I think you’re correct that some schools will still have some type of aid for students, but there is huge concern for the future. Our men’s baseball coach knows he probably won’t have a program to run next year with the expected lost revenue this year, men’s soccer is in huge trouble as several programs were dropped after the spring season were cancelled. Stanford, Akron, Bowling Green made deeps cuts and that is just from once cancelled spring. There are a lot of departments who are nervous that without sports this year people won’t have jobs. That’s a reality that is sinking into departments. 6 months into this and we aren’t even close to working things out. What if things don’t change in the next 6 months do we cancel the spring sports? And in another 6 months after that do we cancel fall 2021 sports too? And so on and so on. At some point there won’t be college athletics and that’s just our small world.
Agreed that there is more money academically versus athletically for colleges however a lot of that money is tied to FAFSA income. Colleges' definitions of who is able to afford a private school at 75K cost to attend is very different than the reality of who can actually afford it and pay for food/mortgage at the same time. Keep in mind as well that with the Power 5 anyway a lot of the money generated by athletics (and a significant amount of this is TV revenues-B1G 10, SEC, ACC, Pac 12 networks plus the windfall from CF playoffs and NCAA-again read TV revenues) goes into the general scholarship fund at the various universities. So, this will absolutely impact EVERYONE at every university which has sports that participates in Div 1. Sports also serve to engage alumni and donations always go up when a school has a good season in football/basketball. Not to be a doomsayer but this is going to change college athletics AND education. Our colleges are asking us to pay full tuition and are not delivering "full tuition" value. College professor wrote the article below. It will be interesting to see how this plays out with various majors and departments. When push comes to shove and programs and departments need to be cut, will colleges look at the programs in which their students struggle to find jobs where the vast majority of the jobs from said major are in university settings? https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2020/06/university-like-cd-streaming-age/613291/
Power 5 talking about no fall football https://www.espn.com/college-football/story/_/id/29629669/power-5-talking-no-fall-football Sources told ESPN that a vast majority of Big Ten presidents have indicated that they would vote to postpone football season, hopefully to the spring.
All fall sports, including P5 football, to be postponed sometime this week. About time and before the dumbly proposed August 21 date. A shame that kids at the bigger schools were made to come back and train for a competitive fall that won’t even occur. They were at the mercy of the adults that should have been looking out for them. https://www.si.com/college/2020/08/...sDk6DE0mLBhHbRtdccDRD0BnLTdVkQnkYbBu6OGR23KO8
That's exactly why my kid didn't even unpack her suitcase when she got back to school on Aug 3. They all knew this was coming.
You really can't say that none of us on here are medical experts. You really don't know what people that post here do for a living, do you? But, you're mostly right, in general most here are probably not medical experts. That said, you have no way in knowing if the opinion that you stated in saying that "athletes aren’t being affected by this virus" is true, do you? When you state this are you referring to the Indiana University football player that has experienced significant cardiopulmonary issues and was admitted to an ICU? What about Vonn Miller, the Denver Broncos linebacker that became significantly sick after he contracted Covid? Are you referring to Andrew Boselli a Florida State football player that said he was the sickest that he ever has been after he contracted Covid? Or perhaps you were referring to Paulo Dybala, an Argentine player with Juventus? He was totally spent after training 5 minutes after he became sick with Covid. Athletes are a lot more in tune with their bodies than the general population is. Because of that, they usually know before others when something "isn't right." That, however, does not mean that "athletes aren't being affected by the virus." Being an athlete does not make one immune to the virus. There is a lot that is unknown about Covid. Covid is a serious respiratory infection that very well may put people at risk for long-term lung issues. It may possibly ravage the lungs to the point where those that are afflicted are stuck with a reactive airway disease like asthma. Is it really worth it for collegiate athletes, the majority that will be going pro in something other than athletics, and if they do play a sport after college it will be in the "beer leagues," to subject themselves to something that could potentially compromise their health for the rest of their lives?
