So Zico has hinted that our midfield may consist of Ono, Nakata, Nakamura and Inamoto. All of them playing simulataniously on the same time has never happened and it really excites me. I think with this kind of formation, the 4 back line might be a defensive one. A two more weeks and we see what this is all about.
it happens all the time when i play winning eleven 6 gk: sogahata sb: koji nakata, matsuda cb: morioka, miyamoto dh: inamoto sh: ono, nakamura oh: hide cf: takahara, yanagisawa
what do you think about Naoki Sakai? I think he should be on the national team. He should play as a shadow striker/attacking midfielder, and he should be allowed to make forward runs. I think he would be great.
Is it only for me that it seems to be really a bad timing, except for kawaguchi the only one that i can think of to be called however wasn't, to call them all for a friendly against jamaica? all of inamoto, nakamura, and especially suzuki still need to concentrate on their club team to secure their position and to fully get used to the team. i know this is zico's first time to conduct so he wants to know what the current best team that he can think of can do with his style, formation, and etc etc. but can't he still make another solid "A" team from j-league? anyways, these oversea players will be called so i just hope zico use them only either half esp ono and inamoto.
why would he want to use such a strong team against a team like jamaica? he should use j-league players, and wait for the argentina friendly and use his strongest team there.
it doesn't necessarily consider who to be our opponent. it's just a matter of timing. i want hear what yuke or matsu think of this if they don't mind answering.
well I wouldnt wanna test new formation and players against one of top team in the world. Jamaica would be good test.
Consider that a) this is Zico's first match at the helm and b) Japan has not played in a 4-man midfield since 1998. That means Zico needs to see what he has at his disposable, and the players need to get used to playing with each other and in a new (old) formation. I agree with jamisont. If I were a coach, I would like to go into the Argentina match with the "golden midfield" having played together at least once, even if it is for just 45 minutes.
I think its a good thing to start with this line up, it seems that we think Jamaica is gonna be too weak of an opponent. I don't think anyone should be underestimated or be too overconfident. I want to see this line up against Argentina, but I think its good to see this now and everyone get used to things. We have to remember, 2002 WC was the past, now we are back on a starting line again. Theres bound to see alot of tweaking to this line up. I thank Troussier for building depth, youth and foundation for this team. Now I hope Zico will be able to do the same too. It does seem that Zico is fortunate to have these young experienced players at his disposal and I know our core players will be in their prime for 2006 but 2010 could be a disaster if we forget about our youth.
I think it is a good time to be sorting out the midfield, and deciding which players will fit where in a 4-4-2 lineup. However, despite what the press is babbling about, I really dont see this as such a "golden" midfield. I think Nakata K. and Ogasawara are as good as any of the others, and Okubo is going to be head and shoulders better than every last one of them. The point, though, is to start developing chemistry between these four, because they will get the least amount of experience with the national team in the immediate future. As for what Nakata10 was talking about in the other thread, actually this is NOT such an unusual experience for the midfield. Nakamura, Ono and Inamoto have tons of experience playing with each other, ever since Nigeria 1999. The only one who hasnt been a part of this group in the past in Nakata H., which makes him the most easily expendable player in the bunch. If he works hard to develop a real rapport with the others, it will be great, but if not, Nakata K. and Ogasawara are available to step into his spot, any time. Im guessing that this match and the Argentina match will be used by Zico to make a judgement about the midfield. Then, early next year, we should start to see more experimenting with the back line and the forwards. I agree with Yuke that the current group of strikers (except maybe Takahara) are not candidates for 2006, but it would be too soon to start throwing in lots of new players already. You have to build the team one step at a time. Zico will probably get the midfield settled first, and after that is taken care of, he will bring in some of the younger strikers. I think Nakamura, Tanaka and Matsui are all candidates to partner with Takahara, but to be honest, I think that Okubo is better than any of them at scoring goals. In the end, Zico might have to settle for a 4-3-3, with Okubo and Ono (or maybe Tanaka) on the flanks of Takahara.
Yes I know, Ono, Inamoto, and Nakamura have experiences together from the youth days. But I think its too early to dispose of Nakata in the mix. He has played with these players anyways, but just not with all of them together. That means theres are ? factor for all 4 players but that doesn't conclude or suggest that Nakata is replaceable. I think all 4 players are subject to scrutiny and expendable not only Nakata. Matsu always seem to preclude Nakata from the mix, but I think Nakata has a great knowledge of the game and experiences that these players will need. I think he has shown us many times that he can bounce back from pressure. That kind of pressure he experiences at Parma or even last year with Troussier suggests me that he has a lot of heart. Our four midfielders have those qualities too but just look at the way Nakamura and Ono looks up to Nakata. Do I know what they talk about? Frankly no, but you have to admit that Nakata has alot of respect in the team and pull. I can think that Akita or Nakata may just wear the captain's armband in this lineup. Well Akita probably will. This midfield is something I want to see but a little too unrealistic in my mind. I think everyone wants it but I think its too offensive. I think its better than a 5 man midfield where Nakata has to be involved in the play or other players looking for him to do something. When Nakata isn't in form things don't work. With Nakamura, Ono, Inamoto, they all can create something. I don't think Ono and Inamoto is right player for defensive mids. At this point, no. I have a feeling Zico wants the 4 defenders to step up into this area and let the midfield do its attacking. I am always up for surprises. Thats what the game is all about.
