Alert: The NT Players Performance and Ratings Thread 2012/2013

The confusion came when I initially asked if he was pro-gun instead of right away asking if he's a "gun-nut" but for the sake of politeness and finding out his ideological leaning I chose not to.

Naturally I agree with your latter statement. Stats will always require context.

 

Can't believe people are arguing about Podolski. We all know where he stands, he's not entirely relevant to the future of this team unless his ability improves drastically within the next year or two.

 

I don't know, he's a talented lad. But maybe he can prove himself as a top quality striker over the next 3 or 4 years. Nice article, but I'll be very surprised if he ever thinks of moving to bayern over the next few seasons.

 

Not necessarily. It could also mean a player elevates his game for a particular competition. Podolski has blown hot and cold in the PL for example, not so in the CL.

Mind quoting the post in which you did?

So what you're saying is you don't like to give straight answers? Most of us here already knew that.

 

He has a long way to go before he can be called that tbf.

 

I don't really have high hopes when it comes to Petersen. He might be able to become a striker of decent Bundesliga quality, but I don't see the potential to reach international quality in him, let alone anything that points towards world class.

Also, he's still young at 24, but not young enough to call him a great talent that might develope into a top class player several years in the future. If he were 20, I wouldn't be as "harsh" on him; but under the current circumstances he'll have to either completely transform and improve his game within a minimal timeframe (2 years tops) or he'll be a lost cause - at least when it comes to being Germany's #1 striker who's on par with the other attacking players. Of course, Klose did exactly that and was able to take his game up several levels between the age of 24 and 28, but he was probably an exception in that regard.

Right now, out of all the strikers that have already established themselves in the Bundesliga to a certain degree (and, thus, ignoring the usual names like Yesil, Ducksch and other teenagers that have yet to display what they will really be capable of in first league football), Volland seems like the most promising player. I'd like to see him joining a top side - preferably Dortmund - after this season. I think he has the potential to reach a similar level as the likes of Müller or Reus or at least Schürrle and therefore would be a welcome addition to the NT, particularly for a role up top.

 

Well late developers are common in football, just look at drogba - his best games for chelsea where in his late twenties, early thirties. Petersen has 11 goals this season, which is a pretty decent tally, but he doesn't bring much else to the table. I'm willing to wait and see though.

 

It's easier to judge Podolski domestically because it's a larger pool to choose from, compared to Europe. I don't know exactly how much better his 4 goals and 1 assist in Europe are compared to his 8 goals and 9 assists domestically. Not much between those numbers but on average, I don't think he has "played" any differently. When there usually isn't a greater pattern, things like a fortunate tap in header against Arsenal or a tap in against Denmark can be misleading elements in assessing someone's worth.

For example, this conclusion doesn't make sense because Podolski simply hasn't shown consistency to assess that he is somehow on his way up, or becoming a reliable player. In fact, I think if you ask most pundits and fans, they would say his season in general has been average, and to some he's still disappearing in matches, particularly big ones. I just don't think mentioning the CL is particularly noteworthy to take the Podolski discussion in any significant direction.

Here:

I don't see how it's been a success, unless we rate him so poorly that what he has put up is so impressive, in which case it defeats the purpose of even considering him to be an important part of the national team, and possibly still a contender for a starting role.

I don't give answers without contextualizing them. Because they are misleading and never progressive.

 

The bold part is the key here. His decent goalscoring abilities aside, he does not show any potential to turn into the next Klose or Drogba at all. Those players, like many, reached their prime in their late 20s and early 30s, however, they always showed glimpses of ability even at an earlier age. Klose was rather limited at 24, which makes his development spectacular, however, even he displayed the occasional bit of vision, passing ability and some good runs back then. I don't really see that in Petersen.

Like I wrote above, he might become a decent Bundesliga striker in the vein of Kießling (not in terms of style, but in terms of quality), but not much beyond that. At best, he'll become a lesser version of Gomez. And since the real Gomez isn't even suited to play for the NT, a lesser version of him will probably not even make the squad on a regular basis.

Maybe Petersen will drastically refine his game, add several - now entirely missing - elements to his pure scoring abilities and turn into a regular member of the NT, but a development like that would be surprising to say the least.