So what would be your suggestion? You just spoke about several athletes, some who struggled with the virus and some who have some health conditions. In comparison to a minority of athletes who will be affected by the, think of the thousands who will literally not be able to afford to go to college when they lose their scholarship and program because the school can’t afford them anymore? This is a genuine discussion in college athletics right now. Thousands of prospective athletes with a significantly reduced amount of college options to play for 4 years as programs get cut. I don’t disagree with anything above and you are correct. The issue is what is the alternative? We don’t play a huge chunk of college athletics goes under affecting thousands. These discussions are real and happening around conferences right now. So what do we do about this situation?
My solution: lockdown for ********ing real this time. The federal government should print a lot of money that goes only to people. Wait until the vaccine. And everyone should read Anne Frank: The Diary of a Young Girl for insight on how to handle this situation with grace and maturity.
Here's where we are I think. The answer is, it depends on where your school is located. If you are in an area with notable community spread, some use the 5% positive testing rate as a metric, then don't open schools in-person and that means keep athletes and everyone home. (Some schools like UNC are ignoring these community recommendations and so already violating the NCAA requirements to do.) https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/o...ing-what-do-wake-and-durham-think/ar-BB17HVND If the college opens for in-person classes, test all your athletes and begin training them. Some will use a phased in approach like using 8-hour weeks (off season rules). After 2-3 weeks of testing and limited training AND no campus or athlete outbreaks, then move to a non-traditional season, 45 calendar days and 5 friendlies. IF you can find schools with good testing results and willing to travel and not having their own campus outbreaks. IF it goes well, MAYBE you get permission to have a few more games up to the 50% of regular-season games so maximum games without using eligibility. This is the safest course of action right now and where a lot of colleges still are at this point, or will be, IF they are trying to train and play at all. Some have started training kids without even a legit schedule! It's the travel risk that needs to continue to be evaluated so limited competitions is the most likely outcome. Modified regional schedules are already worked out in many cases but that will likely become friendlies for those still able to play if we even get to games. Schools can make their Fall games as realistic as possible, have a Sr Day, etc. but there are not going to be conference championships so just play both a fall and spring non-traditional season and move on to 2021 with hope for a vaccine. Now, for P5 Football and Mens Basketball, my vote would be to try to have their modified regular season with bowls and march madness by putting those 2 teams in much more strict conditions, like a bubble. Hotels, online classes, team-only meals, limited visitation and strict travel guidelines. But I don't see this kind of campus bubble happening or even permissible for a couple mens teams only. Even though its the best solution at this point to keep that TV revenue coming in. @Collegewhispers I've stated here, and if you are a coach you should know, that scholarships are one of the last thing to be cut. even after salaries. AND we all know, many athletes often don't have financial need. So, IF athletic scholarships were to be cut, they would cut those students with financial need last, to keep them enrolled. AND if there ends up being no room or board to pay, or it gets refunded, that's significant savings to an athletic scholarship budget. So, your claiming that students access to higher ed will be devastated is just not real. Will some maybe have to go their local State school to save money, or God forbid, even a Junior College? Maybe some. But very many will stay right at the schools where they are to complete their degrees. (I will certainly admit that International students on high-dollar athletic awards are in much more trouble in terms of degree completion. But that is 10 times more a problem for mens than womens soccer) Unfortunately, we are about to see campus towns have legitimate outbreaks and locals raising hell and many many schools will just be sending kids home anyway. Hopefully, no one gets really hurt, or not one close to you and your player/coach/reason you read this crazy forum.
