Mason Holgate
    3. Nathan Redmond
    4. Demarai Gray
    5. Reece Oxford
    6. Kasey Palmer
    7. Ivan Toney
    8. Lewis Baker
    9. Jay Dasilva
    10. Jordan Cousins

    Gun to my head, and I can only pick one for this cycle, its Hayden based on team need (we just don't have any true D-mids competing close to his level in our pool right now).
     
  23. Ghost

    Ghost Member+

    Sep 5, 2001
    I understand Ivan Toney waiting for England. But Isaac Hayden? Really?

    Also, does Holgate not being called up bode well for Jamaica? He was the only one of the Jamaican players who had a conference with Southgate who hasn't been called, IIRC.
     
  24. Ghost

    Ghost Member+

    Sep 5, 2001
    Ranking CONCACAF goal scorers:

    1. Raul Jimenez
    2. Jonathan David
    3. Michail Antonio
    4. Cyle Larin
    5. Ivan Toney
    6. Raul de Armas (Dominican Republic)
    7. Mariano
    8. Nakhi Wells
    9. Kemar Roofe
    10. Gyasi Zardes
    11. Josh Sargent
    12. Tim Weah
    13. Anthony Lozano
    14. JJ Macias?
    15. Shamar Nicholson
    Toney, leading the C-Ship probably isn't ready to commit to Jamaica. Not sure the two Dominican have any interest, and the DR doesn't seem avid to recruit like Suriname and Jamaica.

    There's a clear top 3. Then there are three guys near the top of lesser leagues, who can probably score goals in the top leagues. After that, it's pretty fluid. And I don't know what to do with Zardes.

    Also, what is Mexico going to do if Jiminez retires?
     
  25. schrutebuck

    schrutebuck Member+

    Jul 26, 2007
    Paul Tenorio and Meg Linehan summarized the USSF board of directors meeting today. One item that they're reporting are the official schedules for the national teams in World Cup qualifying: Here's the men's schedule for the Octo:

    Sep 2 (Thurs) - El Salvador or T&T away
    Sep 5 (Sun) - Canada or Haiti at home
    Sep 8 (Wed) - Honduras away
    Oct 7 (Thurs) - Jamaica at home
    Oct 10 (Sun) - Curacao or Panama away
    Oct 13 (Wed) - Costa Rica at home
    Nov 12 (Fri) - Mexico at home
    Nov 16 (Tues) - Jamaica away
    Jan 27 (Thurs) - El Salvador or T&T at home
    Jan 30 (Sun) - Canada or Haiti away
    Feb 2 (Wed) - Honduras at home
    Mar 24 (Thurs) - Mexico away
    Mar 27 (Sun) - Curacao or Panama away
    Mar 30 (Wed) - Costa Rica away

    (El Salvador, T&T, Canada, Hait, Curacao, and Panama are placeholders in this schedule announcement.)

    https://theathletic.com/2414526/2021/02/26/usmnt-uswnt-schedule-world-cup-2026-venues/

    It's time to start watching flight deals and vaccination timelines and weighing the odds of international travel becoming a possibility...
     
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