The New Landscape in U.S. Women's Soccer

Discussion in 'USA Women: News and Analysis' started by tiej, Feb 10, 2003.

  1. tiej

    tiej New Member

    Nov 17, 2002
    Winston Salem, NC
    Full article on the NYTimes..
    http://www.nytimes.com/2003/02/10/sports/soccer/11SOCC.html

     
  2. g4m

    g4m New Member

    Oct 28, 2000
    New Jersey
    the new landscape though is more involved in WUSA than the players ape is choosing...and it is NOT the college kids or O'Rilley :rolleyes: either.

    For me i think the thing is to get away from the whole good athletes who can beat up on infeior teams because there are programs that are advancing faster than ever and have come close to catching up if not surpassing the USWNT

    Germany
    China
    Norway
    Canada
    Sweden
    France

    Gone are the days when the USWNT can sleepwalk through the early rounds and just worry about norway and china. Sure brazil seemingly has fallen on its face for a while (but still better than any womens "program" in COMEBOL) but the euro powers are coming and well we havent done anything to stay competitive

    If truth be told, those days ended in 2000 even before the olympic loss (which should have been a wake up call and wasnt).

    So we have ape clinging to the old guard and more damaging, old tatics.

    Sure mia, foudy, lilly and especally millbret are still the key players on this team, millbrett will be for a few more years, mia and foudy probs should make a graceful exit after the Olys.

    If truth be known here, ape should take a hint from jim gabbara :eek: and use mia as a supersub. That makes things really dangerous...remember tony D with Mac as a free kick ace.

    Sure there is hope, Wagner should be allowed to be the playmaker and leader of the new guard...she is the best pure footballer the USWNT has seen EVER.

    O'rilley shouldnt be on the WC squad or any friendly squad...she should be left to develop...she is NOT the US' answer to sinclair nor the female landon.

    Ape should take a hint from Arena and use WUSA to her advantage...which IMHO she isnt doing enough of...right now i put the US 3rd...i see them losing in the semis...and depending on the draw...in a group of death situiation, i see the US not making the knockout rounds.

    Ape must go...the new landscape of womens soccer lies in a change of styles, not the same old UNC better athletes, better soccer mold...want proof...look at portland and SC the past 2 years.
     
  3. UP90

    UP90 New Member

    Dec 19, 2001
    Georgia
    I would like to see more emphasis placed on ball skills and tactics rather than harping so much on fitness level (not that conditioning isn't important). The gold medal game of the 2000 Olys is a good example. Norway didn't try to run with USA step-for-step. Instead they sat back, bided their time and waited for USA to start playing impatient soccer and then took advantage of our mistakes.
     
  4. kra2800

    kra2800 New Member

    Nov 1, 2002
    Not to defend the coach but we are seeing some changes in tactics from her. She has changed the formation to take advantage of Aly for one. Hopefully she will let her play and be creative and not be too critical of every failed attempt since we all know you don't score every time there is an opportunity. I would like to see her focus on players that bring unique skills to the various positions. Sure it is important to be able to play effectively in more than one spot and most good soccer players can, but to carry players solely because they are versitile is a waste of roster spots. Two or three of the players that she will carry for the WC will be that type of player I'm afraid.
     
  5. BB99

    BB99 New Member

    Jul 13, 2002
    The law of diminishing returns favors the less developed programs where big improvements come at relatively small expense. Doesn't mean the USA won't win, just that it will be less likely as time goes by.

    The USA has one heck of a good/great team... but the rest of the world is getting better faster. Bottom line is the USA will most likely never be as dominant as it once was....and that isn't the fault of the coaches, the athletes or the system. Blame the law of dimishing returns.
     
  6. tiej

    tiej New Member

    Nov 17, 2002
    Winston Salem, NC
    Hey you forget that in these countries men football is massive but not women's footballl they don't sopport the women's game like we do and they think that in the US women's soccer is massive here wich is true compare to the rest of the world.. based in this facts the USA women's soccer is still king in the world!
     
  7. BB99

    BB99 New Member

    Jul 13, 2002
    I'm not knocking the USA...just think ppl expect the USA to remain dominant (Queen of the world?)...which in my opinion is expecting too much. The playing field is getting more level every year... For example, four years ago the USA could beat Canada by 3 or more goals without much effort. Now the USA is 2-2-2 in the last 6 games with Canada. Japan recently tied the USA... maybe not the USA's best effort, but Japan looked pretty good to me.