 

I'm not convinced that he has the talent to ever make it to the NT.

 

He definitely has the talent to make it to the NT. However, as the cliche goes talent alone is not enough. It is up to his attitude (which is not great from what I've heard) and hard work and of course luck with injuries. He has a long long way to go.

 

A lot of German youngsters will get attention from here on. I don't see anything special in him but we can't be conclusive.

 

I rate Parker similarly to Volland which is high praise for me. I think very highly of Volland as he reminds me a lot of Reus and muller.

 

I have seen him but it's so easy to have a few good matches so until I see him consistently on the same level, it's hard to grasp what his game is and how his mentality allows him to develop it.

Way too early to draw any conclusions regarding talent yet.

 

i dont think we even need a striker.

 

Not sure how much of Arsenal you've caught this year but Ive seen all their CL matches +close to 20 league games, and Podolski has certainly looked better "on average" in Europe than in the Prem. His goals per game is 0.67 in the CL, compared to just 0.33 in the Premier League. It's not just numbers, he has defended well and linked well with the revolving trio of strikers (and CAMs) in front of him in Europe. Meanwhile, he's had some games in the PL which were MOTM performances, and then others where he seemed invisible, uninterested even.

Also keep in mind that Arsenal are just 3W-1D-3L in the CL so far, but they've gone 13W-8D-6L in the PL. The rest of the team has struggled mightily in Europe. Podolski has been Arsenal's best player in the CL, I don't think you can say the same about his play in the Premier League. So clearly he has elevated his own level of play in the Champions League (on average).

Haha thanks, but now I see where the misunderstanding came from. This was the question I was talking about:

Nothing wrong with that, so long as some form of an answer is given.

 

Like I said, it's difficult to gauge someone like him when relatively speaking a smaller pool of matches is more misleading in assessing a player than a larger one. That goals per game number proves nothing else but that.

For me it's not even about comparison between the two competitions because even if he did play better in the CL, we can't draw any significant conclusions from it so it's a pointless argument to have.

Yea I don't think Podolski really "elevated" his game. Maybe it suits him but even that is a stretch because there's no other evidence of his involvement in the CL in the past to indicate such a conclusion. There's nothing clear about that to be honest because we're just using raw data here. Having said that although I think he's at the right level with this current Arsenal side, I'm not sure if it's going to be helpful for his development.

I think they have been. Reus never played in the CL before and he didn't look out of his comfort zone against three different and relatively difficult opponents. It says a lot about a player when he can come in and do that. I'd also rate Mueller's campaign as a success but he had the experience and he performed well in the competition before. I think he's a clutch player, for the lack of a better word who generally steps up in big occasions. The difference between these two and Podolski is not in the raw statistics however.

Sometimes it's difficult to give a direct answer and the pressure to do so is not exactly helpful because it can be misleading. Podolski is such an odd example. His statistics would suggest, from a completely subjective point of view, that it's a good campaign but contrary to what you have said, I don't think the larger part of his general play included positive involvement, good link ups, etc and because he is at a team that you'd expect to move beyond the group stage where the players really prove their mettle, that's when you can maybe start to see what a player is made of. I'm not ready to make a grand assessment such as Podolski elevated his game in the CL.

 

Poldi is who he is, he will run his ass off down his flank, and when given plenty of space on the counter he can be a dangerous winger that plays simple passes, moves into dangerous positions well and has a good left foot. He's kinda like a winger version of Schmelzer, the workrate is great, the offensive positioning is clever, but the skills aren't there to do what Reus and Mueller do outside of their stats. And given the limits on what he can do, I think Poldi's had a very successful first season in the EPL. Does that make me think he should be a starter for the NT? No, and hell that doesn't even convince me that he should be a top backup with Schurrle being able to contribute in more ways and Gotze just being vastly superior. But Poldi is having a very good year given his limitations, and that he's playing in a league that very much suits him, as there is less of a focus on skill as much as on the physical ability to race up and down the pitch and fight your way to where you want to go.

 

I think positioning is not one of his strengths at all. He largely stays in the same space and doesn't do well to get out of the way of players who oftentimes move into that space.

But his directness suits the league very well. I'm not sure though that someone like Cazorla would prefer someone with more intuitive positioning.