The "Messi: the best player in the world. Is it even up for discussion?" thread

Discussion in 'Barcelona' started by jfcule, Mar 22, 2012.

  1. Bada Bing

    Bada Bing Member+

    Jul 13, 2012
    Finland
    Club:
    FC Barcelona
    Nat'l Team:
    Argentina
    #7976 Bada Bing, Feb 27, 2023
    Last edited: Feb 27, 2023
    Won Best FIFA Men's Player 2022, 7th FIFA Player of the Year. Also most appearanced (16) in FIFPRO XI.
     
  2. BocaFan

    BocaFan Member+

    Aug 18, 2003
    Queens, NY
    These award announcements need to come with a footnote describing what TF the award actually is, what its scope is, etc.

    Is this the same as the Ballon d'Or? If not, what's the difference?
     
    Jpows and ShortyMac repped this.
  3. Ozora

    Ozora Member+

    Barcelona
    Spain
    Aug 5, 2014
    Club:
    Chelsea LFC
    Fifa the best (of Fifa player of the year before) based on International captains and coaches votes. Ballon Dor is journalists votes.
     
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  4. Bada Bing

    Bada Bing Member+

    Jul 13, 2012
    Finland
    Club:
    FC Barcelona
    Nat'l Team:
    Argentina
    #7979 Bada Bing, Feb 28, 2023
    Last edited: Feb 28, 2023
    Yeah, it has been a thing from 1991. It's same as Ballon d'Or, just different voting mechanic. 10-15 the voting mechanics were merged for FIFA Ballon d'Or.

    91-09 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FIFA_World_Player_of_the_Year
    10-15 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FIFA_Ballon_d'Or
    16-22 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Best_FIFA_Men's_Player

    56-22 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ballon_d'Or (only european players prior 95)

    76-22 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Onze_d'Or

    Onze d'Or gives some credit for players that weren't eligible for Ballon d'Or prior 95. Although it's funny that it mysteriously were not held 4 times in Messi's prime.
     
  5. Danko

    Danko Member+

    Barcelona
    Serbia
    Mar 15, 2018
    Messi also broke 700 club goals which is the most in the top 5 leagues.
     
  6. Bada Bing

    Bada Bing Member+

    Jul 13, 2012
    Finland
    Club:
    FC Barcelona
    Nat'l Team:
    Argentina
    Top level club goals. 711 club goals as Messi has also scored 5 in tercera and 6 in segunda divisions. I find it funny how every media outlet is basically quoting wrong stats.
     
  7. Ozora

    Ozora Member+

    Barcelona
    Spain
    Aug 5, 2014
    Club:
    Chelsea LFC
  8. Gilmango

    Gilmango Member+

    Jul 20, 2006
    San Francisco, CA
    Club:
    FC Barcelona
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Cool story, Pele's daughter met Messi's wife (in the ladies' room) and told her that Pele was rooting for Argentina and Messi after Brazil went out.
    [​IMG][​IMG]
     
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  9. TitoTata

    TitoTata Member+

    Jun 26, 2014
    Lionel Messi has 30 goals and 20 assists in 39 games this season !
     
    ganapordiego repped this.
  10. Ozora

    Ozora Member+

    Barcelona
    Spain
    Aug 5, 2014
    Club:
    Chelsea LFC
    What's Messi's best season ever??? To me, it is 14/15 season. Not only because of treble, but the way Messi played, the free flowing football he displayed is unparalleded.
     
  11. Bada Bing

    Bada Bing Member+

    Jul 13, 2012
    Finland
    Club:
    FC Barcelona
    Nat'l Team:
    Argentina
    #7986 Bada Bing, Mar 5, 2023
    Last edited: Mar 5, 2023
    [​IMG]

    whoscored.com
    (OPTA) ratings (combined league and champions league)

    09-10 8.62, 45 games
    10-11 8.86, 46 games
    11-12 8,88, 48 games
    12-13 8,55, 43 games
    13-14 8,35, 38 games
    14-15 8,86, 51 games
    15-16 8,43, 40 games
    16-17 8,42, 43 games
    17-18 8,54, 46 games
    18-19 8,55, 44 games
    19-20 8,64, 41 games
    20-21 8,52, 41 games
    21-22 7,76, 33 games
    22-23 8,40, 27 games

    I think there's three candidates overall ratings wise, 10-11, 11-12 and 14-15. 10-11 and 14-15 are pretty similar silverware wise, and also how he scored a goal of the century in both seasons, against Madrid in CL SF and against Bilbao in cup final.

    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]

    But treble is better than double, so for me 14-15 is the better of the two.

    Then there's 11-12. Ratings wise equal, lacking CL, but breaking seasonal scoring world records, 73 for club and 82 for country. So individualistically it's probably the best.

    Then there's 12-13 where he was the most consistent player of all-time. Scoring (33) in 21 league games in a row (T.Peterek, 16 (22) 1937-38), against all 19 opponents in the league in a row. Record which might be the best of all of Messi's records. And only injury stopped it to be another legendary season.

    18-19 could be the season, where he carried the team most, and with CL could've easily challenged the other top seasons. Damn Dembele, I hated him so much after the lack of professionalism in the 3-0 win.

    [​IMG]

    Although I did forgive him after the peno in WC final. :D

    Anyway overall for me 14-15 is Messi's best season, and I think it's probably also the average answer to it.
     
