The coming boom in multi-eligible player recruitment

Discussion in 'Youth National Teams' started by Dave Marino-Nachison, Jul 27, 2020.

  1. Dave Marino-Nachison

    Jun 9, 1999
    I'm not an expert on the rules, but I feel like Haiti has a good shot at nabbing players already cap-tied to Haiti! ;)
     
    Mahtzo1 and Sandon Mibut repped this.
  2. LouisZ

    LouisZ Member+

    Oct 14, 2010
    Southern California-USA
    Club:
    FC Barcelona
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I see the same way as elite youth club soccer works. If you have a very good program, it's easier to recruit top talent. Those on the fence always want to hitch their wagon to an up and coming team.
     
  3. EXALIFTIN

    EXALIFTIN Member+

    Nov 23, 2010
    Club:
    Fulham FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Thought it fitting to bump this thread considering the musah news, while I’m sure he’s not 100% committed yet, you have to imagine that whatever talk berhalter had with him the topic 2026 was discussed at length
     
  4. Dave Marino-Nachison

    Jun 9, 1999
  5. Dave Marino-Nachison

    Jun 9, 1999
    By the way, I haven't seen a new Mexico U20 roster -- maybe I've missed it? Munoz was called up pretty recently, so this doesn't necessarily seem like a "SNUBS!!!" situation.

    https://miseleccion.mx/noticias/3209/Convocatoria%20de%20la%20SNM%20Sub-20

    Somewhat hard to believe he'd jump straight to the USMNT pool, though I imagine U.S. Soccer wants to be active counter-recruiting at all levels. And does anyone remember if there was some noise about Munoz a few months back? Maybe I'm thinking of someone else.
     
    ussoccer97531 repped this.
  6. ussoccer97531

    ussoccer97531 Member+

    Oct 12, 2012
    Club:
    --other--
    I saw something recently about a Brazilian-Mexican that was called into the Mexican U-20 team. I don't think a roster was announced yet, but it makes sense that there may be a camp coming up during the upcoming international window.

    Could it be that Munoz wasn't called in for that and is now suggesting that means he'd switch to the USA? It's possible thats where this is coming from.
     
  7. Dave Marino-Nachison

    Jun 9, 1999
    Interesting -- I think I saw something like that too, in the post I posted right above the post you just responded to. ;)
     
    ussoccer97531 repped this.
  8. Dave Marino-Nachison

    Jun 9, 1999
    They've also apparently called up a Mexican-Argentine playing in Argentina. It looks like he's Mexican-born with at least one parent from Argentina; not sure where he was primarily raised.

     
    ussoccer97531 repped this.
  9. BostonRed

    BostonRed Member+

    Oct 9, 2011
    Somerville, MA
    Club:
    New England Revolution
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Including the flag of Ukraine (which I assume is simply the colors of his club) only adds to the confusion.
     
    Dave Marino-Nachison and dougtee repped this.
  10. Dave Marino-Nachison

    Jun 9, 1999
  11. Dave Marino-Nachison

    Jun 9, 1999
  12. Dave Marino-Nachison

    Jun 9, 1999
    #37 Dave Marino-Nachison, Nov 10, 2020
    Last edited: Nov 10, 2020
    UEFA cancelled its tournament that would've determined qualifiers for the 2021 FIFA U20s, instead using ranking data to name England, France, Portugal, Italy and the Netherlands as its participants.

    https://www.uefa.com/under19/news/025e-0fac6fe40557-8da71e4a1ab1-1000--2020-under-19-euro-cancelled/

    I mention this because, setting aside the possibility that the 2021 tournament doesn't even happen, regional qualifiers are cap-tying opportunities for multi-eligible players. When these tournaments don't happen, guys stay "in play" a bit longer.

    It's a dynamic worth watching; you can already see from those five countries that some guys the U.S. cares about could be affected. Using one obvious example, it would seem neither Italy nor England can provisionally lock up Musah this way.
     
    USSoccerNova, Winoman and ussoccer97531 repped this.
  13. Dave Marino-Nachison

    Jun 9, 1999
    And, rather obviously but anyway, this applies across other age groups as well. No doubt everything about the theoretical 2021 FIFA U17s (Peru, dates currently TBD) is also up in the air. We've discussed the U23s at length, too, of course.
     
    ussoccer97531 repped this.
  14. Dave Marino-Nachison

    Jun 9, 1999
    H/T to Paul Gardner for also spotting Chile-based Benjamin Galdames, who I'd overlooked, on this list. He's the Mexican-born son of a former Chilean MNTer who was playing in Mexico at the time. His brother, who was born in Chile, has appeared for Chile's MNT and is based in Argentina.

