The inevitable war with China

Discussion in 'Politics & Current Events' started by feyenoordsoccerfan, Feb 4, 2024.

  1. Anyway, who's going to block those straits? On what grounds?
    Do you expect the USA to declare war on China in case of invasion of Taiwan?
    If not, and the USA blocks those straits, that would inevitably be a declaration of war.
     
  2. Yoshou

    Yoshou Fan of the CCL Champ

    May 12, 2009
    Seattle
    Club:
    Seattle Sounders
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    If the US actually supports Taiwan, war is inevitable. This isn't like Ukraine where they can send munitions and hardware into the country via rail that is largely protected from Russian attack. Any re-supply from the West will have to be done by ship and China will never let those ships into Taiwan. As a result, the US and its allies will have to clear the area of Chinese ships and establish air dominance.
     
  3. Interesting, but how do you get air dominance with mainland China about 2200 km from the nearest naval hotspot Hawaii?
    upload_2024-10-15_20-27-50.png
    For those USA aircraft carriers to be usefull in air dominance, these become sitting ducks within reach of mainland China ballistics
    1. https://www.ft.com › content › 561d16ee-5dd5-4ee6-8c42-63372040b37b
      China tests intercontinental ballistic missile in Pacific for first ...
      25 sep 2024China fired an intercontinental ballistic missile into the Pacific Ocean for the first time in 44 years on Wednesday, a show of force set to fuel concerns in the US and among its neighbours.
    2. [​IMG]https://www.nytimes.com › 2024 › 09 › 25 › world › asia › china-missile-rocket-force.html
      China Launched a Rocket With a Dummy Warhead Into the Pacific - The New ...
      25 sep 2024China launched an intercontinental ballistic missile carrying a dummy warhead that landed in the Pacific Ocean on Wednesday, the country's defense ministry announced, in a sign of President Xi...
     
  4. Yoshou

    Yoshou Fan of the CCL Champ

    May 12, 2009
    Seattle
    Club:
    Seattle Sounders
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Ballistic missiles don't really work on moving targets and the US Navy has the AEGIS Ballistic Missile Defense system, which is the best ballistic missile defense system in the world.. Also Japan, Philippines, Alaska, Guam, and Australia exist.

    Again, if the US is going to support Taiwan, there is no choice but to go to war with China and that's going to turn into a regional conflict very quickly.
     
    rslfanboy repped this.
  5. ceezmad

    ceezmad Member+

    Mar 4, 2010
    Chicago
    Club:
    Chicago Red Stars
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    The Filipino Navy is not blocking shit.

    Not because they would not want to, but because they can't.
     
  6. ceezmad

    ceezmad Member+

    Mar 4, 2010
    Chicago
    Club:
    Chicago Red Stars
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    We need bases in Taiwan, we just don't have the guts to do it.
     
  7. Yoshou

    Yoshou Fan of the CCL Champ

    May 12, 2009
    Seattle
    Club:
    Seattle Sounders
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    They don't need a navy to block cargo ships from entering their territorial waters to go to China.
     
  8. https://www.benzinga.com/news/24/09...ile-expands-threatening-us-military-supremacy
    First of all Hawaii aint a moving target, neither are the west coast naval bases.
    And then there's this:
    upload_2024-10-15_22-2-13.png
     
  9. When you paint it as a kind of "walk in the park" event, I got to remind you how long it took to make Japan surrender, while they got the same logistic problems the Chinese have to deal with.
     
  10. https://www.businessinsider.com/us-...ing-worse-2024-5?international=true&r=US&IR=T
    The dangers are startling. An American air base such as Andersen on Guam that routinely hosts US bombers or a carrier strike group sailing in the South China Sea could face dozens, even hundreds, of ballistic missiles in salvos intended to overwhelm their defenses, shatter critical capabilities, and send US warships sinking into the depths. China's missiles haven't been tested in combat, but the threat is real.

    In interviews with Business Insider, current and former military officials and defense analysts described the meteoric rise of China's People's Liberation Army Rocket Force as a chief concern. One senior defense official said it's changing America's appetite for war in the region, "creating a conventional deterrence capability that threatens our posture, our presence, and our activities in ways that would potentially cause decision-makers in Washington to consider the risks to be too high."
     
  11. Yoshou

    Yoshou Fan of the CCL Champ

    May 12, 2009
    Seattle
    Club:
    Seattle Sounders
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Couple of things.

    As we saw in Iran's attack on Israel, AEGIS works just as well protecting land targets as it does protecting naval targets. The US also has deployed THAAD batteries in Hawaii, Guam, Wake Island, and has started deploying it in the Western US around military bases...

    Next, if China's hypersonic missiles were any good, the US would have already stolen the technology and deployed it in our own hypersonic missile program. The Chinese military-industrial complex is even more corrupt than Russia's, so I'm not sure why you are believing Chinese propaganda and Western analysts about their capabilities... That's not to say they can't hurt the US or its allies, but you're just repeating Chinese propaganda as if it were factual.
     
  12. Uhm, arenot observations of actual hypersonic missiles tested by China from US intelligence factual?
    upload_2024-10-15_22-40-4.png
     
  13. I think the Chinese hope the US miltary has the same denial to ridiculing stance as you do.
     
  14. These are mouthpieces for Chinese propaganda?
    1. [​IMG]https://www.cbsnews.com › news › china-hypersonic-weapons-test-details-united-states-military
      Exclusive: No. 2 in U.S. military reveals new details about China's ...
      China's round-the-world hypersonic test took place on July 27 and has been compared to the moment in 1957 during the arms race with the Soviet Union when Moscow launched the Sputnik satellite,...
    2. [​IMG]https://www.ft.com › content › 4a317b8c-d433-4f74-91d9-0be47fc0f04a
      China's hypersonic weapon test close to 'Sputnik moment', says top US ...
      Milley is the first official to confirm a Financial Times report that China had tested a nuclear-capable hypersonic weapon. On July 27 it launched a hypersonic glide vehicle — which travels at...
     