    Norway won the last Olympics. China has the home-field advantage. Korea is apparently a good match for China. Germany, Sweden and France are very strong... No one knows just yet how good Brazil is going to be. Japan, Australia and Mexico are rapidly improving. Who have I missed? The 2003 WWC is going to be very competitive... and there could be some upsets.
     
  8. tiej

    tiej New Member

    Nov 17, 2002
    Winston Salem, NC
    China has the home field advantage. I Think they have the all the advantage to win the world cup in thier home turf.

    (I correcting the statenment i did earlier... China is one of the countries that really support their women's athletes than the rest of all Europe!)

    So I'm expecting to see a rematch of the 1999 World Cup.


    I hope our youngsters can really step up to the challenge and bring the title home. If they do then we will really remain as queen of the world!
     
  9. BB99

    BB99 New Member

    Jul 13, 2002
    I'd like to see a Canada-USA final... a testament to women's soccer in North America.... and bronze to Mexico?? Not suggesting that would happen, but I'd like to see it...
     
  10. tigercub

    tigercub New Member

    Apr 21, 2002
    No Mac and Millie in Portugal?

    Wow, so MacMillan won't be going to Portugal. I'm just surprised because she played so well there last year. But she seems to have fallen out of favor lately; I wonder if she will be cut from the Nats altogether. Milbrett not going is nuts.
     
  11. JayJay

    JayJay Member

    Jan 21, 2000
    Brew City
    Re: No Mac and Millie in Portugal?

    It has nothing to do with being cut from the team. April is just resting players. Hamm, Foudy and Lilly didn't go the the 4 Nations tournament, all of them (save for major injury) will be on the WWC roster. April is trying to avoid burnout, and get some of the younger players the international experience that will be needed from them in later tournaments.

    Jay
     
  12. Sachin

    Sachin New Member

    Jan 14, 2000
    La Norte
    Club:
    DC United
    Let me argue these two points with you. Where is O'Reilly going to develop? Certainly not in high school or college. Sure she's not Landon Donovan or even Bobby Convey, but she plays the game at an entirely different level than the old guard. She needs to be part of the setup going forward. From today. It's a shame the WUSA can't pay more. She should be playing professionally instead of in college.

    As for Heinrichs, her position is not like Bruce Arena. It's more like Steve Sampson in 1998. The parallels are striking. Both coaches had:

    1. A league entering it's third season where the best American players spend as much time doing PR as playing.

    2. To struggle with the transition from a full-time national team to a on-the-fly team cobbled together from whoever was available.

    3. A rocky transition from an aging, though successful, core group of players to a new, talented, but untested group, especially in the attack. If you don't think this causes tension in the locker room, think again.

    4. To suffer by comparisons to their predecessors.

    5. To move from a player development role to a man (or woman) management role, since clubs are the primary focus of development

    Better hope Heinrichs doesn't decide to pull out a 3-6-1 formation.

    Sachin
     
  13. tigercub

    tigercub New Member

    Apr 21, 2002
    Re: Re: No Mac and Millie in Portugal?

    I know Hamm, Lil, and Foudy didn't go to China--I would be shocked if they weren't on the WWC roster. Mac is another case. She seems to be "resting" a lot on the bench these days (staying out of important matches, like the Gold Cup final, not playing much at the 4nations.) I hope she doesn't loose her spot to a high schooler...
     
  14. JayJay

    JayJay Member

    Jan 21, 2000
    Brew City
    Re: Re: Re: No Mac and Millie in Portugal?


    I don't think Mac will be left off the roster for the WWC, even if she has been sitting on the bench. The US has a ton of depth. Especially at forward. Hamm, Milbrett, Parlow, Wambach, Mac, O'Reilley. They play a 4-4-2. Somebody has to sit. Milbrett and Hamm have the inside edge at those two starting spots. I'd like to see Mac in the midfield. Put her on the outside instead of Fair or Roberts, but, thats not going to happen. Unfortunatly.