    Clearly, we are not messing around on the recruiting front, but neither is Mexico.
     
    ussoccer97531, Winoman and BostonRed repped this.
  15. Dave Marino-Nachison

    Jun 9, 1999
    The near-term (one hopes) factor pushing against this narrative is ... the coronavirus, which has obviously wrecked the soccer calendar among many other things. For the purposes of this thread, it means fewer opportunities to recruit, call up, and cap-tie players.

    What's the current damage? I didn't go all the way down the rabbit hole into pre-qualification tournament competitions, tournaments, but even without those it's dramatic:
    • At U20/19 level, AFC and CONCACAF have yet to reschedule their qualifiers. Everyone else has, for early 2021, ahead of a theoretical Finals starting in May, with the exception of UEFA, which as noted has already just awarded its 5 U20 slots and moved on without a tournament.
    • At U17/16 level, pretty much same deal -- no dates for AFC or CONCACAF yet. Everyone else is tentatively on for spring/summer qualifying tournaments ahead of an October Finals.
    • Everyone but CONCACAF managed to get their Olympic qualifiers in; of course, that tournament was rescheduled to July. (CONCACAF's U23s have not been rescheduled.) There's also a UEFA U21 tournament scheduled for March that is not Olympic-related.
    There are so many moving parts here that any or even all parts of this calendar could change -- January is really close; the first tournament up is OFC's U19s, their U20 qualifier, set for that month. CONMEBOL's U20s are in February. AFC has already rescheduled its U16s twice and UEFA's U19s had also been moved two times before they bagged 'em.

    In case you want to see this all in one place:

    https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1HeuFi1EuWVbnF_z2h6ejxKd-bBC5r9zOUlA3ZaHYEe0/edit?usp=sharing
     
    TimB4Last repped this.
  16. David Kerr

    David Kerr Member+

    United States
    Oct 18, 2019
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    New high priority dual national.

    Marcos Zambrano, striker, 2005

    I think this kid is the best striker in the 05 age group and by a wide margin. Marcos has been representing the Ecuador YNT’s but I do not believe that he is provisionally cap ties. Marcos also is eligible for Portugal and has trained with clubs in Portugal but can’t move abroad until he is 16
     
  17. Dave Marino-Nachison

    Jun 9, 1999
    Don't believe he could become provisionally cap-tied to Ecuador before the CONMEBOL U17s currently scheduled for March (Ecuador is the host). UEFA's are in May though the qualifying round has not been rescheduled from last year. Our U17 qualifiers have also not been scheduled.
     
  18. Dave Marino-Nachison

    Jun 9, 1999
    As has been noted, Gioacchini is American-born, but:

    Perhaps he will get an opportunity for Caen in French Ligue 2. Born to a mother of Jamaican descent and father of Italian descent, Gioacchini had an opportunity to play for Paris FC and Caen moving to France as a teenager after growing up in Maryland.​

    https://www.ussoccer.com/stories/2020/11/gioacchini-i-had-a-week-that-ill-never-ever-forget

    It's been reported that he already has an Italian passport; not sure about Jamaica.

    One assumes he is not on Italy's radar at present, but the Jamaica angle is at least theoretically interesting as 2022 qualifying approaches and ahead of a presumably expanded field of CONCACAF teams for 2026.

    Of course, there's time and opportunity for him to make himself indispensable to the U.S., too. And he's young.
     
    Winoman repped this.
  19. Athlone

    Athlone Member+

    Feb 2, 2013
    Nat'l Team:
    Jamaica
    I would consider it a pretty big upset if he ever represented Jamaica. The JFF has made relatively little effort to pursue him aggressively, and he hasn't shown a ton of interest either. While he was on the JFF radar, it never looked like it would turn into much of anything on both sides.

    With his excellent showing in the USMNT debut, I find it unlikelier still that he is swayed by Jamaica. I predict, barring an injury and/or massive drop in form, that the USMNT will have him cap tied by July.
     
  20. Dave Marino-Nachison

    Jun 9, 1999
    #45 Dave Marino-Nachison, Nov 17, 2020
    Last edited: Nov 17, 2020
    There's a reason I said "theoretically interesting." My point was that as a 20-year-old in the French second division, he isn't currently at a level where you might consider him a lock for a 30-man provisional roster for 2022.