  15. Yoshou

    Yoshou Fan of the CCL Champ

    May 12, 2009
    Seattle
    Club:
    Seattle Sounders
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    As a reminder, Russia's Kinzhal was called a hypersonic glide munition until it was revealed by their use in Ukraine that they were just an air launched Iskander ballistic missile. By definition, all ballistic missiles are "hypersonic" in that they are all faster than Mach 5 during their terminal phase. However, hypersonic missiles are supposed to be more than that. What makes an actual hypersonic missile deadly is not just that they can reach hypersonic speeds, but that they are also maneuverable. The maneuverable part is where the US has struggled with their hypersonic missile programs.
     
  16. Yoshou

    Yoshou Fan of the CCL Champ

    May 12, 2009
    Seattle
    Club:
    Seattle Sounders
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I'll give you a hint. Western analysts have over-stated the capabilities of their adversaries for as long as there have been Western analysts. The US, in particular, feeds this information out into the public in order to get Congress to increase funding for programs it intends to counter that threat. In this case, the US needed funding to deploy satellites that can detect the launches of hypersonic missiles and for development of changes to the AEGIS system and development of the Glide Phase Interceptor.

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/20...c-missile-defence-htbss-satellites-aegis-gpi/
     
  17. Yoshou

    Yoshou Fan of the CCL Champ

    May 12, 2009
    Seattle
    Club:
    Seattle Sounders
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Again, that's not to say China isn't a threat and that it can be discounted, but, much like we learned about the Russian military when it invaded Ukraine, don't be surprised that the Chinese military is also a paper tiger.
     
  18. I guess the nr. 2 in the US military is quite capable to understand the difference between a ballistic missile speed and what constitutes a true hypersonic missile.
    I guess too the nr. 2 in the US military is quite capable to understand the difference between something claimed and actual intelligence report on the Chinese missile.
    I guess too the nr. 2 in the US military isnot regurgitating media reports, but displaying real intelligence info, when revealing something to the press.
     
  19. Yoshou

    Yoshou Fan of the CCL Champ

    May 12, 2009
    Seattle
    Club:
    Seattle Sounders
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    US analysts said Russia would capture Kyiv in 3-days.

    US analysts said Russia would nuke Ukraine if they gave Ukraine HIMARS.

    US analysts said Russia would nuke Ukraine if they gave Ukraine ATACMS.

    US analysts said Russia would nuke Ukraine if they gave Ukraine F16s.

    US analysts said Russia would nuke Ukraine if Ukraine invaded Russia.

    US analysts said that Saddam Hussein had a program to create weapons of mass destruction.

    US analysts said that Saddam Hussein was getting "yellow cake" from Africa to create dirty bombs.

    Etc. etc.

    So.. Why should we trust US analysts again?
     
  20. Dunno who those US analysts are.
    My guess is they don't have access to the same info the nr. 2 in the US military has.
    Just a hunch.
    And analysing an actual launched hypersonic missile on it's flight seems to me something different from constructing a scenario on a battlefield, based on numbers of equipment and manpower.
    The first is actually looking what it's doing.
     
  21. Yoshou

    Yoshou Fan of the CCL Champ

    May 12, 2009
    Seattle
    Club:
    Seattle Sounders
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    *nudgenudge* The US analysts are the ones that give the number 2 in the US military the information he has.

    US intelligence has deep penetration into the entire military and political structure of China and Russia, but what they release to the public has still been consistently wrong.
     
  22. Uhm,
    the USA is busy developing hypersonic missiles themselves and at least until begin this year struggled with it.
    1. [​IMG]https://www.wsj.com › politics › national-security › hypersonic-missiles-america-military-behind-936a3128
      Hypersonic Missiles Are Game-Changers, and America Doesn't Have Them
      18 sep 2023Hypersonic Missiles Are Game-Changers, and America Doesn't Have Them The U.S. military is pouring resources into the superfast weapons but has struggled to develop them. China and Russia are far ...
    Are you suggesting the same people testing and analyzing Amerian hypersonic missiles are incapable of giving the number 2 in the US military a sound and expertise analysis of the data of observed Chinese hypersonic missiles tests?
     
  23. The Devil's Architect

    Feb 10, 2000
    The American Steppe
    Club:
    Chicago Fire
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    https://www.pacom.mil/

    https://www.andersen.af.mil/ - Guam

    https://www.kadena.af.mil/ - Kadena Airbase, Okinawa Japan

    https://www.misawa.af.mil/ - Misawa Airbase, Japan

    https://www.yokota.af.mil/ - Yakota Airbase, Japan

    https://www.kunsan.af.mil/ - Kunsan Air Base, Korea

    https://www.osan.af.mil/ - Osan Air Base, Korea

    Bur prior to that, you suppress the opponents missile and air power with submarine and surface launched cruise missiles
     
    spejic repped this.
  24. song219

    song219 BigSoccer Supporter

    Apr 5, 2004
    La Norte
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    Vanuatu
    Not to mention bases on Diego Garcia which I'm guessing would be useful in closing the Malacca Straits.
     

Share This Page