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  12. Bada Bing

    Bada Bing Member+

    Jul 13, 2012
    Finland
    Club:
    FC Barcelona
    Nat'l Team:
    Argentina
    Fanstastic game from Messi against Nantes, goal, two throughballs and 8 dribbles.

    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
     
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  13. Ozora

    Ozora Member+

    Barcelona
    Spain
    Aug 5, 2014
    Club:
    Chelsea LFC
    With the loss in UCL and the expired contract at the end of this season, will Messi back to Barca or continue his journey in Paris???

    Part of me want him to move to Serie A but there isn't any club that can pay his wages. If he leaves PSG this season, it is considered as Leo's failure chapter. Though with World Cup triumph, people probably will not remember about his PSG time.
     
  14. TitoTata

    TitoTata Member+

    Jun 26, 2014
    All the Barca online outlets / forums are saying that he’s coming home !!

    Yet apparently we have to shave off a further €200 million off the wage bill

    So I don’t see how that works !!?!
     
  15. Ozora

    Ozora Member+

    Barcelona
    Spain
    Aug 5, 2014
    Club:
    Chelsea LFC
    I don't see that he will back to Barca either. His wage is another thing, his relationship with Laporta isn't good enough to make a reunion.

    Look like another season at PSG. Surely he doesn't want to leave PSG as a failure (not winning UCL). But with PSG's mindset, they won't win it in 100 years. Unless they do something to change everything this summer (sell/get rid of useless players, buy good players to build an actual team)
     
  16. BocaFan

    BocaFan Member+

    Aug 18, 2003
    Queens, NY
    Makes more sense to sell Neymar, not Messi. Then use the Neymar money to shore up the midfield. Their defense is already pretty good, they were just unlucky that Kimpembe was injured for a big chunk of the season.
     
  17. celito

    celito Moderator
    Staff Member

    Palmeiras
    Brazil
    Feb 28, 2005
    USA
    Club:
    Palmeiras Sao Paulo
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    With his latest injury I think PSG are stuck with Neymar for at least another season. Unless the contract is terminated on a mutual agreement and Neymar finds a club in Europe willing to take the risk on some reduced wages or he decides to go back to Brazil or some similar move.
     
  18. Ozora

    Ozora Member+

    Barcelona
    Spain
    Aug 5, 2014
    Club:
    Chelsea LFC
    It's hard for PSG to get rid of Neymar. He is injured now. Which club can buy him??? Probably none.
     
  19. Ozora

    Ozora Member+

    Barcelona
    Spain
    Aug 5, 2014
    Club:
    Chelsea LFC
    The pretty much let opponents have chance to score against them every games. So i don't think their defense are good enough. Though i agree that their midfield is a big joke. Just Verratti and if he has bad game, it's over.
     
  20. Barc@4ever

    Barc@4ever Member

    Barcelona
    Jul 21, 2020
  21. Ozora

    Ozora Member+

    Barcelona
    Spain
    Aug 5, 2014
    Club:
    Chelsea LFC
    Great assist to Mbappe to win PSG game. If they want to have a shot in UCL, they must change their midfield, coach, keep Mbappe and Messi.
     
  22. Rattlehead

    Rattlehead Member+

    Barcelona, Inter Milan
    Argentina
    Jun 21, 2010
    Jakarta
    Club:
    FC Barcelona
    Nat'l Team:
    Argentina
    Like I said, PSG main plan is giving a throughball for Mbappe. When its not working, their plan B is the same as their plan A. They only win game when they're able to setup Mbappe for a finish. This mostly works in Ligue 1 but definetely not in CL.

    Sure there has been some games this season where Messi single handledly wins it but in CL there's no way they could get anywhere if they dont change manager and midfield. They dont have creativity outside Messi.
     
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  23. TitoTata

    TitoTata Member+

    Jun 26, 2014
    Since he turned 35, Lionel Messi has played 3,633 minutes of football, the equivalent of 40 full games.

    In that time, he’s scored 30 goals, assisted 21 goals, completed 119 dribbles, created 108 chances, got MOTM in 46% of games.

    He also won the World Cup.
     
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  24. Bada Bing

    Bada Bing Member+

    Jul 13, 2012
    Finland
    Club:
    FC Barcelona
    Nat'l Team:
    Argentina
    #7999 Bada Bing, Mar 12, 2023
    Last edited: Mar 12, 2023
    [​IMG]

    Most direct free-kick goals in national leagues and international football

    62 Juninho
    57 Messi
    52 C.Ronaldo
    52 Ronaldinho
    50 Mihajlovic
    50 Nakamura
    48 Beckham
    47 Maradona
    45 del Piero
    45 Frantzeskos

    https://iffhs.com/posts/2595

    Top 10 IFFHS All Time World Playmakers (since 2006)

    284 Messi
    197 Iniesta
    141 De Bruyne
    133 Modric
    130 Xavi
    101 Kroos
    85 Ozil
    82 Pirlo
    77 Hazard
    71 Neymar
     
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  25. celito

    celito Moderator
    Staff Member

    Palmeiras
    Brazil
    Feb 28, 2005
    USA
    Club:
    Palmeiras Sao Paulo
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    Messi is built for slow possession oriented system. Mbappe is built for high tempo and taking advantages of open spaces. While they are often able to combine, their styles don't really match.
     

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