    Of course he could take big steps forward and become a lock, or smaller steps forward and be in the conversation. Or he could get bypassed by other players or anything else. (He wasn't even the only second-division player born in late July of 2000 with three theoretical international options to score twice against Panama last night!)

    If he doesn't think he's a lock, does he consider other options? And would a perhaps-safe spot with Jamaica be more attractive to him than competing for a spot with the U.S. if that happens?

    I have no idea, of course. But it still seems worth noting. Jamaica may be a longshot for 2022, but you could certainly see their pool looking more attractive to multi-eligible players ahead of 2026, when he'll be right around the theoretical prime of his career.

    Ideally, he keeps progressing and stakes a strong claim to a U.S. spot. He's off to a good start!
     
    Athlone repped this.
  21. Dave Marino-Nachison

    Jun 9, 1999
    While we're at it, I can think of at least two other '00 attackers, both provisionally cap-tied to the U.S., who are theoretically eligible for two other countries. What a time to be alive.
     
    ussoccer97531 and Winoman repped this.
  22. Sandon Mibut

    Sandon Mibut Member+

    Feb 13, 2001
    I just feel obligated to point out that the majority of the USMNT pool and the USYNT pool is eligible for another national team besides the US.

    I mean, more than half the players Berhalter has capped were either born abroad or have at least one foreign-born parent.

    Then look at the players we want to cap - Akinola, Bello, Busio, Dike, Sabbi, etc - and most of them have multiple national team options.

    I'm not saying these guys will play for other national teams. I am saying that this is very common, we're bound to lose a few of them, especially as the threshold for playing for the US gets higher, and tracking all of them will drive a man insane.
     
  23. Dave Marino-Nachison

    Jun 9, 1999
    I mean, you either find this interesting or you don't. You do you.

    The premise of this thread, however, isn't simply that some guys are eligible for more than one country, which, duh. It's that for reasons including in particular the move to a 48-team World Cup field in 2026, it's probably reasonable to expect more players of note to contemplate switches than we might have seen before, not just with regard to the U.S. and CONCACAF, but worldwide.

    Since this thread started, there have also been reforms to the switching rules that may turn out to have a meaningful effect.

    And then there's the coronavirus, which has surely affected movement as well, perhaps in a few different ways, and will surely continue to do so. If you're a youth player at a "big" nation whose YNT competition gets cancelled, might you be more inclined to take a MNT callup from a country a level or two down? I don't know, but I could see it happening.
     
  24. BostonRed

    BostonRed Member+

    Oct 9, 2011
    Somerville, MA
    Club:
    New England Revolution
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    The Catch*22 (to steal from another YA thread) is that the players who get the earliest opportunities in Europe are the ones with EU/EEA passports. When it was mostly us competing against Germany, it was pretty easy to figure out which camp they fall into, but as the "risk" is spread across more countries (and we have a larger pool), we'll lose some to the "better or faster" question.

    And African countries will present a big issue with some players influenced by parents' desires and the ability to walk into many of the teams right away. Of course, that is balanced by the hubris that accompanies many of the African teams.
     
  25. Dave Marino-Nachison

    Jun 9, 1999
    Given how proactively the U.S. seems to be recruiting players these days, I thought it might make sense to try to catalog the guys who, as far as we know, are of some degree of reputation that might make them of interest in the near term, are not currently connected to the program (or recently were more strongly connected to another program), and aren't super-young.

    Here's a list that cuts off at 2004, using that YOB as shorthand for guys who will be no younger than 18 in 2022.

    Who's missing? What's incorrect? (For example, I wasn't sure off the top of my head about some guys' reported connections to/interest in or from the U.S., or whether either Tillman is provisionally tied to Germany.) See sheet for more:

    Alves Sergio
    Austin Brandon
    Ayari Hassan
    Balogun Folarin
    Froling Nils
    Holguin Hector
    Malone Maurice
    McEntee Oisin
    Mighten Alex
    Munoz Santiago
    Okoh Bryan
    Pieirie Kik
    Rios Rocco
    Sandler Philippe
    Sanogo Malick
    Sonora Alan
    Tillman Malik
    Tillman Timothy
    https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1DfGSI_Z8IpbNKdk-Iw7L8vcHNoPwDH_SrVIFCS24pYc/edit?usp=sharing
     
    dougtee repped this.

Share This Page