You have to remember, I have been watching Nakata play since he was in junior high school. I used to coach one of the teams in Yamanashi prefecture that played against him (Enzan Wakabayashi Chu). He has always had tons of talent, and I have never denied that. But he also has always been lazy and throws a tantrum if he isnt the center of attention. Look at what has happened at Parma. I think that when Nakata is playing at top form, he is a great player to have in the team. The problem is he only plays at top form about one match out of every five. You certainly cant tell me he played well at the World Cup, can you? I think Ogasawara is far better than Nakata. He may not be better than Nakata on the one day out of five, when Nakata plays at top form, but if you take an average, Ogasawara always plays at the same level, while Nakata is up and down (mostly down).
"That kind of pressure he experiences at Parma or even last year with Troussier suggests me that he has a lot of heart. " the difference will probably be that zico will give nakata more FREEDOM, something that he didnt have under troussier (and thats why nakata played like crap in the world cup) nakata needs to be given freedom, he is very creative and troussier was one that wanted him to either comform to his system or get out.
i have another question regarding the issue we discussed behind the closed door last time. please check your pm again lond2345. i really need your help on this.
I think you may have a mistaken view of what "freedom" means under Zico. He was a great player himself, and of course he knows that great players need to be given the "freedom" to do their own thing on the field. In that sense, Zico will not be a micro-manager like Troussier. But at the same time, Zico has a very clear and very strict idea of what role each player is supposed to perform. Players who are not able to perform that role end up on the bench, or worse. Take a look at some of the very talented players that the Antlers have discarded over the years. Masuda, Abe, Okuno, Manaka, Ishii . . . the list goes on and on. There is certainly no problem with these players "talent". The only thin is that they were unable to fill their role on the Antlers team properly, in the way that Zico expected. And as soon as that happened -- *poof* -- they were history! Sure, Nakata will get some freedom to play his own game under Zico, but I have a feeling that he may very quickly find that if he insists on being the center of attention, rather than playing his expected role within the team concept, he will be out of the NT very quickly. Personally, I hope he can adapt and play a proper part on the team, because I hate to see his talents wasted. But ive been hoping that same thing for six or eight years now, and it hasnt happened yet.
Excuse me Matsu, I don't have that kind of knowledge nor experience seeing Nakata from that long but I do remember you accused him for that goal in WC98 when it was Nanami who caused the goal. So I do sense some bias from you. Sorry if I accuse but thats what I remember. Am I biased, in your eyes maybe but we all love to see this kind talk. Share us more about your coaching days and the present coaching system in japan. Anyways, I think Nakata gave a so so performance during the world cup. Take the Turkey game out cause that was horrible all the way around for everyone. I think Ono was worse than ever during the world cup, he was recovering but I thought his performance was sub par from his usual self. Ono just wasn't match ready, he had good plays then disappered. The Belgium match showed me alot when Nakata scolded the players, I think you can't forget that Nakata was constantly marked harder than other players because of his popularity in Europe. I know that when Nakata gets shadowed, he really disappears, I think thats his biggest weakness but you give just a little room to him and he has big vision of play. I know Ogasawara is always under Nakata's shadow but you have to remember that he has not experienced playing abroad. Wasn't he completely useless against Roma? I think playing in Serie A and J-league is different, and maybe if Nakata played again in J-league its easy to compare or Ogasawara playing abroad. I think two are different players anyways, but with Zico under the helm I wouldn't be surprised if Zico pulled out Nakata for Ogasawara at all. I still like to see a competitive spirit among the team anyways. I don't know about his tantrums, maybe in your eyes his expression of his self is portrayed that way. Having lived in Japan and abroad half and half of my life, I know that you have to express yourself to make your point heard in foreign countries. In Japan, I remember that caused alot of stir in my classes and I learned to hold back. I think with Nakamura, Ono and Inamoto, there will be more freedom for Nakata cause now you have more creative players rather than seeing Toda or Myojin. I look back about the Turkey match and it seemed that Toda or Myojin completely made the center of the field useless. Nakata then Ono and Ichikawa on the wings but no Inamoto to cut through and make overlapping runs through a withdrawn defense would have been much more effective than Toda and Myojin just staying back. We'll see in a week and I look forward to having more disscusions then. Right now its all what we think its gonna be.