    If she does loose it to a high schooler (which I doubt), it will be because April thinks O'Reilley deserves it. People are so quick to point out how she is just a high school kid, like that automatically means that she shouldn't be here. She has earned the right to be a part of the player pool, and has earned the right to be playing in these games. How old she is shouldn't matter, only the game she plays should.

    Jay
     
  15. kra2800

    kra2800 New Member

    Nov 1, 2002
    Just a couple of comments; Do not underestimate the importance of college soccer. True not every program has a coach that will develop high level players but there are some that can. Sure No. Carolina has a large number of players on the NATS but I don't believe that is a program that develops players. Heather should go to Portland or Santa Clara to name a few, and you would see that college soccer can have a significant impact. They develop players not just recruit all the best and then run the opposition into the ground through conditioning and substitution. As we have seen the last couple of years that doesn't always work even if you recruit most of the best highschoolers. Should Heather be on the WWC roster?? She has the physical tools but soccer is so mental and that is not normally present in a high schooler, some good coaching is still necessary.
     
  16. jscott23

    jscott23 Member

    Manchester United
    United States
    Jan 24, 2003
    Poway, CA
    Club:
    Los Angeles Galaxy
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    In the absence of any developmental program like Project-40 for women, college is still the best place to play for Heather O'Reilly. She probably isn't ready to play in this next WC but going for the experience wouldn't be bad. Taking her along to sit the bench instead of a disgruntled veteran would help preserve harmony.

    The US is loaded at the striker position, and I would love to see April go to a 4-3-3. Personnel should dictate tactics, not the other way around. Playing with three up top would allow for Wagner to roam free behind them, with two "holding" mids (Foudy, Serlenga, Fair?) locking up the middle. Then you can push either wing back forward. We have enough speed on the outside, depth in the center and numbers up front to pay this way with anyone.

    The men's game is a great example of how negative tactics, defensive formations and caution is seldom rewarded, and that is why teams like Brazil are so fun to watch.

    Mac and Millie will both go to China. Maybe we can leave April behind.
     
  17. grendel

    grendel New Member

    Nov 15, 2002
  18. Awe-Inspiring

    Awe-Inspiring New Member

    Jan 18, 2000
    You must not ever have seen Michelle Akers play.

    That aside, clearly other teams are improving. Since they started so much lower than the USA, they have more room in which to advance rapidly.

    However, few if any teams actually control the pace of play against the USA. With veterans like Lilly, Hamm, Foudy, Fawcett and Chastain, and Wagner's emergence, that won't change for WWC '03.

    The biggest problem that the USA has had since '99 is finishing, pure and simple. Most importantly, the USA needs to improve finishing early in the game. Once it gets a lead, other teams can't bunker, and the savvy and speed of USA players and the team's depth will allow it to take advantage of opening of the field when playing from a lead.

    That's why Wambachs is such an attractive player. She finishes. She should be given a more prominent role because she is the type of player most likely to produce the early goal that the USA needs to shake other teams out of bunkers.
     
  19. jscott23

    jscott23 Member

    Manchester United
    United States
    Jan 24, 2003
    Poway, CA
    Club:
    Los Angeles Galaxy
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I saw Akers play in college and with the national team long before the 1991 WWC, and she was not a playmaking creative midfielder in any sense of the phrase. To compare Akers and Wagner would be to compare Mc Bride to Reyna on the MNT. Its apples and avacados!

    Akers was the ultimate target player up front who was dominant in the air and had the footspeed to terrorize defenses with the ball at her feet. It was only later in her WNT career that she moved back into midfield, because she no longer had the wheels (or body armour) to play up top.

    Wagner is the ultimate #10 in the way the entire world looks at the position. I've seen comparisons to Zidane but I really liken her to Kenny Daglish of those great Liverpool teams of the 1970's. As she gets older and stronger, she will become more of a goalscorer at the WUSA level and who knows, perhaps the national team as well.

    Don't get me wrong, I love Akers and think she is one of the three greatest players of all-time (along with carin Jennings and Mia Hamm) but Wagner is a completely different sort of beast, and I think she will become the greatest playmaker the US women have ever produced.
     
  20. Tsunami

    Tsunami Member

    Oct 16, 2000
    SD, CA
    Club:
    Arsenal LFC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States

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