Your points are well-taken. I wish that I had a good suggestion. I wish that anyone had a good suggestion. It was stated earlier in this thread or in something else that I read that perhaps one of the positives to come out of all this is that it will force us to reevaluate some things and make some adjustments. In the business world one of the positives coming from this crisis is that we realize that a lot of the work that is being done in modern & shiny offices can be done at home. Is it really necessary to fly personnel in from all over the country for some meetings when things can be done for a lot less money and just as effectively during a Zoom or Cisco Webex session? I've made a lot of changes in my business. Perhaps this line of thinking can apply to athletics. Is there too big of an emphasis on collegiate athletics? Maybe we just have too many resources tied up in athletics. I am a sports fanatic and love collegiate athletics so I am in no way advocating that they be abolished. I just have an opinion that they be looked at and are given some careful consideration regarding meaningful and productive changes that can be made to them. Considering what I said above, I appreciate that athletics play an important role in the development of the "complete person." I also can appreciate that many student-athletes are afforded the chance at an education at an institution that they would would not have access to if not an athlete. Look at how may athletes gained access to an education at Duke, Vanderbilt, Stanford, Notre Dame, USC, UCLA, many of the Big 10 schools, etc, that they would not have been able to afford if not through athletics. Many of those athletes would not have been admitted to those schools if not for athletics. The same hold true for the Ivies. While athletic aid is not given at the Ivies, many athletes are admitted to those schools that would not have been admitted otherwise. I am digressing, though. Comparing the professional athletes to collegiate athletes is not worthwhile in any way. Professional athletes are, by and large, compensated very well. They should be required and expected to quarantine and do what is necessary to be able to have the best chance of not getting sick so that they can compete. Collegiate athletes can not be expected to do that. Additionally, collegiate athletes should not be expected to do that. The entire college experience makes it nearly impossible to do so. Lastly, and this point is controversial and argumentative, we probably would not be in the situation that we are today had everyone taken all of this more seriously in the winter and early spring. Everyone was too careless, many thought that masks were unnecessary, an alarming number of people thought that the virus was a hoax, hand washing was not being done diligently,..... I am not suggesting that if all of this was taken more seriously early on that there would not be a problem now, but I do believe that athletics would be taking place and students would be in classrooms taking notes rather than in their dorm rooms or at home listening to a lecture on their computers.
Not sure I'd use Anne Frank as an example. All that they did, they died anyway,.. In the history of the world we have never had an effective virus in humans for a corona virus. Let that sink in. Get used to COVID, it's never leaving and we need to figure out how to live and somewhat control risks. We could be locked down for the rest of our lives.... And not to be a doomsayer but if antibodies don't provide lasting immunity against the virus (experts are saying you can get reinfected and antibodies don't last more than three months) even if we find a vaccine that's effective, it won't help unless we are getting it every three months if the antibodies aren't long lasting. You've mentioned what four athletes who got really sick? Out of how many athletes in THE WORLD? Lots and lots of people have had this and I'd imagine our numbers reported have been a lot lower due to the mild and asymptomatic infections, The chances the athletes are transmitting the virus on the field is slim to none because they'll be tests at least two times a week. We've lost our minds in the US. I'm not sure how anyone is having a discussion about keeping athletes "safe" They have a higher incidence of CTE from playing football etc than risks with COVID. So, yes by all means leave the athletes on campus with no testing (because most of the power 5 schools are doing in person learning in some form or another) or send them home if they're remote and then let them continue to train without supervision or COVID testing by medical professionals. Yes, that's keeping them safer. So be honest, those parents of athletes. Will your child be safer at home or at school without the college athletic protocols in place? 1. Will he/she be basically solitary at home or on campus and be masked everywhere they go if they can't social distance? 2. Will he/she be tested regularly? Symptoms or no symptoms. 3. If he/she gets COVID will you have an EKG done prior to return to activities? Will you even know with no symptoms if he/she has COVID? If you can answer truthfully to the above questions then your child is safer at home. If you can't answer yes to the above questions, then they are probably safer at school.
Not every athletic dept can afford ekg for all athletes. Mid major and lower level programs may not have the money that the big 5 schools have to test etc.
https://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/nfl/report-big-ten-will-not-play-in-2020/ar-BB17N7OX The Big Ten voted to cancel the 2020 season and will formally announce that decision tomorrow, the Detroit Free Press reports. Dan Patrick said on his radio show that the presidents of the 14 Big Ten universities took a vote and it was 12-2 to cancel, with only Iowa and Nebraska voting against canceling the season.
more..... DP was told an hour ago that the Big 10 and Pac 12 will cancel their football seasons tomorrow... The ACC and the Big 12 are on the fence.. And the SEC is trying to get teams to join them for a season. (source: https://www.al.com/sports/2020/08/j...is-canceling-season-virus-can-be-handled.html)
If more are dropping out, then there really is no point in trying to start the season with fewer and fewer teams.