To add to Nakata10's post, from this past World Cup, I got the impression that when Inamoto made his forays into the attack, a lot of times, Nakata dropped back deeper in midfield to cover the gap. I'd have to watch the tapes again, but that might have made it seem like he wasn't creating much. Even though Nakata wasn't spectacular, I thought he was more than competent in organizing the midfield.
I hope you will excuse me for putting so much pressure on Nakata. If I do seem to show a bias against him its mainly because I know how much he is really capable of, and so I have very high demands for his performance. Anyone who says he isnt a talented player is a fool. But at the same time, a talented player who wastes his talent is a big disappointment. Ihave lived for almost half my life in Yamanashi prefecture, so I know Nakata a lot more closely than any other Japanese player (except for a few Ventforet Kofu players that you have probably never even heard of). It is easier to overlook someone's weaknesses when you only see them from a distance, but when you know somebody really well, you tend to know his strengths and weaknesses very well too, and maybe you are less willing to cut him some slack for his weaknesses. To be honest, I have never really seen Nakata perform to his peak ability in a Japan uniform. The only possible exception was the match against Poland, prior to the world cup. If you exclude that match, think about it. What has Nakata accomplished for the national team? How many goals has he scored? How many assists? How many matches where he made the "big play"? How many where he screwed up the big play? Nakata is a very talented player, but he really has not done much for the Japan team. Almost all of Japan's greatest successes (Asian Cup, WYC, King Hassan Cup, etc) have been in matches where Nakata was not in the lineup. The only exception was the Atlanta Olympics, and even then, it was Jo, Maezono, Kawaguchi and Zaizen who were the heroes of that team. Just the thought that Nakata could have been overshadowed in a tournament by Jo or Maezono is reason enough to claim that he doenst perform up to his ability. On the other hand, Nakata has had lots of success for Roma and Perugia, as well as for Bellmare. Just remember, the best club players dont always make the best national team players. I still hope that Nakata will prove me wrong, some day. But like I said before, Ive been waiting for years and years to be proven wrong, and it still hasnt happened.
Matsu again sorry to always interrupt your opinion but I do beleive he was in the lineup during the King Hassan Cup. I think its hard for Nakata do make an impact in the Japan jersey, he always have to travel half across the world from Italy to join the team, beat jet lag, settle into the team. Also he has not had a serious injury in the past years and he might be overworked in some situations. We also have to remember that one player can only do so much. Nakata is not a Zidane for Japan, we don't really need that kind of player, but Troussier worried about how the players look for him instead of doing something on their own. Sydney Olympics and the Turkey match really showed that side where the ball kept going to him when it was not necessary. I think this really needs to change. Now we might have Nakamura, Ono, and Inamoto to do this. This I believe will give an incredible arsenal for the Japanese midfield. Honestly, I think the few matches where I remember his brilliance, WC 98 vs Croatia he gave that incredible pass where Nakayama could have scored. He was constantly in the mix of play, but I think our forwards didn't do anything. I look back at WC 98, it was all about wing play, no effective overlaps in the middle of the field and sub par performance by Jo and Nakayama. against France in the 5-0 blowout where he didn't give up, I think his shot hit the post. Olympics against South Africa(this was a mixed performance overall for the olympics) Confederation Cup vs Australia, he was the captain and gave his all for the team covering attack and defense. Poland match for sure. World Cup match against Tunisia. I think the Italy match, and Olympics was a down time for Nakata. Asian Championship really didn't need Nakata. Matsu I have to agree his performance at the club level has been better than the National Team. When you said, it reminded me of Del Piero, and his performance with his national team. Ok enough about one player, this is about the midfield. Zico has high hopes and he compares with his playing days with the Brazilian National Team. I think we can do this, but our defense has to really step up.
hopefully nakata doesn't become a steve mcmanaman who only performs for his club (what about john barnes, remember?) not sure why he is usually ineffective for the national team. he's a bit mysterious isn't he.
for us i think that's fine nakata only plays good for club team. we have plenty of substitutions in the midfield. i'm still thinking about using nakata as forward. how's takahara, alex, and nakata's 3top
Not exactly. Unlike Macca, Nakata actuallly gets selected. And he's never really been able spend extended time with his teammates in a national team camp. When he has had time to prepare with the rest of the team, i.e. this year's World Cup, he acquitted himself fairly well, imho. He usually has problem when he joins the team at the last minute, most notably in the 2000 Olympics.