Riquelme would not play for Bob. He does not fit Bob's system. Bob is a great manager, so maybe Bob could mold Riquelme into a more complete player. After some time, Bob might allow him to play a little.
lmao.. i really don't hate Bob, but its the way that posters on these boards glorify the guy that is hysterical
tbh, this looks like the BB philosophy in a nutshell. What you wrote makes it sound like 'creativity' is a bad word, and a state to be managed and controlled like a bad virus (one that might infect the rest of the team and before you know it, they're all doing flicks, and stepovers). I'm watching Porto vs Man Utd right now on the DVR as I type this. Ronaldo has just scored. Ronaldo doesn't defend all that much, and he does a lot of unexpected, creative things. Is that good or bad? Should players like Ronaldo be controlled, or is it the coaches job to find those talents and shape the team to get the best out of them?
that had nothing to do with my post, nor the topic we were referring to.... we were talking about pulling in certain players and using certain tactics against certain opponents... never was our point valuing one way over another
Riquelme did NOT retire because he was old nor because Argentina has talent out of the "wazoo". He retired because Maradona had publicly criticized him and failed to call him up. They have been going through a rough patch even when he was there. A lot of people felt Messi and Riquelme were and are not compatible. Talent wise, sure. Doesn't mean he would make the team better or guarantee international success.
lol, and that is also one of the failings of U.S. College Soccer. Creativity is seen as going against the team aspect. Coaches at that level value the bigger, taller athletes who run fast and try hard with little skill or touch over the smaller, more creative, players with actual football IQ. I have a friend who plays on a top 10 NCAA D-1 team. During a practice the coach subbed him out and kicked him out of practice. The reason...well, he dribbled the ball up the field on a counter attack, juked out 2 defenders, and managed to score. The coach, however, felt he should have just booted the ball up the field to absolutely no one. Hoping that one of the bigger athletes would get the ball and hold it, then wait until the entire team came up for the attack, where someone would throw the ball into "the popcorn machine," and maybe score. P.S. F the "Popcorn machine." It makes the beautiful game, a game of luck, not skill.
While it may sound that way, the real virus is the is the lack of work rate. there will be days that just being creative isnt going to hack it. As a coach, I am concerned about what happens on those days. One of my favorite coaching quotes goes something like this "We dont mind if the kids make mistakes, they will if they are going full speed." for me, part of going full speed is being willing to work hard both ways. Within soccer, there is more tactical flexibility to define roles than some sports. The way the game is played in the US, (at a hs level and younger) makes it harder to find a place for kids like adu re. Ronaldo, Ferguson recently called him out because he was unwilling to work within the team concept. so its not like BB is the only one.
It is funny that every sports in the US is full of creative players. Creativity even encompass every thing about America/American. Nope, but not in soccer, where creativity is seen as a taboo and conformists rules the field. No wonder why so many people in this country think of soccer as a socialist/communist sport. American soccer is so un-American.
My point was that if Argentina wasn't so loaded with talent, Maradona would never not call up his leading scorer and midfield general. You think Bob would ever bench guys like Dempsey now a day? Hell no, because he would not have anyone to replace him with. Argentina is so loaded with piano maestros that they can afford to retire one and replace him with so many more. US on the other hand can't even produce a few piano players (Dempsey and Adu are prob the only piano players we have). But they never been humiliated so badly by such a terrible team before, nor they are so far down the table. It is unfathomable. Why am I not surprise. And your name is Prime Time?
Exactly 1 time.... when that was his first touch on the ball that game. I recount the same Mexico defenders stealing it form Ching about 5 times the same way.
Most of our college coaches really are terrible, especially the older American ones... It is more like rugby with slide tackles than soccer. Women's college soccer is even worse. The hard part is even if you are Coerver himself and you are going to coach your guys to play with skill, they will get crushed because the referees don't call anything. Same in high school and most club too. Most referees are terrible, but what do you expect? Anyone can just decide to be a referee, and if they can pass a few tests that is it. Actual knowledge of soccer is not required beyond knowing the rules (hopefully). Anyone knows that it is the game-time interpretation of the rules that counts, and who judges the execution of this? Other refs who know equally little usually, they have just been at it longer. There pretty much has to be blood or broken bones to see a yellow card. Neither is uncommon at all. You are risking your legs trying to dribble because six guys will probably slide tackle you at once. The big time coaches keep winning using the thug strategy, so why would they stop? It is all they know. Half of them never played a decent game of soccer in their lives. Bruce Arena is a perfect example. He was a lax player, albeit a good one, but he could barely kick a soccer ball. There is a kind of field testing to get higher coaching licenses, but you can avoid actually doing anything to prove you can play if you want to.
Yeah, that's why I thought of it. Honestly, sometimes (and especially after this thread) you wonder if the US did have the BPITW, what would they do with him? Try to make him defend? Or put him in a position to score the winning goal?
But why did he do it? Because of Riquelme's style of play. Maradona isn't the only coach to skip on Riquelme's talent. Sure they have. They lost 5-0 to Colombia a while ago and Colombians still bring that up to Argentines.
No one is valuing work rate over talent, or talent over work rate. If you look at more of this thread you will notice that myself and others have pointed out that they are different aspects to the game which are BOTH important. The point being that you bring young guys with loads of TALENT slowly into the National Team so they can learn from guys like Ching and Hejduk about the WORKRATE needed at this level. What myself and others want is the TALENT of Altidore and Adu combined with the WORKRATE of Ching & Hejduk. This will make them better, more complete players. Are you saying you don't want a better more complete Altidore & Adu???
I don't think ANYONE has glorified him. He has gotten us consistant results which reflect the talent level of the U.S. At best he's a manager that will win the games he should win, tie the games he should tie, and lose the games he should lose, with a surprise result every so often. He's a "steady as you go" manager.
Whew. Lot to catch up on today! Dempsey is the perfect example of a guy with great skills and a great work ethic. He is always playing bigger than he actually is and has publicly admitted that while skillwise he was up to snuff before moving to Fulham there were a lot of things he still had to learn about the game to make himself a more complete player. I trust the words of our only professional field player starting in the EPL.
The reality is that by the time players reach the college level they should be well past the age of learning creativity and skillsets on the ball. The problem you refer to is rooted at the coaching and development of very young children in the U.S. By the time they reach college, MLS, and the National Team the job of the coach is to teach these players how to play within the framework of a team concept and how to win at that level. The skillsets they have available to them should be an aid to executing the game plan, but they will need more than their skills to be champions. Take a U.S. player like Tracy for example. In his freshman year he was knocked about silly and had tons of injury problems. He changed his diet, workouts, etc. to adjust to the more physical demands he was encountering and became one of the greatest ever players at Wake Forest and has now signed overseas. This is a pefect example of a talented, skillful player learning what it takes to win at a higher level and turning himself into a better and more complete player.
Is there any requirement that Ching and Hedduk learn talent so they can be better and more complete players and THEN they get to play? No? Then work rate is being valued over talent. Because the untalented* players with good work rate are playing while the talented players with bad work rate** aren't. *Not my assessment of either Ching or Hedjuk btw. **Actually now that I think about it, this isn't my assessment of Altidore or Adu either.
Well now you get into the whole "experience" debate and the "having to earn your way onto the squad by putting in the time" thing. I won't even get into that because I'm already exhausted from this thread.