The remaining Colonial Conference teams that had not already decided not to play in the Fall now have made that decision: College of Charleston, Elon, James Madison, and UNC Wilmington. I highly recommend reading the James Madison statement. In addition, Old Dominion from Conference USA has decided not to play. Current status: Total Division I Teams 341 Not Eligible for NCAA Tournament 3 Total Teams Eligible for Tournament 338 50% of Eligible Teams 169 Teams Not Playing in Fall 109 Additional Not Playing to Equal 50% 60
Sources: Mountain West to postpone fall sports season https://www.espn.com/college-footba...ces-mountain-west-postpone-fall-sports-season "The Mountain West is the second FBS conference to postpone football and other fall sports, joining the Mid-American Conference, which voted to do so Saturday morning." Would add another 12 to the count.
The Mountain West sitting out the Fall is official. Current status: Total Division I Teams 341 Not Eligible for NCAA Tournament 3 Total Teams Eligible for Tournament 338 50% of Eligible Teams 169 Teams Not Playing in Fall 121 Additional Not Playing to Equal 50% 48 We now are at the point where a group of non-Power 5 conferences that want to play when there will be an NCAA championship and have been waiting to see what will happen, but that would prefer not to play in the Fall, can get together and push the number to 50% thus ending the possibility of a Fall NCAA championship. There is no guarantee, however, under the NCAA August 5 decisions, that there will be a championship later in the year if there is not one in the Fall.
Lots of great points Eddie!! I will say though that not having a program to play for is a very realistic possibility for a lot of athletes. I agree with you on the scholarship aspect of this, but there is genuine concern about how viable providing scholarships will be as donations are down as will be institutional aid, both of which fund scholarships. There are athletic directors stating they may not be able to honor any scholarships for 2021-22 due to the projected impact on this year because of COVID. I think power five will be fairly well protected because of the 4 year agreement but mid majors with year to year contracts will have an issue. This is potentially affecting programs in our department in addition to others close to us. It is reality.
Regarding the status of getting to 50% of eligible teams not playing in the Fall, I realized that Cal Baptist, North Alabama, and Merrimack, all of which are in the re-classification process, are not eligible to participate in the NCAA tournament, in addition to Bellarmine, Dixie State, and UC San Diego. That means 6 of our 341 teams are not eligible. Given that, here are revised numbers: Total Division I Teams 341 Not Eligible for NCAA Tournament 6 Total Teams Eligible for Tournament 335 50% of Eligible Teams 168 Teams Not Playing in Fall 121 Additional Not Playing to Equal 50% 47
It can, but I do not think it will. Essentially, the NCAA is taking a vote of the National championship eligible schools and the majority prevails. But as you say .... And just now the Summit League announced it is moving Fall sports to Spring. And Eastern Washington, whose football the Big Sky already has moved from the Fall, has postponed all Fall sports until further notice, which I will interpret as not in the Fall. With those changes, here are the latest numbers: Total Division I Teams 341 Not Eligible for NCAA Tournament 6 Total Teams Eligible for Tournament 335 50% of Eligible Teams 168 Teams Not Playing in Fall 131 Additional Not Playing to Equal 50% 37
There is a lot of second guessing and hand wringing, on this thread, over what the U.S. should have done, could have done or could do in relation to Covid 19 that somehow might have improved the current situation. Everyone of course is entitled to their own opinion on that matter. For those of you who like to formulate your opinion based on medical facts and observation I will leave you with an article from a Swedish emergency room doctor dated August 4, 2020, on what he has personally observed as it relates to Covid 19. Sweden as we all know was one of the few countries which chose not to lock down their country hard as a result of the pandemic: https://sebastianrushworth.com/2020/08/04/how-bad-is-covid-really-a-swedish-doctors-perspective/ Lastly, is a video interview with the newest member of the U.S. Corona Virus Task Force, Dr. Scott Atlas. Some very interesting facts as it pertains to the risks of Covid 19 versus Influenza in certain age groups.